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Featured World 3:16

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Iconoclast, Apr 27, 2020.

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  1. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Word games. Man could make a choice except for the fact he cant make a choice. If you really believe that, just agree with the term puppet.
     
    #81 Reynolds, May 2, 2020
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
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  2. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Again,

    My observation is Scripture (verses have already been provided) deal with men as having free will but in bondage to the flesh, darkness, sin or slaves to Christ, the Spirit, righteousness.

    Your argument is not biblical but by definition philosophical. That does not make it a bad argument (I like Edward's argument of the will).

    There is no need for you to engage in ad honinem or insults because I disagree with you.

    Please check your emotions and slow down your meltdown. Deal with what I have posted (the passages and teaching I have provided) rather than insulting me simply because I have dared to disagree with your post.
     
    #82 JonC, May 2, 2020
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  3. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Bless your heart JonC

    Repeating these ideas does not make them so..

    1]Check my emotions??/ they are just fine!:Cautious

    2]slow down my meltdown??? are you speaking of my laundry in the dryer?:Sick.

    3] you disagree:Redface bless your heart!:Wink

    4] deal with what you posted??? I did, they do not mention free will. They do not teach it. I gave two or 3 links to reynolds...you might enjoy them.
    Have a nice day JonC:Smile
     
    #83 Iconoclast, May 2, 2020
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  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Since Iconoclast has insulted me I am leaving it to the Administrators to deal with his foolishness.

    I also feel sorry for him. Based on his posts he seems to be a bitter hateful man.

    If this is the result of Calvinism in his life then people need to be very careful about entertaining the theology.
     
    #84 JonC, May 2, 2020
  5. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I did not say you had to agree with me. The issue is you never addressed anything I posted but went strait to ad hominem and insults in a classic meltdown before the entire baptist board.

    All I am saying is those passages I rovided to you present men as having free will but slaves to either the flesh/ darkness/ sin or to Christ/ the Light, the Spirit/ righteousness.

    That the discussion of free will is philosophical is a fact (it is philosophical by definition, as is a discussion of our "natures").

    You are welcome to disagree. I do not mind that at all. But I do not know why you are adament to engage in ad hominem and insults. I did not treat you that way.

    My experience is those who have such emotional breakdowns when their beliefs are challenged do not truly understand their own views.

    You should not have a meltdown everytime I, or anyone else, disagrees with you and does not conceded that you are correct. People can disagree without devolving into childish tantrums.
     
    #85 JonC, May 2, 2020
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  6. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    JonC,

    I

    Where do you believe you saw such a meltdown, I do
    not recall this at all??:Cautious:Cautious:Cautious:Cautious
    Perhaps you have confused my post with someone else?:Sick
     
    #86 Iconoclast, May 2, 2020
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  7. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I believe your meltdown started when I disagreed with you. Since then you have continued to insult me and attack me personally rather than deal with my disagreement with you and the passages I provided.

    You posted repeated ad hominem and insults simply because I dated to challenge your statement.

    That you have had another meltdown (perhaps not as bad as some of your previous tantrums) is obvious to the Baptist Board. And it was unnecessary.

    I simply disagreed with you and provided Scripture as to why. I did not insult or attack you. You broke down and attacked me personally on the public forum.

    That said, I suppose someone could have hacked your account and posted all of those insults. Review your posts and let me know if that childishness was your words or someone using your account.
     
    #87 JonC, May 2, 2020
  8. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    JonC,
    .
    Could you show this "meltdown"?


    .

    Could you show this???

    Do you remember what Covenantor said?

    [​IMG]
    CovenanterWell-Known Member
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    JonC - you are referring to Martin but without quoting anything Martin has said - only making statements about Martin without foundation in this thread. You need reporting to another moderator.

    Jon, it's the sort of argument that goes along the lines -
    "You belief THAT - you therefore believe what follows according to MY logic. Therefore you are a heretic."

    We need to listen to what others SAY, not what WE HEAR, with our prejudiced hearing.

    Not at all JonC....not sure where you are getting such an idea.

    There was no meltdown JonC.....go have a coffee , perhaps decaf...it will be okay?

    Not at all John;
    Sorry you feel that way. It just has not happened as you are suggesting.

    Once again, bye bye JonC...have a nice life.
     
    #88 Iconoclast, May 2, 2020
  9. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    Was the coming of the Son of Man foreordained before the man (singular) was created?
    Was the Son of Man foreordained as the redeemer before the man (singular) was created?

    After all is said and done, will not all, who have been born of the flesh, their end be, as in the image of the first Adam or in the image of the last Adam?

    In other words either the first Adam was going to sin and bring about the need for redemption or there was not going to be a need for redemption.

    IMHO it wasn't, if, the first Adam sinned. He was going to sin.

    Also IMHO this would only be so, if there were mitigating circumstances, which I believe to be so.

    That is, the sin of the devil, which I believe preceded the creation of the man. The sin of the devil would be taken cafe of through the creation of the man and the Son of Man coming in the image of the man.

    Adam IMHO did the will of his creator. The clay was in the Potters hand. Question? Did someone need to be Judas.
     
    #89 percho, May 2, 2020
  10. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    I will read it s-l-o-w-l-y for, #4 I AM NOT SMART ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND THE DOCTRINES OF GRACE.

    No, I didn't miss that part. That was in reference to believers after they die and go to Heaven.

    This phrase applies to believers that are still alive and on earth:

    by his grace alone enables him freely to will and to do that which is spiritually good; yet so as that by reason of his remaining corruptions, he doth not perfectly, nor only will, that which is good, but doth also will that which is evil.


    Did you miss that? Read that slowly, so you can understand it.
     
    #90 InTheLight, May 2, 2020
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  11. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    You are trying to make a case that is once again a falsehood....bearing false witness. This is not working . Your slander and opinion of me is noted...Go away JonC.
     
    #91 Iconoclast, May 2, 2020
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  12. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    That's cute. If I don't call you on the phone so I can get berated, I am not seeking the truth.

    It's a moot point, for how can I call on him in whom I have not heard the number?

    Don't bother giving me your number I will not call.
     
    #92 InTheLight, May 2, 2020
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  13. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    And *61 blocks a number. Remember that, @InTheLight, should you call :Laugh.

    I made that mistake once. :(
     
    #93 JonC, May 2, 2020
  14. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    I had given it to you once before. Why would you think I would berate you?
    I simply said if you want to hear and know the truth to call....You do not have to, but then do not say things without knowing the full story my friend...If you want my number I will send a pm....if you change your mind.
     
    #94 Iconoclast, May 2, 2020
  15. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Ladies and gentlemen, I want to welcome you to Iconoclast's thread about "John 3:16"!
     
    #95 InTheLight, May 2, 2020
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  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    My case is that Scripture describes men as having free will but slaves to the flesh or the spirit. Scripture deals with desire, not will, in this context.

    That is not slander at all. Everyone can see that you responded with ad hominem and insults.

    I have nothing to do with that. You had an emotional tantrum. That was all you.
     
    #96 JonC, May 2, 2020
  17. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    the OP is ...world/ 3:16
     
    #97 Iconoclast, May 2, 2020
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  18. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Perhaps it should be "Iconoclast's Calvinistic philosophy 101". :Laugh

    (kidding.... Of course)
     
    #98 JonC, May 2, 2020
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I lean toward the belief everything is predestined.

    Edited - Actually, I more than lean towards that view. I absolutely believe everything is predestined.
     
    #99 JonC, May 2, 2020
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  20. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    Icon's faults notwithstanding, the same could be said of some of yours, ITL.
    I have no idea how you get away with some of what you do, and still think that you are obeying the Lord in your conduct.

    Some examples from this very thread:
    This one is termed, "hypocrisy", and I believe that you object to this sort of treatment under # 5 in your signature.
    Despite your complaints about people doing it to you, you seem to enjoy doing it to them when it suits you.

    That brings me to a friendly suggestion...
    When you're tempted to respond in kind, don't.;)

    I also encourage you to remember this:

    " And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise." ( Luke 6:31 )

    ...And to remember that as God's children, we are not to do the things that the Lord will judge the lost for, because we enjoy His forgiveness and eternal favor.
    This one is called, "ironic sarcasm".

    It's generally used by people who disagree with someone else, but think they are better than the one they are disagreeing with.
    I know it very well, having used it many times myself, to my shame.

    I'd like to think that I'd never be tempted to do it again, but I cannot guarantee it.
    I'll keep trying not to, despite being tempted on occasion.:)
    This one is called "mocking", and again, I'd like to direct your attention to the Scriptures:

    " Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." ( Matthew 7:12 ).



    So, @InTheLight , do you find yourself objecting to poor treatment at the hands of those you disagree with?
    Then keep in mind that you do it as well, and rest in the fact that God, in His patience, not only commands us as believers not to respond in kind, but that He is very patient with your faults and failures.;)


    May God bless you sir, by reminding you of what He has done for you when He sent His Son to the cross.
     
    #100 Dave G, May 2, 2020
    Last edited: May 2, 2020
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