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Biblical Repentance and the gospel of John

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37818

37818

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
Can you read? Mark 1.15 says first REPENT!
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What is the argment I am making? The word translatied "repent ye" presedes "believe" in Mark 1:15.
37818 said:
Without biblical repentance belief is impossible.
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How is my argument false?
Again John does not report the usage of the term. Because belief is impossable without it. Romans 10:17 does not use that term either.
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
37818 said:
". . . be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, . . ." Hear this, conversion is impossible without a changed mind. Throw out your unBiblical view of "repentance."
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Here it is in full

New King James Version Acts 3:19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord,
 
Mikey

Mikey

Active Member
To seperate Faith and Repentance is foolish. One cannot have repentance without faith, nor faith without repentance. There is no such thing as unrepentant faith.
 
37818

37818

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
Here it is in full

New King James Version Acts 3:19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord,
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How can one be converted without first a changed mind? μετανοησατε
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
37818 said:
How can one be converted without first a changed mind? μετανοησατε
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to change one's mind in relation to sin, as it is used with forgiveness in the Bible. The two going together as two sides of the one coin, so to speak! As Psalm 38:18 says, which the NLT rightly has it, "But I confess my sins; I am deeply sorry for what I have done". This is true repentance!
 
A

AustinC

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
this is nothing more than "Reformed theology", and NOT Bible! Read John 16:1-10 and see that "the world" of sinners is "convicted" by the Holy Spirit, some will reject as in Acts 7:51, while others will accept. Human "will" has not been destroyed completely at the fall, as some would have us believe!
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Do you reject Ephesians 2?
How do people who are dead in sin, repent of sins they don't believe are sins?
Why would God need to make a person alive if, by repentance, a person could make themselves alive?

John 16:1-11
“I have said all these things to you to keep you from falling away. They will put you out of the synagogues. Indeed, the hour is coming when whoever kills you will think he is offering service to God. And they will do these things because they have not known the Father, nor me. But I have said these things to you, that when their hour comes you may remember that I told them to you. “I did not say these things to you from the beginning, because I was with you. But now I am going to him who sent me, and none of you asks me, ‘Where are you going?’ But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. Nevertheless, I tell you the truth: it is to your advantage that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. And when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment: concerning sin, because they do not believe in me; concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father, and you will see me no longer; concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

Please show us where the ungodly repent in this passage you used as a prooftext.

Jesus differentiates between "you" (his disciples) and they (those who don't believe). Notice what "they" will do.

They will put you out of the synagogues. Indeed, the hour is coming when whoever kills you will think he is offering service to God.
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Is the entire world convicted...every single person from the least to the greatest? Has every single person heard the good news of Jesus? If they hear it do they repent?

Ironically, you preach saved by works. What is your definition of grace?
 
V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
37818 said:
The use of the instruction "to repent" is not reported in the gospel according to John.
John 5:24, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life."
Without biblical repentance belief is impossible.
Biblical repentance always precedes faith, Mark 1:15.
Now in John's letter, 1 John 1:8-9, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." Now this promise is not to the lost person but to the one who is already saved. Someone who has the Spirit of truth in them.
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Here in the above post, we have a very common misconception of the gospel.

Just what significance is to be placed on the premise the gospel of John does not "report" repentance before believe. To formulate the correct understand of scripture, all of scripture must be incorporated. Thus to "believe" whether "repent" appears in every text, includes the idea that trusting fully in God means we turn from trusting ourselves and going our own way.

And yes, those born anew, thus having life eternal, still are commanded to confess our sins. Not to sustain our eternal salvation, but to bring focus upon what we need to change to become more Christ-like. When we, by our own estimation sin and miss the mark, we need to strive to change and do a better job of following the will of God. However, because we are "in Christ" God continuously forgives our every "sin" such that from His perspective it is just as if we never sinned. (Justification to life!!)
 
Mikey

Mikey

Active Member
SavedByGrace said:
The issue is what is repentance
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  • The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary defines repentance in its fullest sense as "a complete change of orientation involving ajudgment upon the past and a deliberate redirection for the future."
  • Rpentance is to make a change of mind, heart, and action, by turning away from sin and self and returning to God.
Do you agree with these definitions?
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
AustinC said:
How do people who are dead in sin, repent of sins they don't believe are sins?
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the Holy Spirit's conviction in the sinners heart, but the sinner can reject this. no one can ever repent in and of themselves, they must be convicted first. Paul says that faith comes through hearing the Gospel Message being preached (Romans 10:17). see what Acts 26:28 says, "Then Agrippa said to Paul, “Can you persuade me in such a short time to become a Christian?”. and Paul's response, "Short time or long,” Paul replied, “I wish to God that not only you but all who hear me this day may become what I am, except for these chains.”. Notice how Paul did not only want Agrippa to be saved, but ALL who heard his message, which shows that universal aspect of the Gospel and Death of Jesus Christ!
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
Mikey said:
Rpentance is to make a change of mind, heart, and action, by turning away from sin and self and returning to God.
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this is what the Bible says, not as some Reformed would have us believe, that repentance is no more than a change of mind on how a person viewed God before, and then after, with nothing to do with "repentance for the forgiveness of sins", as Jesus says in Luke 24:47!
 
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