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Featured Reformed V Biblical Salvation

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by SavedByGrace, Jun 16, 2021.

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  1. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    No, it is not.

    What you're describing is a merit-based system where God "paves the way", and all that we as men have to do is to "take Him up on His offer"...
    I'm sorry, but that could not be further from the truth.

    Biblical salvation, which is accompanied by eternal life ( which is to know God and His Son for all eternity ), is completely unconditional... as well as being an unmerited gift;
    It is most definitely not a reward for doing what God requires of us.

    IMO, you're confusing God's prior covenant ( the Law of Moses ) that involved a nationally chosen people,
    with God's present covenant of grace with His spiritually chosen people.

    Again and as in other threads where this has been discussed, salvation by grace does not entail "conditions"...

    It is composed entirely of declarations and necessary evidences ( like spiritual "fingerprints" ) that must be present in a saved person's life;
    These evidences ( for example, faith is one of them ( Hebrews 11:1 )) function as "indicators" of God having performed a miraculous and gracious work in and on a person through no effort of their own.



    May God bless you with His gifts,
    which are worth far more than money, or our efforts, can possibly buy.:)
     
    #21 Dave G, Jun 16, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
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  2. Dave G

    Dave G Well-Known Member

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    Because His chosen people are being born and brought to repentance in each generation.
    For their sake He bears long with those who are not His elect.
    The Greek says "world", not the entire human race.
    See Revelation 5:9 and Revelation 7:9, as well as Romans 9:24 and 1 Corinthians 1:24 for who God's elect are composed of.
    Please read the context for those two verses.
    As an example, in 2 Peter 3:9, the context for the "us-ward" is the "beloved" from verse 8, is it not?

    It's describing His people, not all of mankind.
    That is how I read them for myself, when I take them in context with all the rest of the Bible.
    Amen.

    But what you're describing, based on your own theology, involves man trying to please God by doing what He requires.
    That is works, my friend, and that is what makes up the core of any merit-demerit system;
    Said system is founded upon conditions that we have to meet, or we don't get what we seek.

    Contrary to that type of system,
    Biblical salvation is by grace ( complete lack of merit in any way, shape or form ), not of works, lest any man should boast.


    As always, I wish you well sir, and I will make no further replies in this thread.
    Thank you for the privilege of posting.
     
    #22 Dave G, Jun 16, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
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  3. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    A side question. Can you find a use Greek New Testament where the Greek word kosmos cannot be interpreted to mean mankind?
     
  4. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Acts of the Apostles 17:24. 'God who made the world and everything in it........'
     
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  5. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Very clear Brother to any who can see;)
     
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  6. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    You are attempting to tell God why he does what he does. That is an unwise thing to do.
     
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  7. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    J H Thayer:

    “the inhabitants of the earth, men, the human race. Jn. i.10, 29, iii.16sq”

    W F Arndt and F W Gingrich:

    of all mankind, but especially of believers as objects of God’s love”


    J Parkhurst:

    “the world, i.e., the whole race of mankind, both believers and unbelievers, both good and bad.”

    E Robinson:

    “the world for the inhabitants of the earth, men, mankind. John.1.29, 3:16”

    Hermann Cremer:

    “It denotes the ordered entirety of God’s creation, humanity itself

    The NIV Theological Dictionary of New Testament Words:

    in Jn. kosmos almost always denotes the world of humans, esp. the world of sinful humanity that opposes God, resists the redeeming work of the Son, does not believe in Him

    G Kittel and G Friedrich:

    “All the meanings of kosmos come together in the usage of the Fourth Gospel. Not just the Prologue uses kosmos for the world in the sense of the universe

    W E Vine:

    “the human race, mankind

    A T Robertson:

    The world (ton kosmon). The whole cosmos of men, including Gentiles, the whole human race. This universal aspect of God's love appears also in 2Co 5:19; Rom 5:8”

    M Vincent:

    “The sum-total of humanity in the world; the human race
     
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  8. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    You're arguing a moot point. God loved the kosmos. Let it be. The key phrase in John 3:16 is "whosoever believes", which connotates a particular person from the kosmos believing.
    The Bible is clear that humans do not naturally believe in the redemptive atoning work of Christ Jesus as their only saving hope. God must quicken them to give them faith to believe.

    If humans quicken themselves to believe, then humans are to be congratulated for their own saving efforts. If God quickens then one must ask: Does God quicken all the kosmos or particular people in the kosmos? The answer comes right after John 3:16.

    Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil.

    God either quickens those whom he chooses or humans quicken themselves. sbw, which one is it?
     
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  9. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Regarding Acts 17:24, ". . . God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands; . . .". The Greek en translated as "therein" can also translated as "among" like "and all things among it." . . . και παντα τα εν αυτω . . . .
     
    #29 37818, Jun 17, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2021
  10. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    What are you trying to say
     
  11. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    What Bible says so?And where in that Bible. Is that in 1st yeshua 1 ?.
    MB
     
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  12. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    <sigh> ". . . God that made the humanrace and all things among it, . . ."
     
    #32 37818, Jun 17, 2021
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  13. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Yeah but how does that show the universal Death of Jesus
     
  14. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    It was a side issue.
     
  15. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Nope, John 1:13
     
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  16. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Everyone knows that it's God's will that we all be saved. Which is why we are invited.
    MB
     
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  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    No, more that those who are being saved is due to the will of God that they are chosen in Christ!
     
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  18. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    This is only theology and not biblical
     
  19. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    By your assertion the reader can conclude that God cannot accomplish what he wills since not all will be saved.
     
  20. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    yet again a verse being forced to say something that it most certainly does NOT!
     
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