Featured Lapsarianism

What do you mean”without the gospel?”

 

Are you a believer in the Trinity? Well Duty faith wrests the work of regeneration from the Holy Spirit. “To put it bluntly, within the covenant of grace it is the Holy Spirit’s duty to give faith to those for whom Christ died. It is not every man’s duty to appropriate this task to himself…The Holy Spirit will never honour a doctrine that relieves Him of His role or robs Him of His glory.”

 

The Spirit uses the Gospel in preaching, as the power of God unto an experience of Salvation, in a specific event, at a specific time.

There a particular moment when a soul is Saved by God, using the INSTRUMENTALITY of the Word, in the preaching of the Gospel.

At an Appointed Time, by God, the lost sinner is Saved by means of the Spirit and belief in the Gospel, in the Word of God.

The Salvation experience is to be realized by faith - "belief in the truth," through the enabling power of the Spirit, enabling the lost soul in hearing the Gospel and being Born Again.

14 "How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?"

The Gospel is preached, the sinner is Given Repentance and Faith by God, which is the New Birth, and the Saved soul calls on Jesus.

 

Faith as a requirement is not a work meriting salvation which is wholly God's work. Romans 4:1-5.

 

What is the order or sequence of God's actions to bring us spiritually and bodily to Him?

Lets start once again with Ephesians 1:4.

Ephesians 1:4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. ​

Our first question is did God choose us as individuals before creation, or did He choose us corporately as the target group of His redemption plan? Since the Lamb of God was known before creation, God had formulated His Redemption plan, and had chosen His Redeemer, His Lamb of God, before creation. And certainly then, God had anticipated humanity's fall before creation because He formulated a redemption plan for that Fall.

So by the numbers:
1) God formulated His Redemption plan, anticipating the Fall.
2) God chose Logos to be His Redeemer, His Lamb of God
3) In choosing His Redeemer, God chose corporately those His Redeemer would redeem.

All of the above occurred in the order given before creation.

During the creation week:
1) God created humans, male and female.
2) The first people were placed in the garden of Eden, along with the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

After or since the creation week:
1) God allowed Adam to volitionally sin, knowingly violating God's will.
2) God imposed the consequences of Adam's sin upon Adam, Eve, and their descendants - all humanity. The Fall

Between the time of the Fall and Christ's death, but still in the time frame since creation:

1) Old Testament saints gained approval through their faith in God and His promises. This election was individual based on God crediting their faith, such as Abraham's faith, as righteousness. This action did not make those chosen righteous, but set them apart to be made perfect after Christ died. Upon physical death, these OT saints were taken to "Abraham's bosom."

After Christ's substitutionary sacrifice on the cross, but still in the time frame since creation:

1) New Covenant saints, starting with the thief on the day Christ physically died, are taken directly to the Third Heaven, the abode of God.

2) During the interval between Christ's death on Friday and His bodily resurrection on Sunday, Christ took all the OT Saints out of "Abraham's bosom" to the Third Heaven.

3) Now, when God chooses an individual for salvation, God transfers them spiritually into Christ's spiritual body.

4) When Christ returns to earth at His second coming all those chosen according to God's redemption plan, will be raised or changed in the twinkling of an eye, and join Christ in the air, our ultimate sanctification.[/QUOTE]

 

According to Ephesians 4:8, ". . . Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. . . ." Meaning of which can be understood to not to have taken place until His ascension that 40th day after His bodily resurrection.

 

I cannot address what some people may have claimed, based on speculation.

On that Friday, on the day Christ died, Christ and the thief spiritually ascended to the Third Heaven. Some deny this, but it is obviously true. Just read verse 9.

 

Good thing this false tradition isn't a matter of salvation.

Based on Mark 14:12 it was the Nisan 14th, the day before Christ was crucified. The Jewish calendar year 3790.
That day before was a Wednesday on our calendar.

 

LOL, most people see it traditionally.

 

And effectively Scripture itself interpreted traditionally too. Not by what it solely says Biblically. Mark 14:12-16, Exodus 12:6-20.

 

The mainstream view is Christ died on Friday afternoon, and arose Sunday morning. This is not the topic of this thread. We have had several threads kicking around that topic, no need to continue to derail this thread with that issue.

Post #65 presents the sequence of God's actions past, present and future. So the need is to discuss whether that sequence is thought to miss the mark or not reflect some disclosure of scripture.