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Featured Romans 8:6.....What is it getting at.

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Iconoclast, Apr 6, 2022.

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  1. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Six hour warning
    This thread will be closed no sooner than 930 pm EDT / 630 PDT
     
    #201 Salty, Apr 13, 2022
  2. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    "Heaven and earth" is an English idiom meaning "everything" or "without limit" (as in "I will move heaven and earth to be there tomorrow"). So, the KJV is "guilty" of correctly rendering a Hebrew idiom into its English idiom equivalent.

    [You do know that the Earth is not flat and covered by concentric domes, right?]
     
    #202 atpollard, Apr 13, 2022
  3. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    how many translations besides the KJV, translate HEAVEN?

    Genesis 1:1 Parallel: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
     
    #203 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  4. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Irrelevant.
    Translating it "heavens" (plural) more accurately captures the original Hebrew and opens the reader to hints of other layers of truth lost by the English idiom. It is a decision of translator intent: subtlety vs clarity. Where you err is declaring one "wrong" when it merely different.

    [12 ... just to answer your question.]
     
    #204 atpollard, Apr 13, 2022
  5. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    the majority don't!
     
    #205 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  6. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    I agree ... and for a good reason.
     
    #206 atpollard, Apr 13, 2022
  7. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    are you KJVO?
     
    #207 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  8. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    indeed, they know Hebrew grammar, which you seem to miss!
     
    #208 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  9. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Still cannot welcome truth?
    Need to invent your own ideas?
    Where there is life there is hope. Maybe it will happen tomorrow.
     
    #209 Iconoclast, Apr 13, 2022
  10. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, for the ENTIRE HUMAN RACE!
     
    #210 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  11. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    No. I don't even particularly like the translation. I prefer NASB95 as my "go to", but I use lots of different translations ... different horses for different courses. On-line I often select whatever translation is most comfortable to the person I am communicating with. "It is a poor craftsman that blames his tools" ... the translation is just the "tool" at hand. Truth is Truth.

    Laugh. I may be weak in Hebrew grammar, but I have a mastery of English grammar that appears to elude you. So, I rely on the "many counselors" of the various experts in Hebrew grammar whose credentials dwarf yours and mine that were blessed by God to produce the MANY translations of scripture that I can turn to for guidance ... where my proficiency in English serves me well.

    Why did 13 teams of translators, all masters of Hebrew, choose "heaven" over "heavens"? I find it enlightening that in your hubris, you do not even see any need to ask such a question ... for you know better than everyone what God really meant.

    To such a position, my only reply is ... then publish and let your work be peer reviewed.
    I am content with 500 years of translations to draw from and compare one against another. I have no need to "drink the kool-aid" of your Hebrew preeminence.
     
    #211 atpollard, Apr 13, 2022
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  12. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    We offer the gospel to all men, yes.
     
    #212 Iconoclast, Apr 13, 2022
  13. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    really? are you being serious or having a laugh? :Cautious
     
    #213 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  14. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

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    No, not saying that a "free will" view is heresy, as there are many free willed Baptist churches, but Finney seemed to me to teach full pel. and that crosses the line!
     
    #214 JesusFan, Apr 13, 2022
  15. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

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    Here is a honest appraisal, quoting and using Finneys very words and beliefs!
    A Wolf in Sheep's Clothing: How Charles Finney's Theology Ravaged the Evangelical Movement
     
    #215 JesusFan, Apr 13, 2022
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  16. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Completely serious....why would we not offer the gospel to all men?All men are sinners, Jesus saves sinners.
     
    #216 Iconoclast, Apr 13, 2022
  17. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    Then Jesus died for the sins of ALL. The entire human race :Biggrin
     
    #217 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
  18. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    #218 Iconoclast, Apr 13, 2022
  19. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    No.
    He died for All The Father gave to Him, a great multitude of sinners worldwide.
    13 And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.

    14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

    15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

    16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
    They are scattered worldwide.
    All He died for will be saved.
     
    #219 Iconoclast, Apr 13, 2022
  20. SavedByGrace

    SavedByGrace Well-Known Member

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    You contradict yourself :eek:
     
    #220 SavedByGrace, Apr 13, 2022
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