The Garden

[YokeFellow]

Not a good Biblical interpertation. The garden is not the whole surface of the Earth those six days.

Hi @37818 . I am not sure what you mean.

 

[37818]

Hi @37818 . I am not sure what you mean.

What was done in the garden was began on the sixth day.

 

[Scarlett O.]

As far as I know, I am the only Christian that believes Genesis 2:17, as it is, without taking away words and/or adding words to it...

Genesis 2:17
"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

The ONLY one? You are the ONLY Christian who believes Genesis 2:17 as it is written? I'll get to my point on this in just a moment.

Every Christian I have met will either change the word 'day' to 'a thousand years' or they will change 'surely die' to 'spiritually die' or 'begin to die' or something non-literal. I consider that a violation of Revelation 22:18-19.

I am 62 years old, been on Bible forums for over 20 years, taught the Bible for 40 years, and sat under a HOST of preachers and I have never heard ANY Christian say the word "day" in this verse means one thousand years.

If I must take away or add unto the Word on this forum, then I will leave and never come back. However, if mature sensible non-biased dialog is allowed, then I can either continue in this thread or make a new one. Just let me know.

You've done your fair share of insulting the members here in a few of your posts. You seem to come here believing us to be dumb as a brick. Yes, we know what "quickened" means. Yes, we know that the first reference Adam made towards his mate was "Woman". Yes, we know that she was named Eve later.

You'd best watch what you accuse others of doing lest you find YOURSELF doing the same thing.

Adam was NOT created on the 3rd day. That's in opposition to Genesis chapter 1. Adam was NOT resurrected on the 6th day. He was created on the 6th day.

The first chapter of the Bible says that Adam and Eve were created separately on the 6th day.

Chapter TWO is a retelling of the 6th day with greater detail.

As a moderator, welcome to the Board. And here's a piece of advice. Stop insulting the intelligence of the membership here. There are some SUPER intelligent people here and yes some that think the world revolves around them.

Sharing ideas in fellowship is best.

 

[YokeFellow]

What was done in the garden was on the sixth day.

In other words, in Genesis 2:4, you do not interpret 'day' as literal, correct?

You add the word 'six' to make it say 'six days'...

Genesis 2:4
"These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the [six days] that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens"

Technically, you add more to the verse...

Genesis 2:4
"These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the [six days] that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens [and the plants and the animals and the Greater Light and the Lesser Light and the Stars and the fish and the fowls and the whales]"

Now we must assume much more than what is simply stated. To make matters worse, the rest of the timeline no longer makes sense.

If we are on the Sixth Day, and the world is filled with animals, then why does God say that the Man is alone?

Genesis 2:18
"And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him."

So here we have Adam, surrounded by animals, yet he is alone. So, what does God do to resolve this issue? God creates animals...

Genesis 2:19
"And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof."

That does not make sense. Moreover, we now have animals made *after* man is created.

So many problems arise when we alter Genesis 2:4 to make it say what God 'should have said'.

 

[YokeFellow]

The ONLY one? You are the ONLY Christian who believes Genesis 2:17 as it is written?

Hi @Scarlett O.

Yes. I have been debating folks on this topic for years. Not a single person agrees that the verse is literal. I stand by my statement.

I am 62 years old, been on Bible forums for over 20 years, taught the Bible for 40 years, and sat under a HOST of preachers and I have never heard ANY Christian say the word "day" in this verse means one thousand years.

Just because you have not heard, does not mean no one else has. It means you have not done enough research. Confirmation Bias may play a part as well. There are many who believe that the death was literal (as opposed to Spiritual) and so they argue that 'day' is not literal per...

2 Peter 3:8
"But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."

Thus, they died physically 'in that day' is the logic they use.

You've done your fair share of insulting the members here in a few of your posts.

That is a baseless accusation. You are causing strife by saying that.

You seem to come here believing us to be dumb as a brick.

No. I come here believing you folks are taking away and adding to the Word. It is up to you to decide if that is 'dumb'.

Yes, we know what "quickened" means.

Then prove it by agreeing or disagreeing in the thread...

Are you sure you know what 'Quickened' means? | Baptist Christian Forums (baptistboard.com)

Yes, we know that the first reference Adam made towards his mate was "Woman". Yes, we know that she was named Eve later.

Reference? No, that was the actual name of the person that died. Eve is another creation. Go back and actually read Genesis again. Otherwise, I accuse you of altering the Word of God.

You'd best watch what you accuse others of doing lest you find YOURSELF doing the same thing.

Yes, that is called 'debating'.

Are we here to debate or not? Why get so angry? Did I touch a nerve? Are you not secure in your reasoning? I told you folks would get angry with me for not altering the verses.

Adam was NOT created on the 3rd day. That's in opposition to Genesis chapter 1. Adam was NOT resurrected on the 6th day. He was created on the 6th day.

That is your opinion which means nothing. Prove what you said by going verse by verse as I have without altering the text. I guarantee you will not be able to do it. No one has. Some have come close though.

As a moderator, welcome to the Board. And here's a piece of advice. Stop insulting the intelligence of the membership here.

Again, I have insulted no one. As a Moderator you should not be so emotional, but rather use facts. Your temper is causing you to judge me in an unfair manner. I have every right to defend myself.

There are some SUPER intelligent people here and yes some that think the world revolves around them.

And yet they rudely ignore my comments. These posts take a lot of time out of my busy day to create, and what thanks do I get? None. The OP has yet to even acknowledge my existence in this thread. Did you even notice?

Sharing ideas in fellowship is best.

You should lead by example instead of being so mean and dictatorial towards me. I have better things to do than being yelled at all day.

There is literally no benefit to me being here. I do this as a way of informing folks of the problems in their Theology in hopes that a correction can be made. Usually, it ends up with me being banned and all of my posts deleted because I end up winning the debate. I can already see it happening here.

And you wonder why you never heard of these issues?

 

[YokeFellow]

I will play devil's advocate to myself and show you folks the solution that comes closest...

There are still a few problems with their interpretations, and so the point is to show that there are real issues here still left to be discussed.

As I know a lot of you are busy, I ask that you at least listen to the first opening minute which explains how many Scholars see Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 as contradictory.

All I am proposing is another solution that the Atheists, Bible Critics, etc. can never win an argument over.

Take it or leave it.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Hi @Scarlett O.

Yes. I have been debating folks on this topic for years. Not a single person agrees that the verse is literal. I stand by my statement.




Just because you have not heard, does not mean no one else has. It means you have not done enough research. Confirmation Bias may play a part as well. There are many who believe that the death was literal (as opposed to Spiritual) and so they argue that 'day' is not literal per...

2 Peter 3:8
"But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."

Thus, they died physically 'in that day' is the logic they use.




That is a baseless accusation. You are causing strife by saying that.




No. I come here believing you folks are taking away and adding to the Word. It is up to you to decide if that is 'dumb'.




Then prove it by agreeing or disagreeing in the thread...

Are you sure you know what 'Quickened' means? | Baptist Christian Forums (baptistboard.com)




Reference? No, that was the actual name of the person that died. Eve is another creation. Go back and actually read Genesis again. Otherwise, I accuse you of altering the Word of God.




Yes, that is called 'debating'.

Are we here to debate or not? Why get so angry? Did I touch a nerve? Are you not secure in your reasoning? I told you folks would get angry with me for not altering the verses.




That is your opinion which means nothing. Prove what you said by going verse by verse as I have without altering the text. I guarantee you will not be able to do it. No one has. Some have come close though.




Again, I have insulted no one. As a Moderator you should not be so emotional, but rather use facts. Your temper is causing you to judge me in an unfair manner. I have every right to defend myself.




And yet they rudely ignore my comments. These posts take a lot of time out of my busy day to create, and what thanks do I get? None. The OP has yet to even acknowledge my existence in this thread. Did you even notice?




You should lead by example instead of being so mean and dictatorial towards me. I have better things to do than being yelled at all day.

There is literally no benefit to me being here. I do this as a way of informing folks of the problems in their Theology in hopes that a correction can be made. Usually, it ends up with me being banned and all of my posts deleted because I end up winning the debate. I can already see it happening here.

And you wonder why you never heard of these issues?

You are the one who is introducing unBiblical ideas - not everyone else.

What happened on day 3 according to the Bible? Genesis 1:9-12

• God brought forth dry land.
• He named the dry land and he named the waters.
• He created grasses, herb-yielding seeds, and fruit trees.

What happened on day 6 according to the Bible? Genesis 1:24-31

• God created living land creatures - cattle and the beasts of the earth.
• He created the "creeping" things on the earth.
• He created man - male and female - and gave them dominion over the earth and all creatures.
• He gave instructions to the man, woman, and animals as to what to eat.

And in the retelling of day 6 in chapter 2 which gives much greater detail......

• God made Adam from the dust of the ground.
• He gave Adam directions as to what NOT to eat.
• Adam was alone and named the animals, not because God couldn't do it, but in preparation of the "help meet" that was coming.
• God created the Woman from Adam's side.
• They met through God's presentation of her to Adam and they were naked and not ashamed. God declared a "relationship" between the two that would cover all marriages between a man and woman.

Nowhere in Genesis 1 or 2 is Adam created on day 3 or resurrected from the dead on day 6.

You have added to the Bible.

 

[percho]

And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures [plural] ;

I have asked before, why the third day?

 

[YokeFellow]

@Scarlett O.

What you posted was just a summary of what you think the Bible teaches, without actual verses and commentary.

Here is a snapshot from the video I posted of one of the issues at hand...

 

[percho]

I will play devil's advocate to myself and show you folks the solution that comes closest...

There are still a few problems with their interpretations, and so the point is to show that there are real issues here still left to be discussed.

As I know a lot of you are busy, I ask that you at least listen to the first opening minute which explains how many Scholars see Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 as contradictory.

All I am proposing is another solution that the Atheists, Bible Critics, etc. can never win an argument over.

Take it or leave it.

I agree with the last statement made in the video.

"The text [of Gen 1 and 2] is a unified narrative."

 

[JD731]

Genesis 2:7–8 Then the Lord God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being. The Lord God planted a garden toward the east, in Eden; and there He placed the man whom He had formed.

Genesis 2:9 Out of the ground the Lord God caused to grow every tree that is pleasing to the sight and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Genesis 2:15 Then the Lord God took the man and put him into the garden of Eden to cultivate it and keep it.

Genesis 3:22–24 Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, he might stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”— therefore the Lord God sent him out from the garden of Eden, to cultivate the ground from which he was taken. So He drove the man out; and at the east of the garden of Eden He stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword which turned every direction to guard the way to the tree of life.

What is the significance of God taking Adam from where he was created and putting him in the Garden (as opposed to God creating man in the Garden)?

Typology!

 

[JD731]

So, what happened to the First Adam and his wife Ishshah? They died after partaking of the Forbidden Fruit of course!

.

Define dying in the context of the unique context of these two, no these three, very important things that was said about Adam.

1) He was specially created by God
2) He was the Son of God (Lk 3:38)
3) He was in the image of God before his sin

Genesis 1:11-13
11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
12 And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
13 And the evening and the morning were the third day.

Death happening on the third day would not be good in the context of creation. Grass was created on that day which will come to picture the transitory nature of fallen man in passages like 1 Pe 1.

 

[37818]

3) He was in the image of God before his sin

Man remained in the image of God after the fall and after the flood, Genesis 9:6, ". . . Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man. . . ."

 

[Scarlett O.]

What you posted was just a summary of what you think the Bible teaches, without actual verses and commentary.

Here is a snapshot from the video I posted of one of the issues at hand

You say that I posted no verses or commentary, just what I "think"?

In this screen shot, I see no scripture, no commentary, only a list of words.

Hmm....and I'm wrong?

I'm never going to convince you. I will just leave you with this. To say that Adam and the Woman were created on the 3rd day, sinned sometime between day 3 and day 6, and physically died - then God "resurrected" them or made new ones on the 6th day is not only adding to the Bible, but grossly not telling the truth.

I'm done.

 

[JD731]

Man remained in the image of God after the fall and after the flood, Genesis 9:6, ". . . Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man. . . ."

Do you ever think? Why would God desire, yea, require men to be renewed to his image if what you say is tru?

 

[37818]

Do you ever think? Why would God desire, yea, require men to be renewed to his image if what you say is tru?

Because it is true.

 

[YokeFellow]

To say that Adam and the Woman were created on the 3rd day...

The First Adam was created on the Third Day. Ishshah was created after plants and animals, which means she was created on the Sixth Day.

...sinned sometime between day 3 and day 6, and physically died - then God "resurrected" them or made new ones on the 6th day...

Correct. Just to be clear, they sinned on the Sixth Day.

How about I try a different approach? I call it the 'Kingdom of God Within' method of interpretation...

Matthew 6:33
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."

What if I told you that the Bible teaches that the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil represented Ovary? That would make the Forbidden Fruit an Ovum. Said Ovum was literally fertilized by the Devil...

John 8:44
"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it."

I believe Jesus was being literal. Moreover, we all come from Adam and Eve, therefore Jesus is teaching that something happened in the Garden of Eden to cause the Devil to be our Biological Father.

To put it plainly, the Forbidden Fruit was a Zygote. When the First Adam and Ishshah partook, they were literally choosing which parents to be conceived from. God simply honored their request and clothed them with the corrupt bodies we have now...

Job 10:11
"Thou hast clothed me with skin and flesh, and hast fenced me with bones and sinews."

So, who is our Biological Mom according to Scripture?

Here she is...

Revelation 17:4
"And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication"

The contents in the Golden Cup is the Forbidden Fruit Zygote. All have partaken to incarnate into this world.

The First Adam and Ishshah 'left their first estate' and were Born Again... literally into new corrupted bodies.

 

[37818]

The First Adam was created on the Third Day.

Proverbs 30:6, "Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."

 

[JD731]

Because it is true.

No, it is not true. Your claim is completely without merit. Why do you think God has labored for 6000 years to renew men to his position before the fall? Jesus Christ is the first man since Adam who possessed the image of God and it was through his death and resurrection that God's image is restored in us by his blood washing away our sins so God can once again dwell in our bodies.

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Why do you think men must be born again of the Spirit?

Don't you think there is a plan?

 

[37818]

Jesus is the Last Adam. There is more than one Adam.

*Their* name was Adam...

Genesis 5:2
"Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created."

'Their' means more than one.

Two things there. First, they, male and female were called Adam. Secondly, it was in "the day" singular, they were created. Not days. It was, of course, the sixth day. Genesis 1:26-31, Genesis 2:7, and Genesis 2:21-24.