Turning His back on Jesus

[JonShaff]

It's also my opinion (developed through a diligent study of the Scriptures) that God never took His eyes off of His Son on the cross and delighted in His obedience the entire time.

Job 36:7
He does not take his eyes off the righteous

 

[Yeshua1]

Did God the Father, actually turn his back on Christ, while the sin of the entire world was on him?

Second Death, lake of Fire, will be eternal separation from God, and yes, Jesus experienced that on the Cross!

 

[th1bill]

Did God the Father, actually turn his back on Christ, while the sin of the entire world was on him?

Hoooo, Trooper! Hi Salty, my favorite answer to this question lies in the ancient customs of the Paleo Hebrew through, at least, the First Century Believing Jew. I learned in the process of coming to know YHWH through His Holy Scriptures and my, admittedly weak study of their customs from that period. And I came to understand that it was not uncommon for the Jewish Believer to invoke this or that Psalm with the reciting of the opening verse, as we call it today. Looking back to Yashuah ha'Mashiah hung upon that vile cross that means so much to men and women, like ourselves, and with very little effort we discover Yashuah invoking Psalm 22. There lies the answer. YHWH despises every individual sin that He heaped upon His son for the Perfect Redemption of Mankind. The Father cannot stand sin but He always loves His Son.

 

[JonShaff]

Second Death, lake of Fire, will be eternal separation from God, and yes, Jesus experienced that on the Cross!

This is what i would call heresy.

not only is what you stated unbiblical, it is anti-scriptural.

 

[George Antonios]

That would be Jesus (Colossians 1:15, 2:9).

That would be God the Father up in the third heaven, even before incarnation, as well.
At least if you go by what the word of God says.

 

[JonShaff]

In so much that Jesus cries out "My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?"

A point my pastor pointed out on Good Friday:
Jesus suffered in a way I cannot imagine and which I never have to go through. He cries out to God about being forsaken, but that very Cross means I was never forsaken, even as an unbeliever.

I still don't believe this is a sentiment of Scripture--"Christ was forsaken so i won't be." The Biblical Truth is, "Because even when Christ was on the cross receiving the penalty for sin for us, not being forsaken by the Father (even though He may have "felt" forsaken), i know i will never be forsaken." Christ is the righteous Son in whom the Father delights--and He treats us IDENTICALLY because we've been made sons and daughters. Even in the darkest hours of our life, God will never forsake us, because He did not forsake His Son.

 

[37818]

and having cried with a loud voice, Jesus said, 'Father, to Thy hands I commit my spirit;' and these things having said, he breathed forth the spirit. Luke 23:46
The night before that above was said, Jesus was in the garden praying and the following is said about that; Who in the days of his flesh, having offered up both supplications and entreaties to him who was able to save him out of death, with strong crying and tears; (and having been heard because of his piety Heb 5:7 DBY

What would think that says? To thy hands I commit. I shall be placing the spirit of me. Just what do you believe, the spirit of him, did for the flesh and made him soul with life? See Lev 17:11 for the soul of the flesh is in the blood; and I have given it to you upon the altar to make atonement for your souls, for it is the blood that maketh atonement for the soul.--- What is in the blood? Is it the spirit of the breath of lives from God?
For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. Heb 10:4 -- The blood that contains, the breath of the spirit of lives.

I do not believe the atonement for the soul could take place until whatever it is that is in the blood that makes the flesh soul living, departs.I do believe that is the spirit from God.

What is finished is the mission for which the Son was sent, obedience unto death> Heb 5:7.8 Phil 2:8

egkatelipes egkatelipes G1459 vi 2Aor Act 2 Sg YOU-abandonED you-did-forsake

I know, no Greek. So I ask; Is that past tense, present tense or past and on going?

Atonement required death and salvation required life out of death.

IMHO Jesus the only begotten Son died for our sins and was dead, the spirit of him being in the hands of the Father, for three days.

or I delivered to you first, what also I did receive, that Christ died for our sins, according to the Writings, and that he was buried, and that he hath risen on the third day, according to the Writings, 1 Cor 15:3,4
Paul, an apostle -- not from men, nor through man, but through Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who did raise him out of the dead -- Gal 1:1
and if the Spirit of Him who did raise up Jesus out of the dead doth dwell in you, He who did raise up the Christ out of the dead shall quicken also your dying bodies, through His Spirit dwelling in you. Rom 8:11

And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? --- ἐγκατέλιπες --- From ἐν (G1722) and καταλείπω (G2641) Matt 27:46

Jesus gave up his spirit a minute or so after that. He died. Died in being somehow associated with Hades. For;

“he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption. Acts 2:31 κατελείφθη Once again G2641

Was not forsaken to Hades.

What about the three days and three nights in between?

Paradise was the upper compartment of Hades until after Jesus resurrection and 40 days latter ascension to Heaven when He moved Paradise there.

 

[37818]

It's also my opinion (developed through a diligent study of the Scriptures) that God never took His eyes off of His Son on the cross and delighted in His obedience the entire time.

Job 36:7
He does not take his eyes off the righteous

True.
Christ was forsaken for sins for whom He died. That does not mean the Father took His eyes off His Son. God is omnipresent. And His Son never ceased being the Creator, Hebrews 1:3.

 

[JonShaff]

True.
Christ was forsaken for sins for whom He died. That does not mean the Father took His eyes off His Son. God is omnipresent. And His Son never ceased being the Creator, Hebrews 1:3.

Psalm 37:25
I have been young, and now am old; Yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, Nor his seed begging bread.

Especially true of Christ!

Psalms 37:28
For the LORD loves justice and will not forsake His saints. They are preserved forever, but the offspring of the wicked will be cut off.

Psalms 94:14
For the LORD will not cast off his people, neither will he forsake his inheritance.

 

[percho]

Psalm 37:25
I have been young, and now am old; Yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, Nor his seed begging bread.

Especially true of Christ!

Psalms 37:28
For the LORD loves justice and will not forsake His saints. They are preserved forever, but the offspring of the wicked will be cut off.

Psalms 94:14
For the LORD will not cast off his people, neither will he forsake his inheritance.

I have ?'s concerning the above.

What is the righteousness of God?

The soul that sins, it shall die.

God the Father took the Holy One, conceived of a virgin, out of Spirit and brought forth Holy, who learned, the obedience, that is being obedient unto death even the death of the cross and laid on him the iniquity of us all, actually as 2 Cor 5:29 says, for him who did not know sin, in our behalf He did make sin.

Why? Is it so the soul who did no sin could actually die for our sins?

Would it be the righteousness of God, that after three days and three nights he would to give life again to the Holy One who had given his life for us? For he the Holy One to inherit the promise of God?

Now consider the Word of God.

and to Abraham were the promises spoken, and to his seed; He doth not say, 'And to seeds,' as of many, but as of one, 'And to thy seed,' which is Christ; and this I say, A covenant confirmed before by God to Christ, the law, that came four hundred and thirty years after, doth not set aside, to make void the promise, for if by law be the inheritance, it is no more by promise, but to Abraham through promise did God grant it. Why, then, the law? on account of the transgressions it was added, till the seed might come to which the promise hath been made, having been set in order through messengers in the hand of a mediator -- and the mediator is not of one, and God is one -- he law, then, is against the promises of God? -- let it not be! for if a law was given that was able to, make alive, truly by law there would have been the righteousness, Gal 3:16-21

Jesus was made alive out of the dead by Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle -- not from men, nor through man, but through Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who did raise him out of the dead --
Jesus inherited the promise of God made before the world began. Jesus inherited Romans 6:9 knowing that Christ, having been raised up out of the dead, doth no more die, death over him hath no more lordship;

The righteousness of God came through the resurrection of the Son of God therefore, we may become the righteousness of God in him.

 

[37818]

Psalm 37:25
I have been young, and now am old; Yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, Nor his seed begging bread.

Especially true of Christ!

So are you denying Christ bearing our sins for a time, per Psalms 22:1, Matthew 27:46, Mark 15:34, Isaiah 53?

 

[percho]

Paradise was the upper compartment of Hades until after Jesus resurrection and 40 days latter ascension to Heaven when He moved Paradise there.

For me to buy the above you are going to have to show me, from scripture, where Paradise and or the garden of God is in captivity.

wherefore, he saith, 'Having gone up on high he led captive captivity, and gave gifts to men,' --

What singular thing that had held under captivity did Jesus capture. Was it not death. Rom 6:9 and Heb 2:15

BTW while researching for my answer I found a song I have not heard and critique of the song you might find interesting.

Death Was Arrested Lyrics
North Point InsideOut – Death Was Arrested

 

[JonShaff]

So are you denying Christ bearing our sins for a time, per Psalms 22:1, Matthew 27:46, Mark 15:34, Isaiah 53?

Are you insinuating He became unrighteous at any time?

1 Peter 3:18
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit.

 

[37818]

For me to buy the above you are going to have to show me, from scripture, where Paradise and or the garden of God is in captivity.

wherefore, he saith, 'Having gone up on high he led captive captivity, and gave gifts to men,' --

What singular thing that had held under captivity did Jesus capture. Was it not death. Rom 6:9 and Heb 2:15

BTW while researching for my answer I found a song I have not heard and critique of the song you might find interesting.

Death Was Arrested Lyrics
North Point InsideOut – Death Was Arrested

Few facts. Jesus went to Paradise, Luke 23:43. Jesus' soul was not left in Hades, Acts of the Apostles 2:27-31.
And death is not done away with until the Judgment, Revelation 20:14.

 

[37818]

Are you insinuating He became unrighteous at any time?

Not at all. He was forsaken because He actually had placed on Himself our sins, Isaiah 53:6, 2 Corinthians 5:21, ". . . For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; . . "

 

[HankD]

haven't read every post but if you saw Franklin Graham on TV Easter morning and heard his message he affirmed that the Father turned away from His Son momentarily as He could/would not look.

 

[JonShaff]

Not at all. He was forsaken because He actually had placed on Himself our sins, Isaiah 53:6, 2 Corinthians 5:21, ". . . For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; . . "

He became a sin "Offering" for us. He didn't become sin, that does not make any sense.

Isaiah 53:10
10 But it was the Lord’s good plan to crush him
and cause him grief.
Yet when his life is made an offering for sin,
he will have many descendants.
He will enjoy a long life,
and the Lord’s good plan will prosper in his hands.

 

[JonShaff]

haven't read every post but if you saw Franklin Graham on TV Easter morning and heard his message he affirmed that the Father turned away from His Son momentarily as He could/would not look.

and i believe that is a false narrative that we have created. It is not found in Scripture.

 

[MB]

He became a sin "Offering" for us. He didn't become sin, that does not make any sense.

Isaiah 53:10
10 But it was the Lord’s good plan to crush him
and cause him grief.
Yet when his life is made an offering for sin,
he will have many descendants.
He will enjoy a long life,
and the Lord’s good plan will prosper in his hands.

Did Christ take our sin on Him Self? Did Christ Pay for our sins . Did Christ take our place and punishment for our sins?
MB

 

[MB]

haven't read every post but if you saw Franklin Graham on TV Easter morning and heard his message he affirmed that the Father turned away from His Son momentarily as He could/would not look.

What scripture did he use to support that the Father turned and could not look?
MB