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Featured The New Eve; "the mother of my Lord" [Luke 1:43]

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by JoeT, Sep 23, 2019.

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  1. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    Hello, I’m a Catholic, a Roman Catholic. Catholics do not believe man is created evil but cursed by the act of one man and one woman, Adam and Eve. Both the punishment and the guilt of their sin are inherited for being in the tribe of men, unlike others we do not receive this curse genetically (i.e. 'sin nature').

    If you believe in the Trinity then you are obliged by faith to believe that the Blessed Virgin Mary must be Immaculate and the mother of God as an imperative to Christianity (beyond papal decree). As you know, the Holy Trinity is God the Father, God the son, and God the Holy Spirit; three Persons in perfect unity of one essence, that of God. The Logos, Jesus Christ, is One of Person with two natures perfectly and inseparably joined, God/Man. Christ is God (the uncreated and the creator of all things) and we know he was born of woman, i.e. humanity – wholly God and wholly man. The prophecies of the Old Testament tell of God's plan that the Messiah is be God (uncreated) born of woman (creature). Thus, according to God's revealed plan Christ can only be wholly the perfect God, and perfectly a whole man when born of woman who is the new Eve – having never known sin, i.e. the Immaculate Mary. She becomes the Ark of the New Covenant. Thus to deny the Blessed Virgin Mary as Immaculate, or as the mother of God, mother of the Living Grace, or as the mother of your redemption, or as the mother of your salvation, is to deny Christ as God/man thereby failing to acknowledge Christ is the Theandros.

    Consequently, true faith makes the improbable conclusion obligatory; bringing us to a Woman whose child is the perfect union of both God and man. Mary literally and metaphorically (symbolically) is full of grace, mother of God, mother of our redemption. So we quite comfortably adore her.

    “Hail, holy Queen, Mother of mercy, hail, our life, our sweetness and our hope. To thee do we cry, poor banished children of Eve: to thee do we send up our sighs, mourning and weeping in this vale of tears. Turn then, most gracious Advocate, thine eyes of mercy toward us, and after this our exile, show unto us the blessed fruit of thy womb, Jesus, O merciful, O loving, O sweet Virgin Mary! Amen.”

    This is why to discern the true faith in Jesus Christ we can look first to the others views of the Virgin Mary. No other faith, other than the one true faith of Jesus Christ acknowledges the mother of God. Like St. Liguori says, "we acknowledge [Mary the mother of God] for that beautiful aurora, which was always resplendent with the divine light; that chosen ark of salvation, safe from the common shipwreck of sin; for that perfect and immaculate dove, as thy divine spouse declared thee; that enclosed garden, which was the delight of God; that fountain sealed up, which the enemy never entered to trouble; finally, that spotless lily, which thou art, springing up among the thorns of the children of Adam; for whereas all are born defiled with original sin, and enemies of God, thou wast born pure, all spotless, and in all things a friend of thy Creator.”

    Surely the Baptist holds Mary in the same light?

    (I noticed there was no designation for ‘Catholic’ except non-Baptist)

    JoeT
     
  2. Adonia

    Adonia Well-Known Member
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    The Eastern Orthodox hold her in great esteem.
     
  3. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    "So we quite comfortably adore her." This is to say you give her the same worship as God, is it not? Is that what you meant?
     
  4. Adonia

    Adonia Well-Known Member
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    Not really. They hold her merely as a vessel, something that was used and then discarded.
     
  5. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    mary was a person, same as all other humans. She lived & died same as everyone else. She is not divine. Her soul is in paradise, same as all the souls of the other righteous dead. She does not know, nor does she care about what's happening here.

    She was not a perpetual virgin. She had at least 6 other children, conceived in the usual manner.
     
  6. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    So when you die you are in a soul sleep limbo land? Or will you be alive in heaven, in Christ?
     
  7. Walpole

    Walpole Well-Known Member

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    Verse please.
     
  8. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    I know people like that! They are your friend and buddy until they get all they want then discard you like a hot potatoe. So you think God is self-absorbed treating those who worship him like trash? That doesn't seem to be the case in Scripture, can you give some examples from the Sacred Scripture?

    JoeT
     
  9. Oseas3

    Oseas3 Active Member

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    Let's talk the truth for the good of all. What is the use of honoring Mary and dishonoring God the Father, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ? JESUS says: How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?(John 5:v.44)

    What is the consequence of this cult of idolizing Mary? By the way, we must know, and be sure, that Mary died and is waiting her resurrection of this last Day, the seventh and last Day or seventh and last millennium. Yeah, what is the consequence of this idolater cult of Mary?

    Remember that for this reason and the idolatrous tendencies within the church of Rome, dominated by the emperor of the Roman Empire and his possible successors, Apostle Paul wrote to the Romans warning them of the consequent punishments of the practice of idolatry. And which are or how sound these terrible punishments, according to the warning of Paul the Apostle to the Romans?

    Romans 1:v.18&21-32
    18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
    21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
    22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
    23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

    24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
    25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

    26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

    27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

    28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

    29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

    30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

    31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

    32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.


    The same religious leaders and followers of them which created and worship the image of Mary, mother of JESUS, are the same ones that have fallen into the practice of pedophilia within their Churches and other serious sins worthy of death, as punishments expressly revealed by the God's Word above.

    Therein lies the idolatry and depravity within of the Churches of religious Gentiles and of their followers around the world as it was in Sodom and Gomorrah.


    Revelation 13:v.8-9
    8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship the Beast, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

    9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
     
  10. Oseas3

    Oseas3 Active Member

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    Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth - or approves - Rom.14:v.22.
     
  11. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    Did I say she was 'Divine', anything else but creature. Our Lord is King of heaven and earth, consequently are in the same Kingdom. We pray to Mary to intercede on our behalf with Jesus Christ just as we would ask our neighbor to pray for us to intercede on our behalf. If we are to become adopted sons and daughters of God, then Christ is our brother which makes Mary our mother in a spiritual sense. It would be a very hard hearted mother who doesn't care about her children.

    Jesus Christ cares what happens here, as does Mary His mother.

    JoeT
     
  12. Oseas3

    Oseas3 Active Member

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    It is interesting that the spiritists invoke the deads in their cults like the king Saul made, and all the high hierarchy of the Roman Catholic Church and their followers also invoke the deads and call them in their prayers like a disguised spiritism. They are lost.
     
  13. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    I can't speak to the Eastern Orthodox but I believe you are correct.

    JoeT
     
  14. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    That's good advise isn't it? We shouldn't or should do those things against our faith driven conscience that are simply driven by peer pressure. To do so condemns us.

    JoeT
     
  15. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    JoeT your posts have a familiar "ring" to them. :)

    BTW Mary - the mother of our LORD's humanity is a model of courage and devotion to us all.
    Can't worship her and I'm sure she is horrified (should she know) when people do,
     
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  16. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    I haven't said anything about the worship of Mary and would be equally horrified of those who give her the same honor due only God.

    JoeT
     
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  17. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    my bad and that's good to know Joe.
     
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  18. JoeT

    JoeT Member

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    Do you think the Mother of Jesus Christ is dead? Like all those in heaven doesn't she have eternal life? Or is heaven the end of it all; we die on earth only to die in heaven?

    JoeT
     
  19. loDebar

    loDebar Well-Known Member

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    Mar 6:3

    Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him.
     
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  20. Walpole

    Walpole Well-Known Member

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    That verse says nothing about Mary having six other children.

    In Jewish antiquity, "brother(s)" had a much wider meaning than we moderns use. There is NO scripture which identifies another as a son (or daughter) of Mary. Thus, any claim that Jesus had uterine siblings is one completely foreign to Scripture and the regula fidei of Christianity.
     
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