Featured Juneteenth

And I easily refuted that Scripture, which as I said were admonishments over "menstealers" not "slavemasters".

Slavery in "Bible Times" varies from Israelite slavery practices to Egyptian, Macedonian, Phoenician, Roman, Persian, Assyrian, Nubian, Turkish, German, Celtic, etc.

Of those American Slavery is similar to Roman, Egyptian, and Greek. The New Testament was written in the Roman Empire. It was directly written in the context of Roman, Greek, Egyptian, Persian and more cultures all of which practiced slavery. And in some instances the slavery was practiced like in America and in other it was practiced as it was in Greece where some slaves were educated. In ALL instances God instructs slaves to be dutiful to their masters and masters dutiful to slaves.

Philemon himself was likely a Greek slavemaster while Onesimus was likely an agricultural slave, with an outside chance of being a Helot slave.

 

You will have to come to terms with Leviticus:
"And as for your male and female slaves whom you may have—from the nations that are around you, from them you may buy male and female slaves. Moreover you may buy the children of the strangers who dwell among you, and their families who are with you, which they beget in your land; and they shall become your property. And you may take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them as a possession; they shall be your permanent slaves. But regarding your brethren, the children of Israel, you shall not rule over one another with rigor" Leviticus 25:44-46

 

Romans 6:14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.


That passage you quote is law. It no longer applies. Christ fulfilled it.

The OT law was a schoolmaster, or a tutor, to bring us to Christ. Now that we are in Christ, we are ruled by the Law of Liberty (James2:12 So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty.),
the Law of Love (Romans 13:10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.),
Royal law (James 2:8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.)
Law of Christ 1 Cor 9:21, (and Galatians 6:2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.)

You have to deal with that reality.

 

Once again we seem to have professing Christians unwilling to admit that the slavery in America was a sinful abomination, a disgrace to God. Is this person advocating that he be taken by force and compelled to serve those abuse him?

Why come to terms with the Old Covenant when it is obsolete, why not cite, do unto others as you would have them do unto you?

 

We can always count on you for an answer without any substance....thanks, Van! LOL

 

Joseph's enslavement illustrates that a Sovereign God can use even the sins of mankind to accomplish His perfect plan, rather than an endorsement of slavery. Paul's discussions of slavery appear to apply to enslaved believers, and that they should be faithful and diligent, even to unkind masters, such that the good conduct might be a strong witness for Christ. Again, not (IMO) an endorsement of slavery.

 

1) Lots of people ignore or talk down or talk around the numerous verses in the Bible that teach the sovereignty of God, election, God's choosing, etc. - anything that stops man from being able to take any credit or glory for salvation.

2) Any so-called "gospel" that claims that man, by his supposed libertarian free will, must meet certain conditions in order to be saved, or that claims that Christ did not meet ALL of the conditions for the salvation of God's elect, or that claims that Christ did not complete the salvation of God's elect and that man must complete the job(e.g., "let God save you"), is a false gospel in which there is no salvation.

3) I have not read any of John Calvin's writings. I only know what John Calvin wrote based on some quotes that I have heard or read from other people.

 

I do not believe you tried to indicate "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" as demonstrating enslavement is desired by Christ.

 

Nowhere have I stated that it's an "endorsement of slavery." That's your understanding of what I said, proving once again comprehension is not something common here. I'm finding more and more people like to put their own twist on what others have said, or they totally disregard what was actually stated. The sad fact is that slavery occurs in all societies, either in the past, present, or will happen in the future. God uses it to accomplish his own purposes, and he gives instructions to those who are slave owners, and to the slave themselves if they are believers.

 

Again, Ken...we've got a Calvinism v. Arminian forum. Use it. I see that after an adminstrator of moderator here said something about using that particular forum, you went and posted several threads in the "general" (I believe that was the section) forum to continue to promote the Calvinistic ideology. You say you haven't read anything from Calvin...I find that very hard to believe.

 

Again, I have stated nowhere that slavery is "desired by Christ." yet, he recognized it was a fact of life during his lifetime. The apostle Paul recognized this as well. Again...another "thought" from Van of little or no substance.

 

There is not a "Calvinist gospel". There is not an "Arminian gospel". There is only one gospel of Christ and it is neither "Calvinist" nor "Arminian".

Galatians 1:8-9 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

I was born and raised in the Church of Christ, not exactly a hotbed for reading John Calvin.

 

I am not the one proclaiming "I have stated nowhere" rather than "I stated American enslavement is a disgrace and advocated by anti-Christs."

 

Again...a post trying to absolve yourself...Geesh...go figure. No substance Van...Thanks for proving my point. A really poor refutation on your part.....again. LOL Get back to me when you actually have something to say. And, please feel free to try and prove that I have advocated slavery anywhere and am an "anti-Christ." ::eyes rolling""

 

Everyone knows your post avoids the topic by changing the topic to false charges against me.

I stated my view, see post #26, 31, 39, 44, and 49.

 

And I stated mine...nowhere have I avoidedi or attempted to avoid anything. False accusations from you are the norm from you. Grow up.

 

LOL, still no position stated or specifically referenced.
I think we should celebrate "Freedom Day" on December 6 to commemorate adoption of the 13th Amendment of the Constitution.

 

@AVL1984 posted: "Yet you lean Calvinist in your postings, and that "Gospel" isn't the Gospel I see in the Bible...."Come unto me.."

I am not a Calvinist. I believe that God saves His elect by His sovereign, free grace for His glory according to the gospel of Christ that is taught from Genesis through Revelation.

Who will come?

All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. John 6:37


@AVL1984 posted: "Seems the "Gospel" you're promoting isn't the Gospel in the Bible. "Whosoever" isn't just a chosen few....."

Yet, that is what in the Bible:

For many be called, but few chosen. Matthew 20:16

For many are called, but few are chosen. Matthew 22:14


@AVL1984 post: And? It doesn't mean you didn't read Calvin or hear Calvinistic doctrine...especially since being on your own. I live right here where the CoC was started (Tennessee, Kentucky...the SOUTH!) and many of their pastors and laypeople read Calvin.

Sounds like you are saying I am lying. Are you? If so, then have the intestinal fortitude to call me a liar instead of working around on the edges.