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Forget the KJB. Is there any version that you believe is perfect?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by George Antonios, Feb 2, 2021.

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  1. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Note from below that the translations are in agreement with each other, it is the actual text that conflicts and not the translation.
    • [Mat 1:16 KJV] 16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 NKJV] 16 And Jacob begot Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 NLT] 16 Jacob was the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary. Mary gave birth to Jesus, who is called the Messiah.
    • [Mat 1:16 NIV] 16 and Jacob the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary, and Mary was the mother of Jesus who is called the Messiah.
    • [Mat 1:16 ESV] 16 and Jacob the father of Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom Jesus was born, who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 CSB] 16 and Jacob fathered Joseph the husband of Mary, who gave birth to Jesus who is called the Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 NASB] 16 Jacob was the father of Joseph the husband of Mary, by whom Jesus was born, who is called the Messiah.
    • [Mat 1:16 NET] 16 and Jacob the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary, by whom Jesus was born, who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 RSV] 16 and Jacob the father of Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom Jesus was born, who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 ASV] 16 and Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 YLT] 16 and Jacob begat Joseph, the husband of Mary, of whom was begotten Jesus, who is named Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 DBY] 16 and Jacob begat Joseph, the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
    • [Mat 1:16 WEB] 16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.


    • [Luk 3:23 KJV] 23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed ) the son of Joseph, which was [the son] of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 NKJV] 23 Now Jesus Himself began [His ministry at] about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) [the] son of Joseph, [the son] of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 NLT] 23 Jesus was about thirty years old when he began his public ministry. Jesus was known as the son of Joseph. Joseph was the son of Heli.
    • [Luk 3:23 NIV] 23 Now Jesus himself was about thirty years old when he began his ministry. He was the son, so it was thought, of Joseph, the son of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 ESV] 23 Jesus, when he began his ministry, was about thirty years of age, being the son (as was supposed) of Joseph, the son of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 CSB] 23 As he began his ministry, Jesus was about thirty years old and was thought to be the son of Joseph, son of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 NASB] 23 When He began His ministry, Jesus Himself was about thirty years of age, being, as was supposed, the son of Joseph, the son of Eli,
    • [Luk 3:23 NET] 23 So Jesus, when he began his ministry, was about thirty years old. He was the son (as was supposed) of Joseph, the son of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 RSV] 23 Jesus, when he began his ministry, was about thirty years of age, being the son (as was supposed) of Joseph, the son of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23 ASV] 23 And Jesus himself, when he began [to teach], was about thirty years of age, being the son (as was supposed) of Joseph, the [son] of Heli,
    • [Luk 3:23-24 YLT] 23 And Jesus himself was beginning to be about thirty years of age, being, as was supposed, son of Joseph, 24 the [son] of Eli, the [son] of Matthat, the [son] of Levi, the [son] of Melchi, the [son] of Janna, the [son] of Joseph,
    • [Luk 3:23 DBY] 23 And Jesus himself was beginning to be about thirty years old; being as was supposed son of Joseph; of Eli,
    • [Luk 3:23 WEB] 23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, who was [the son] of Heli,





     
  2. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    @Conan ---> ALL Bibles are corrupt, NONE of them are perfect, the word of God has errors.

    And the serpent and every humanistic atheist and every Muslim says to him: "amen"!

    NEXT!
     
  3. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Exactly what is the point of this thread???

    and I would be interested in your answer for the question in post # 20
     
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  4. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    The point is the expressly stated question in the OP:

    I would be interested in your answer to the question in the OP.

    I would gladly answer the question in post #20 in the appropriate thread if you wish.
     
    #24 George Antonios, Feb 2, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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  5. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Well, I guess you don't want to answer then
     
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  6. xlsdraw

    xlsdraw Active Member

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    Nor do you
     
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  7. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    because at this time, I dont have an answer.
     
  8. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    So, to recap:

    You question the point of my thread despite a clear-cut question in the OP.
    You imply I'm avoiding a question.
    But you don't answer the question in the OP.
    I clearly offer to answer it in the right thread and your judgment is: "Well, I guess you don't want to answer then"
    However, it's totally cool that you don't answer the question in the OP, and it's only because you don't have an answer at the moment (not because you don't want to), which is a seemingly honest reply, and I respect that, but you should have been as generous with me as you were with yourself by not saying that I don't want to answer, especially when I offered to answer it in the right thread.

    How is all that just in any way?

    Truly, the perfect Bible issue is a spiritual hiccup for people, not an intellectual one.
     
  9. Logos1560

    Logos1560 Well-Known Member
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    You do avoid questions that are asked you while you seem to try to hide behind invalid questions that assume premises that you have not proven to be true. You should prove that the Scriptures back up your assumptions.
     
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  10. Logos1560

    Logos1560 Well-Known Member
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    Acknowledging the scriptural truth that an error introduced by men is not the word of God is not at all saying that the word of God given by inspiration to the prophets and apostles has errors.

    Are you rejecting the scriptural truths that teach that words added by men and errors introduced by men [whether copiers, printers, or translators] are not the word of God?
     
  11. Logos1560

    Logos1560 Well-Known Member
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    Before your question deserves any consideration, it is up to you to prove that the Scriptures teach that a Bible translation [made after the completion of the New Testament] is given by direct inspiration of God.

    If you do not prove your own assumption or premise to be true and scriptural, your question is invalid.

    An invalid question is not clear-cut as it incorrectly assumes something that has not been proven to be true and scriptural.
     
  12. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    I normally stay clear of this topic, but I want to ask a question:
    Is/was the apostle Paul in danger of hell fire? ...

    ...but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.[Matthew 5:22, KJV].

    But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die [1 Corinthians 15:35-36 KJV].
     
  13. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    "You guys aren't so much against the inerrancy of the King James Bible as you are against the inerrancy of any Bible anywhere, in any tongue, in any version, of any age."

    really, and who told you that? It is very clear that you don't even understand what the term "inerrancy" means! You must be deluded if you suppose for a moment, that the KJV is 100% perfect and without any "errors". Your argument and reasoning are both MOOT!
     
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  14. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    Not particularly a KJV issue, since most Bibles have fool in these places. For examples:

    CSB: But I tell you, everyone who is angry with his brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Whoever insults his brother or sister, will be subject to the court. Whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be subject to hellfire.
    MOUNCE: But I say to you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; and whoever says to his brother, ‘Raka,’ will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire.
    NASB: But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be answerable to the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be answerable to the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.

    CSB: You fool! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies.
    MOUNCE: You fool! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies.
    NASB : You fool! That which you sow does not come to life unless it dies;

    Do you think the original writers got it wrong as well?
     
  15. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    No translation is given by 100% inspiration. That would only be the original manuscripts. You are merging several topics here though. Inerrancy, Infallibility, Original Content, Reliability.

    Can we be confident in the English translations we have to day communicates the message of the inspired Word of God? YES. I have full faith in the KJV, ESV, NASB, and several others.

    Are the translations themselves inspired? Absolutely not.
     
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  16. Logos1560

    Logos1560 Well-Known Member
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    The word of God had been translated into English many years before 1611.

    The Church of England makers of the KJV referred to the pre-1611 English Bibles as being "the word of God" even though they had imperfections or errors and even though they made hundreds or thousands of changes to the pre-1611 word of God translated into English. They did not claim that the pre-1611 English Bible was 100% given by inspiration even though they still called it "the word of God."

    George Antonios, does a consistent, just application of your own allegation accuse the KJV translators of holding a position that "is antichristian, and is of the serpent, not the Holy Ghost"?
    If not, you would demonstrate that you are guilty of the use of unjust divers measures [an abomination to the LORD].

    Do the KJV translators expose that the reasoning behind your question is wrong?
    In their preface to the 1611, the KJV translators stated: “No cause therefore why the word translated should be denied to be the word, or forbidden to be current, notwithstanding that some imperfections and blemishes may be noted in the setting forth of it. For whatever was perfect under the sun, where apostles or apostolike men, that is, men indured with an extraordinary measure of God’s Spirit, and privileged with the privilege of infallibility, had not their hand? The Romanists therefore in refusing to hear, and daring to burn the word translated, did no less then despite the Spirit of grace, from whom originally it proceeded, and whose sense and meaning, as well as man’s weakness would enable, it did express.”

    Your question (if valid) would also apply to before 1611 if it supposedly applies today. The fact that you will not apply your own question to before 1611 would be evidence that it is an invalid question.
     
    #36 Logos1560, Feb 3, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2021
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  17. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Which "perfect" are you asking about, George? A perfect, word-for-word translation that captures all bubtleties & nuances of the sources being translated? There's none.

    A perfect thought-for-thought translation that is as much word-for-word as possible? That's just about any translation, older or newer, that is made with accuracy, not profit, in mind.

    One man's goof may be another's translation with good intentions, sych as adding "the brother of" to certain verses that mention Goliath's bros.

    "Variety of translations" does not always mean goofs & booboos, given the vast number of original-language words in Scripture that have multiple English meanings. Remember, the AV makers wrote that "variety of translations is profitable for the finding-out of the sense of the Scriptures."

    So, to answer your question, there are several English translations that are as perfect as man can make them, such as NKJV, NASV, & ESV, to name a few.

    (BTW, there's no such Bible version as a "KJB".)
     
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  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I just wish he and others who hold to the KJVO could point out to us just what major doctrine has been corrupted and watered down when we use say the Nas or the Nkjv insterad of the Kjv!
    And still waiting on which Kjv edition and TR text id ther correct and perfect one?
     
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    all 3 of those are the English word of God to us....
     
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Only Apostles and those under them were inspired by the Holy Spirit, and jesus told us that Himself!
     
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