Featured Subtlety of wrong doctrine.

At no time did I even allude to Jones keeping Rice in line.

Nor did I present any specifics of the conflicts between the three.

Rather I focused on the very beginnings. One distanced himself, and the other did also after the foxes had grown intolerable.

The rest can be researched as you have done.

I was merely using an account you would know about rather than dragging something out of what you would not be appraised.

The focus was on how dangerous little foxes become, not on the particulars and specifics of the maturity and health of them.

 

No, John.

The NT presents consistently that Christ came to fulfill, and to that end, it was recorded over and over the validation of His authority in such statements as, this was said or this was done that it might fulfill what was spoken.

What was NOT reveal and Christ presented during His time here and through the early work of the Apostles was the earthly outreach building of the heavenly Kingdom in which we call the church would not only include the Jews but Gentiles with full rights and privelages. That is exactly what I pointed out early in the discussion that Paul states in Colossians 1.

Now, it remains that the song takes the word "mystery" from the proper use and applies it to that which was NOT hidden.

There was no secret concerning His birth. Parent a virgin, born in Bethlehem, flee and return from Egypt...
There was no secret concerning His ministry and miracles. He calmed seas, quieted storms, confronted religious leaders, fed, healed, ...
There was no secret concerning His death. Lifted up on a tree, bruised with bones out of joint, vision marred,
There was no secret concerning His burial. Borrowed tomb, descending to minister to those held in paradise, ...
There was no secret concerning His resurrection nor the promise of His return and establishment of the Kingdom on earth, the conditions of nature, the land scapes, ....

Peter's sermon verifies this prior revealing, by quoting:

25David says about Him:

‘I saw the Lord always before me;
because He is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
26Therefore my heart is glad
and my tongue rejoices;
my body also will dwell in hope,
27because You will not abandon my soul to Hades,
nor will You let Your Holy One see decay.
28You have made known to me the paths of life;
You will fill me with joy in Your presence.’d​

See, my point all along is that the song presents an error proclaiming "mystery" to what is not a mystery and in doing so not placing the mystery In which the deacons (in Timothy) are charged with continuing.

What I would like for you to do is merely take the lyrics and present some line, even a phrase that was not foretold and revealed by the ancients in the OT. That in fact some part of that song is actually based on the truth that it was all a mystery that no one knew about, and that was never part of the prophetic statements.

Seems to me that is a rather simple request.

If this became a topic of your classroom, how would you actually prove by use of the song itself that what you posit is reliable?

Perhaps it may become one, someday.

hmmm

for now.

 

“A Devine secret.”

Not any of the statements in the song were a “Devine secret.”

“...something above human intelligence,” but the magi understood. The rulers new, and the old man of the temple knew, John the Baptist new, Mary knew, ....

Neither the first nor the coming advent is “above human intelligence.”

Your own definition fits just fine in that which I gave.

A mystery is something yet to be revealed, whether hidden by God or man.

There was no divine secret concerning the Christ that the prophets did not fore tell.

If there were, by now certainly you would have better than quoting that line. For the “mystery” that the song is not that presented in 1 Timothy 3.

Rather, if you had merely read the previous verses you would see the writer is discussing the church.

14I hope to come to you soon, but I am writing these things to you so that, 15if I delay, you may know how one ought to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, a pillar and buttress of the truth. 16Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness:

Hee was manifested in the flesh,
vindicatedf by the Spirit,g
seen by angels,
proclaimed among the nations,
believed on in the world,
taken up in glory.​

The mystery, according to Paul, secret, hidden from human intellect is the church.

 

Not what the song is about.

I see that in order to justify your view, you are attempting to apply factors unrelated to the lyrics.

You need to refocus upon the fact that nothing in the song was not presented prior to the first advent.

John states that "We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth" but John in no place presents that as the mystery. Neither does Paul. I demonstrated that your presentation of 1 Timothy was about the church.

.

If the definition is consistent in both accounts, there is no carelessness. Are you not trying to draw distinction where there is none? Is not the "mystery" whether originating with God or man hidden and unrevealed?

John, you are missing the mark. The "mystery of Godliness" is that the church is made up of people that are the adopted heirs, that God is IN them, and therefor their actions must reflect that very Godly glory that Christ did while on this earth and is not risen as we shall be and He is now glorified as we shall be.

The focus is upon the redeemed - the church. Paul is discussing the church, and you are missing the emphasis if you shift the focus of why he wrote of the incarnation.

If the "mystery" were the incarnation, then the prophets would not have specified that the messiah would be considered as God. Therefore, the incarnation was not a mystery. Rather, "He came into His own and His own received Him not." They knew who he was, just as in the parable of the owner sending his very son, and the workers recognized him and slew him thinking there would be no retribution. The incarnation was NOT secret. "
14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel."


Have great success at the mission conference!

 

For the readers:


I ran across this list of Old Testament prophecies fulfilled concerning the Christ. It is not exhaustive, but is a good start. It is taken from: (List of Old Testament prophecies fulfilled by Jesus). Note: use of the site does not come with full endorsement of all materials found there.

It presents the Bible prophecy reference, the summery of statement, and the NT fulfillment reference.

1
Gen. 3:15a
He would be human, born of a woman
Gal. 4:4-5, Matt. 1:18
2
Gen. 3:15b
He will reconcile people to God
Heb. 2:14, 1 John 3:8
3
Gen. 3:15c
He would crush evil at his own expense
Matt. 27:35, Luke 24:39-40
4
Gen. 22:18
He would be a descendant of Abraham
Matt. 11:27 & Luke 3:36
5
Gen. 26:1-5
He would be a descendant of Abraham's son Isaac
Rom. 9:7, Heb. 11:18, Matt. 1:2
6
Gen. 28:13,14
He would be a descendant of Isaac's son Jacob
Luke 3:34
7
Gen. 49:10
He would be a descendant of Jacob's son Judah
Matt. 1:2-3
8
Isa. 11:1-10
He would be a descendant of Jesse, a descendant of Judah
Matt. 1:2-3
9
Isa. 11:1
He would be a descendant of Jesse's son King David
Matt. 1:1
10
Gen. 49:10
He would appear after a succession of rulers from the Tribe of Judah
History: Josephus writes that King Herod's son was dethroned in 6 A.D. and replaced by a Roman Procurator.
11
Dan. 9:25
He would appear after the rebuilding of Jerusalem
History: Jerusalem had been rebuilt by the time of Jesus, after recovering from the Babylonian destruction.
12
Dan. 9:26
He would appear before the (Roman) destruction of Jerusalem
History: The Rom. destroyed Jerusalem in 70 A.D.
13
Mic. 5:2
He would be born in Bethlehem
Matt. 2:1-5
14
Isa. 7:13,14
Isaiah foreshadowed the virgin birth of Jesus
Luke 1:35
15
Isa. 7:14
He would be called Immanuel (God with us)
Matt. 1:23
16
Isa. 40:3–4
He would be preceded by a forerunner
Matt. 3:1-4
17
Mal. 3:1
A messenger would prepare the way for the Lord
Matt. 7:10
18
Isa. 61:1,2a
The ministry of Jesus is foreshadowed by Isaiah
Matt. 3:16-17, Luke 4:18, John 8:31-32, Luke 4:19
19
Isa. 9:1,2
He would appear in Galilee, be a light to Gentiles
Matt. 4:12-17, Luke 2:28-32
20
Isa. 35:4-6
He would perform miracles
Mark 10:51-52, Mark 7:32-35, Matt. 11:4-5, Matt. 12:10-13, Matt. 9:32-33
21
Ps. 78:1–2
He would teach in parables
Matt. 13:3, 13-15
22
Deut. 18:15-18
God promised another prophet like Moses
John 6:14, John 5:45-47, John 8:28-29, Acts 3:23, Heb. 6:4-6
23
Isa. 42:2-3
He would be humble, meek
Matt. 11:28-30
24
Ps. 2:1-12
He would be called God's son
Acts 4:25-28
25
Isa. 9:6,7
Isaiah spoke of a son who would be called God
John 10:30, John 20:27-29
26
Zech. 9:9
He would enter Jerusalem while riding on a donkey
Matt. 21:6-9
27
Ps. 41
Psalm 41 foreshadowed the betrayal of Jesus
John 13:18
28
Isa. 53:1-4
He would be rejected
Matt. 27:21-23
29
Dan. 9:24-26
Daniel predicted when he would be rejected
Matt. 16:21; 21:38-39
30
Ps. 22:6
Messiah would be despised
Luke 23:21-23
31
Isa. 53:7
He would be oppressed
Matt. 27:27-31
32
Isa. 53:7
He would be silent before his accusers
Matt. 27:12-14
33
Ps. 22:7
Messiah would be mocked by people shaking their heads
Matt. 27:39
34
Isa. 50:6,7
He would be beaten and spat upon
Matt. 26:67
35
Isa. 50:6,7
He would be spat upon
Matt. 27:30
36
Ps. 35:19
He would be hated without reason
John 15:25
37
Ps. 69:4
He would be hated without cause
John 15:25
38
Ps. 69:8
He would become a stranger to his own brothers
Luke 8:20-21
39
Isa. 53:12
He would be 'numbered with the transgressors'
Luke 23:32
40
Ps. 22:16
His hands and feet would be pierced
John 19:37, 20:27
41
Ps. 22:15
His suffering would include thirst
John 19:28
42
Isa. 53:12
He would intercede for sinners
Luke 23:34
43
Ps. 22:1
He would be forsaken
Matt. 27:46
44
Ps. 22:1
He would cry out to God
Matt. 27:46
45
Ps. 22:8
His faith in God would be mocked
Matt. 27:43
46
Ps. 22:17-18
He would be stripped of his clothing
Luke 23:34-35
47
Ps. 22:18
They would cast lots for his clothing
Matt. 27:35, John 19:23
48
Isa. 53:4-6
He would suffer for the sins of others
2 Cor. 5:21
49
Isa. 53:8,9
He would die
Matt. 27:45-56
50
Ps. 22:14
His death described
John 19:34
51
Zech. 12:10
Zechariah foreshadowed the piercing of Jesus
John 19:34-37
52
Dan. 9:24
He would bring an end to sin
Gal. 1:3-5
53
Isa. 53:9
He would be buried in a wealthy man's tomb
Matt. 27:57-61
54
Ps. 16:9–11
God's anointed one would not see decay
Acts 2:31
55
Zech. 10:4
He would be the cornerstone
Eph. 2:20
56
Ps. 118:22-24
The rejected stone would become the cornerstone
Matt. 21:42,43
57
Ps. 16:8-11
King David prophesied about resurrection
John 20:9
58
Job 19:25-27
Job foreshadows details of resurrection
John 5:24-29
59
2 Sam. 7:12–13
King David’s offspring would have an eternal kingdom
Luke 1:32, Rev. 22:16
60
2 Sam. 7:16
King David's throne would be established forever
Luke 3:31; Rev. 22:16
61
Ps. 89
Another prophetic promise about the permanence of David's throne
Luke 1:32,33
62
Dan. 7:13–14
Son of Man would have everlasting throne
Luke 1:31-33
63
Isa. 11:10
He would be a banner to Gentiles
John 12:18-21
64
Isa. 42:1-4
He would affect people throughout the world
Matt. 28:19,20
65
Isa. 42:6
He would be a light to people around the world
Luke 2:32
66
Mic. 5:4
He would have a worldwide impact
History: Christianity has spread to people all over the world.
67
Gen. 49:10b
He would receive the obedience of the people
History: Christianity has spread to people all over the world.
68
Isa. 49:6
He would bring salvation to the ends of the earth
History: Christianity has spread to people all over the world.