Featured Could the New Birth Have Been Known About Pre-Incarnation?

If Old Testament saints had a conceptual understanding of spiritual regeneration it was not taught after Melchizedek.
Therefore from Adam to Noah to Shem scripture does not emphasize spiritual regeneration as we know it from the New Testament. However, I do believe that Jews did consider themselves saved by grace alone because of David’s writings.

This brings me to the Mosaic Law Code of 613 commandments. Paul in his letter to the Galatians explained how the law kept saved men like David and Isaiah in a perpetual state of spiritual immaturity. Because the law did not provide removal of one’s sins the OTS had his sin ever before him, the animal sacrifices merely covered them.

David and company were as very much saved as we are (and he knew it), but the law for David slew him and he couldn’t reach spiritual adulthood. God in his wisdom and for his own glory purposefully required David and company to attempt to keep an unkeepable set of commandments.

Today as saved brothers we are to keep a new set of commandments and these are detailed in the letters of the New Testament. Just like the OTS’ we too are saved by grace alone but our laws in the Law of Liberty, Law of Christ have no self destructive elements due to our sin nature that will keep us from living out our born again lives for Christ. We simply confess to God the sin we committed and God is faithful to forgive that sin as well as all of our sinning we forgot about during the day.

I think that is why the new birth understanding was hidden from Israel prior to the cross. Angels observe our behavior in the local churches. Angels obviously observed the OTS activities and their observances of the different laws God have to his saved people during the different ages of the history of man.

 

I’ll try and look it up.

 

Circumcision of the heart IS the new birth.

 

Its clear without the resurection no one was ' born again ' until then . So knowing about it and it happening are two different things .

 

Maybe known but not available until after the resurrection.

 

Its clear without the resurection no one was ' born again ' until then . So knowing about it and it happening are two different things .

 

Hi SGO, I have not read past your opening post.

Here are some of the OT citations that Jesus might have been referring to:

Isa 44:3 ‘For I will pour out water on the thirsty land, And streams on the dry ground;
I will pour out My Spirit on your offspring And My blessing on your descendants; (NASB)

Here the New Covenant in His blood is being foreshadowed.

Ezekiel 37:9 (NLT) Then he said to me, “Speak a prophetic message to the winds, son of man. Speak a prophetic message and say, ‘This is what the Sovereign LORD says: Come, O breath, from the four winds! Breathe into these dead bodies so they may live again.’”

Here new life (i.e. being born anew) is foreshadowed.

Prov 30:4-5. Here both the coming Christ and salvation within Him are foreshadowed.

But more broadly, the myth that because a person was "born a Jew" (a descendant of Abraham) they were saved is being addressed. All through the OT, we see blood line Jews lost because of non-belief. Dying in the wilderness for example. No, a Jew had to obtain new life through faith in God, and Nicodemus should have know this. One more, Ezekiel 47:22 teaches those not of the blood line shall be allotted a share.

 

Or, Genesis 3:15: "15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."

 

DOCTRINAL DIVINITY ~ BOOK IV

OF THE ACTS OF THE GRACE OF GOD TOWARDS AND UPON HIS ELECT IN TIME

Chapter 1: Of the Manifestation and Administration of the Covenant of Grace:

1. First, The agreement there is between them.


1a. THE OLD TESTAMENT & THE NEW TESTAMENT Manifestations and Administrations of GOD'S ONE ETERNAL Covenant of Grace:
agree in the efficient cause, God: the covenant of grace, in its original constitution in eternity, is of God, and therefore it is called his covenant, being made by him; "I have made a covenant--my covenant I will not break", #Ps 89:3,34 and whenever any exhibition or manifestation of this covenant was made to any of the patriarchs, as to Abraham, David, &c. it is ascribed to God, "I will make my covenant--he hath made with me an everlasting covenant", #Ge 17:2 2Sa 23:5 so the new covenant, or new administration of it, runs in this form, "I will make a new covenant", &c. #Heb 8:8.


1b. THE OLD TESTAMENT & THE NEW TESTAMENT Manifestations and Administrations of GOD'S ONE ETERNAL Covenant of Grace: Agree in the moving cause, the sovereign mercy, and free grace of God, which moved God to make the covenant of grace at first, #Ps 89:2,3. And every exhibition of it under the former dispensation, is a rich display of it, and therefore it is called, the "mercy promised to the fathers" in his "holy covenant", #Lu 1:72 and which has so largely appeared in the coming of Christ, which is ascribed to "the tender mercy of our God", that "grace" and "truth", in the great abundance of them, are said to come by him; by which names the covenant of grace, under the gospel dispensation, is called, in distinction from that under the Mosaic one, #Lu 1:78 Joh 1:17.



1c. THE OLD TESTAMENT & THE NEW TESTAMENT Manifestations and Administrations of GOD'S ONE ETERNAL Covenant of Grace Agree In the Mediator, who is Christ; there is but one Mediator of the covenant of grace, let it be considered under what dispensation it will; even Christ, who under the former dispensation was revealed as the seed of the woman that should bruise the serpent's head, and make atonement by his sufferings and death, signified by the expiatory sacrifices, under the law; the Shiloh, the peaceable One, and the Peace Maker, the living Redeemer of Job, and of all believers under the Old Testament. Moses, indeed, was a Mediator, but he was only a typical one.

There is but "one Mediator between God and man, the Man Christ Jesus"; there never was any other, and he is the "Mediator of the new covenant", #1Ti 2:5 Heb 12:24.



1d. THE OLD TESTAMENT & THE NEW TESTAMENT Manifestations and Administrations of GOD'S ONE ETERNAL Covenant of Grace: Agree in the subjects of these covenants, or administrations of the covenants of grace, the elect of God, to whom the blessings of it are applied. It was with the chosen people of God in Christ, the covenant of grace was originally made; and according to the election of grace are the spiritual blessings of it dispensed to the children of men, #Ps 89:3 Eph 1:3,4 so they were under the former dispensation, from the beginning of the world, to the seed of the woman, in distinction from the seed of the serpent; to the remnant according to the election of grace among the Jews, the children of the promise that were counted for the seed; and election, or elect men, obtain the blessings of the covenant in all ages, and under the present dispensation, more abundantly, and in greater numbers.



1e. THE OLD TESTAMENT & THE NEW TESTAMENT Manifestations and Administrations of GOD'S ONE ETERNAL Covenant of Grace: Agree in the blessings of it; they are the same under both administrations.

Salvation and redemption by Christ is the great blessing held forth and enjoyed under the one as under the other, #2Sa 23:5 Heb 9:15.

Justification by the righteousness of Christ, which the Old Testament church had knowledge of, and faith in, as well as the new, #Isa 45:24,25 Ro 3:21-23.

Forgiveness of sin through faith in Christ, all the prophets bore witness to; and the saints of old, as now, had as comfortable an application of it, #Ps 32:1,5 Isa 43:25 Mic 7:18 Ac 10:43.

Regeneration, spiritual circumcision, and sanctification, were what men were made partakers of under the first, as under the second administration of the covenant, #De 30:6 Php 3:3.

Eternal life was made known in the writings of the Old Testament, as well as in those of the New; and was believed, looked for, and expected by the saints of the former, as of the latter dispensation, #Joh 5:39 Heb 11:10,16 Job 19:26,27.

In a word, they and we eat the same spiritual meat, and drink the same spiritual drink, for they drank of that Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ, #1Co 10:3,4.


Chapter 2: Of the Covenant of Grace in the Patriarchal State

Chapter 3: Of the Covenant of Grace under the Mosaic
Dispensation

Chapter 4: Of the Covenant of Grace in the Times of David
and the Prophets

Chapter 5: Of the Abrogation of the Old Covenant

Chapter 6: Of the Law of God

Chapter 7: Of the Gospel

 

2. Secondly, In some things there is a disagreement between these two administrations of the covenant of Grace.



2a. Under the first administration saints looked forward to Christ that was to come, and to the good things that were to come by him, and so were waiting, expecting, and longing for the enjoyment of them; but under the second and new administration, believers look backwards to Christ as being come, before whose eyes he is evidently set forth in the word and ordinances, as crucified and slain; and they look to the blessings of the covenant through him as brought in; to peace, pardon, atonement, righteousness, redemption, and salvation, as wrought out and finished.



2b. There is a greater clearness and evidence of things under the one than under the other; the law was only a shadow of good things to come; did not so much as exhibit the image of them, at least but very faintly. The obscurity of the former dispensation, was, signified by the veil over the face of Moses, when he spoke to the children of Israel; so that they could not see to the end of what was to be abolished; whereas, believers under the present dispensation, with open face, with faces unveiled, behold, as in a glass, the glory of the Lord clearly and plainly, #Heb 10:1 #2Co 3:13,18 then, comparatively, it was night, now broad day; the day has broke, and the shadows are fled and gone.



2c. There is more of a spirit of liberty, and less of bondage, under the one, than under the other; saints under the one differed little from servants, being in bondage under the elements of the world; but under the other are Christ's freemen, and receive not the spirit of bondage again, to fear; but the spirit of adoption, crying Abba, Father; which is a free spirit, and brings liberty with it; and for this reason the two different administrations of the covenant, are signified, the one by Hagar, the bondwoman, because it gendered to bondage, and those under it were in such a state; and the other by Sarah, the freewoman, an emblem of Jerusalem, which is free, and the mother of us all, #Ga 4:1-3,24-26 Ro 8:15.



2d. There is a larger and more plentiful effusion of the Spirit, and of his gifts and graces, under the one than under the other; greater measures of grace, and of spiritual light and knowledge were promised, as what would be communicated under the new and second administration of the covenant; and accordingly grace, in all its fulness and "truth", in all its clearness and evidence, are "come by Jesus Christ", #Joh 1:17 see #Jer 31:31-34.



2e. The latter administration of the covenant extends to more persons than the former. The Gentiles were strangers to the covenants of promise, had no knowledge nor application of the promises and blessings of the covenant of grace, except now and then, and here and there one; but now the blessing of Abraham is come upon the Gentiles, and they are fellow heirs of the same grace and privileges, and partakers of the promises in Christ by the gospel, #Eph 2:12 3:6 Ga 3:14.



2f. The present administration of the covenant of grace, will continue to the end of the world*; it will never give way to, nor be succeeded by another; it is that which remains, in distinction from that which is done away, and so exceeds in glory: the ceremonial law, under which the former covenant was administered, was "until the time of reformation", until Christ came and his forerunner; "The law and the prophets were until John", the harbinger of Christ, the fulfilling end of them; see #2Co 3:11 #Heb 9:10 Lu 16:16.

(*Hint: God DID NOT "INTRODUCE" an Entire Series of Star Wars Movies, from the PAST or The FUTURE, once He got out into the symbolic revealation of The Book of Revelation. THERE IS NO NEW NEWS PRESENTED IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION.

GOD'S ADMINISTRATIONS OF THE COVENANT OF GRACE (1ST & 2ND, OLD & NEW) ARE NOT GOING TO FLY OFF THE HANDLE AND HAVE JESUS FLYING TO AND FRO, Preaching to Jews, IN PERSON, because Hardsheel Baptist's won't.

The Present Administration of the Covenant of Grace, will continue to The End of the World*; is also a confirmation of the 66 times The New Testament Teaches The Imminant Second Coming of Jesus Christ, as The End of The World.

9.0.0 > NT Intro iv: SIXTY-SIX NEW TESTAMENT Verses Teach The SECOND COMING of JESUS CHRIST & THE END of TIME.

If you think a 'mill' is involved in The End Times, which could END FOREVER, TODAY, it is NOT because it can NOT be shown, or read, or taught from The BOOK.

Just as this is, also, confirmation: The Present Administration of the Covenant of Grace, will continue to The End of the World*

NO GOING BACK TO MOSES SACRIFICES and NO, REVELATION HAS NOT ALREADY HAPPENED.

MAY JESUS REBUKE SATAN.

The Scofield Bible—The Book That Made Zionists of America’s Evangelical Christians
By Maidhc Ó Cathail
Washington Report on Middle East Affairs

“For a nation to commit the sin of anti-Semitism
brings inevitable judgement.”



—The New Scofield Study Bible



2g. The ordinances of them are different. The first covenant had ordinances of divine service; but those, comparatively, were carnal and worldly, at best but typical and shadowy, and faint representations of divine and spiritual things; and were to continue but for a while, and then to be shaken and removed, and other ordinances take place, which shall not be shaken, but remain to the second coming of Christ; and in which he is more clearly and evidently set forth, and the blessings of his grace, #Heb 9:1,10 12:27.



2h. Though the promises and blessings of grace under both administrations are the same, yet differently exhibited; under the former dispensation, not only more darkly and obscurely, but by earthly things, as by the land of Canaan, and the outward mercies of it; but under the latter, as more clearly and plainly, so more spiritually and nakedly, as they are in themselves spiritual, heavenly, and divine; and delivered out more free, and unclogged of all conditions, and so called "better promises", and the administration of the covenant, in which they are, a "better testament"; God having "provided" for New Testament saints some "better thing", at least held forth in a better manner; that Old Testament saints might not be "made perfect" without them, #Heb 8:6 7:22 11:40.