SavedByGrace
Well-Known Member
It is argued by some, that, if God were to “will, desire, or wish” for something, then this will always happen. And, if it does not, then somehow it is seen as a “failure” on God’s part.
Using this line of argument, verses like 1 Timothy 3-4, and 2 Peter 3:9, which speaks of the “will, desire”, of God, in the salvation of the lost, it is assumed that because God so “desires or wills” “every human being”, to be “saved”, then they “must” be. But, as we know that “every human being”, will not be saved, then God’s “will or desire”, has been “wasted” or a “failure”. This is used to “prove” that God’s “desire/will” cannot mean for “every human being”, and therefore must be taken to mean “the elect”.
“This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth” (1 Timothy 2:3-4)
θέλω , “to will, be willing, wish, desire”
“The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you,a]"> not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance” (2 Peter 3:9)
βαύλομαι, “to will, wish, desire, purpose, be minded, implying more strongly than θέλω”
Then we have passages like that in Ezekiel;
“Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? ...For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord God; so turn, and live.” (Ezekiel 18:32)
חפץ, “to will, to desire”
In the context it is very clear, that God is speaking about wicked, sinful people, who reject His Ways and Laws. Yet God says of these people, that He does not “will/desire” their eternal death, but, rather that they should “turn” (repent) and live eternally! Now, just because many of these people would still have rejected the Ways of the Lord, and not “turned” to Him in repentance, does this mean that somehow God has failed?
Paul in writing to the Thessalonians, urged them to live holy lives, and to abstain from all sexual immorality. Paul says to them, that this is the “will of God”.
“For this is the will of God, [even] your sanctification, that ye abstain from fornication” (1 Thessalonians 4:3)
Θέλημα, “that which is willed”
πορνεία, “of illicit sexual intercourse in general”`
This command is for all believers. Likewise Peter says in his Letter, that God Commands all believers to be “holy”, because He is “Holy”. It is not just a suggestion, but tells of the Command from God Himself.
“but as he who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, since it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.” (1 Peter 1:15-16)
“you shall be holy”, having the force of the imperative
There is no doubt that it is the strong “desire/wish/will” of God, that His children are to live godly lives. Yet, we see from Paul’s Letter to the Corinthians, where he speaks of “carnal Christians”, some who were also guilty of incest, etc. We live in a very fallen and evil world, where many Christians, even leaders, are not living godly lives, and some have also “fallen away” from the Faith, because of their sinful lives. It is no doubt as seen from the entire Teaching in the Holy Bible, that it is very much the “desire/wish/will”, of God, that every single human being, did not sin, as God cannot “desire/wish/will”, the opposite! Are we to conclude from this, that, since it is very clear, that Christians do not “abstain from sexual immorality”, which must also include sinful thoughts, and do not live lives that are “holy” are pleasing to God, that somehow because God so “willed” this, and it is not the case, that He has “failed”? Absolutely NOT!
The fact that God DOES “desire/wish/will”, that every single human being were to “repent and believe in the Gospel”, about the Lord Jesus Christ. Does NOT mean, that ALL have to do so, and if they did not, then it is God Who has “failed”! Likewise, when the Bible says that Jesus even shed His Blood for the likes of Judas, which is very clear from Luke 22:20-23, that if these were not saved, because they “would not come to Jesus “(John 5:39-40), that somehow the Blood of Jesus has been “wasted”. This is ABSURD! It is evident from the Teaching of the Bible, that God “desiring” certain things does not mean that they are “definite”.
Using this line of argument, verses like 1 Timothy 3-4, and 2 Peter 3:9, which speaks of the “will, desire”, of God, in the salvation of the lost, it is assumed that because God so “desires or wills” “every human being”, to be “saved”, then they “must” be. But, as we know that “every human being”, will not be saved, then God’s “will or desire”, has been “wasted” or a “failure”. This is used to “prove” that God’s “desire/will” cannot mean for “every human being”, and therefore must be taken to mean “the elect”.
“This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth” (1 Timothy 2:3-4)
θέλω , “to will, be willing, wish, desire”
“The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you,a]"> not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance” (2 Peter 3:9)
βαύλομαι, “to will, wish, desire, purpose, be minded, implying more strongly than θέλω”
Then we have passages like that in Ezekiel;
“Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? ...For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord God; so turn, and live.” (Ezekiel 18:32)
חפץ, “to will, to desire”
In the context it is very clear, that God is speaking about wicked, sinful people, who reject His Ways and Laws. Yet God says of these people, that He does not “will/desire” their eternal death, but, rather that they should “turn” (repent) and live eternally! Now, just because many of these people would still have rejected the Ways of the Lord, and not “turned” to Him in repentance, does this mean that somehow God has failed?
Paul in writing to the Thessalonians, urged them to live holy lives, and to abstain from all sexual immorality. Paul says to them, that this is the “will of God”.
“For this is the will of God, [even] your sanctification, that ye abstain from fornication” (1 Thessalonians 4:3)
Θέλημα, “that which is willed”
πορνεία, “of illicit sexual intercourse in general”`
This command is for all believers. Likewise Peter says in his Letter, that God Commands all believers to be “holy”, because He is “Holy”. It is not just a suggestion, but tells of the Command from God Himself.
“but as he who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, since it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.” (1 Peter 1:15-16)
“you shall be holy”, having the force of the imperative
There is no doubt that it is the strong “desire/wish/will” of God, that His children are to live godly lives. Yet, we see from Paul’s Letter to the Corinthians, where he speaks of “carnal Christians”, some who were also guilty of incest, etc. We live in a very fallen and evil world, where many Christians, even leaders, are not living godly lives, and some have also “fallen away” from the Faith, because of their sinful lives. It is no doubt as seen from the entire Teaching in the Holy Bible, that it is very much the “desire/wish/will”, of God, that every single human being, did not sin, as God cannot “desire/wish/will”, the opposite! Are we to conclude from this, that, since it is very clear, that Christians do not “abstain from sexual immorality”, which must also include sinful thoughts, and do not live lives that are “holy” are pleasing to God, that somehow because God so “willed” this, and it is not the case, that He has “failed”? Absolutely NOT!
The fact that God DOES “desire/wish/will”, that every single human being were to “repent and believe in the Gospel”, about the Lord Jesus Christ. Does NOT mean, that ALL have to do so, and if they did not, then it is God Who has “failed”! Likewise, when the Bible says that Jesus even shed His Blood for the likes of Judas, which is very clear from Luke 22:20-23, that if these were not saved, because they “would not come to Jesus “(John 5:39-40), that somehow the Blood of Jesus has been “wasted”. This is ABSURD! It is evident from the Teaching of the Bible, that God “desiring” certain things does not mean that they are “definite”.