1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Unconditional Salvation

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Charlie24, Oct 23, 2024.

  1. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    One night long, long ago, the Angel of Death descended on Egypt bringing death to the first-born. God instructed Moses that each household would take a Lamb without blemish,

    Exodus 12:7
    "And they shall take of the blood, and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper door post of the houses, wherein they shall eat it."

    And God told Moses,

    Exodus 12:13
    "And the blood shall be to you for a token upon the houses where ye are: and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you, when I smite the land of Egypt."

    Concerning this, Kenneth Wuest said, "This is, without a doubt, one of the single most important Scriptures in the entirety of the Word of God. The Lamb had taken the fatal blow; and because it had taken the blow, those in the house would be spared. It was not a question of personal worthiness, self had nothing whatsoever to do in the matter, it was a matter of faith.

    All under the cover of the Blood were safe, just as all presently under the cover of the Blood are safe. This means that they were not merely in a savable state, but rather that they were saved, as well, they were not partly saved and partly exposed to judgment, they were wholly saved, and because there is no such thing as partial justification. The Lord didn't say, when I see you, or when I see your good works, etc, but, 'When I see the Blood.'

    This speaks of Christ and what He would do at the Cross in order that we might be saved, which pertained to Him giving Himself in sacrifice, which necessitated the shedding of His precious Blood."

    These Hebrew children were saved when they left Egypt to enter into the wilderness where God would would give them His great Law. But we see that they did not enter into God's rest, they perished both physically and spiritually in the wilderness.

    Hebrews 3:10-11
    "Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.

    So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest."

    Then Paul gives us fair warning,

    vs 12
    "Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God."

    Take notice, Paul is speaking to the "Brethren" here, departing from God!

    Then Paul gives us a second warning!

    4:1
    "Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it."

    Paul is still speaking to the Hebrew Brethren!

    Folks, there is no such thing as "unconditional salvation."
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    20,391
    Likes Received:
    3,027
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Context is Jewish Christians succumbing to the persecution from Jewish non-Christians and 'falling away back' [turning back in their hearts to Egypt] to the apostate religion that murdered Christ, thereby 'crucifying Christ anew'. Hebrews 6:6
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,687
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Once again I am not sure just what is being asserted in the OP.

    What does "unconditional salvation" mean. Once a person is saved, are there conditions whereby that salvation can be lost?
    Or what if once a person is saved, they are saved unconditionally, noting can snatch them from God's salvation.
     
  4. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    This is the condition, Van. It's clear and easy to understand from Paul, and in the same context with the OP.

    Heb. 3:14
    "For we are made partakers of Christ, IF we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;"

    IF we keep our faith to the end!

    I know that denominational teaching is almost impossible to penetrate, believe as you will!

    I'm not going to argue the plain truth with you!
     
  5. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    That's fine ky, it can be whatever you want it to be, Brother.

    I'll not contest it!
     
  6. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2021
    Messages:
    2,857
    Likes Received:
    343
    Faith:
    Baptist
    @Charlie24 Are you free will Baptist? Arminian?
     
  7. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I'm one of those dreaded IFB. I'm sure you've heard of us.
     
  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    20,391
    Likes Received:
    3,027
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So Charlie, is this just 'any ol' sin'? Or is it a sin specific to the Hebrew Christians of that day?

    26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins, Heb 10
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2021
    Messages:
    2,857
    Likes Received:
    343
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I don't understand then your positions on a lot of things. On the other thread OSAS is a huge definer of IFB's. And you come on supporting a Catholic. On this thread, any IFB would say that the blood applied is the "condition" for salvation. If it is "unconditional" election to salvation you are talking about then I can see your opposition to that as an IFB. I'm not criticizing, but just asking.
     
  10. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    That is a very good question, ky. What is sinning willfully?

    I just found my next thread. But let me give you a quick summary.

    It's referred to as "the willful sin" and it refers to the willful sin of unbelief after accepting Christ as Saviour.

    This is Paul's plea to the believing Hebrews who are considering going back to temple worship (Judaism) and abandoning Christ altogether.

    Paul tells them in doing so "you have trampled under foot the Son of God."

    it is the "willful sin" of turning from Christ in unbelief again.
     
  11. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    You've been reading the internet. Inside the IFB, as with all denominations, there is a division.

    OSAS is one of those issues, not all of us believe that, and we have the Scripture for that belief, we didn't pull it out of thin air.
     
  12. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Just to give you a head start before I create the thread (when I get time), when Paul said, "for if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, THERE REMAINS NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SINS."

    Paul is telling them if they abandon Christ, there is no other way for their sins to be forgiven. Christ is that sacrifice for sin.
     
  13. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,687
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The issue is what is the plain truth.

    If we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast until the end, that proves we were made partakers of Christ.

    Apparently, folks, Charlie24 believes those born anew can lose their salvation. I am not sure because, once again, we have a poster unwilling to make a definitive statement of his or her position.
     
  14. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    My "definitive statement" is clearly found in the OP. Van just wants to argue, as it seems that is your main purpose here.

    Have at it with someone else, my belief is plainly stated in the OP.
     
  15. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2021
    Messages:
    2,857
    Likes Received:
    343
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Charlie I was an IFB before the internet existed. Even had my own subscription to Sword of the Lord. Sat under a pastor for a while who was a direct student (disciple) of Jack Hyles. Carried a Scofield KJV. You are more than correct in that there is division. But I never saw division on OSAS. If you are free will Baptist that is OK with me. Or Arminian or Wesleyan. I respect them greatly. But you seem confused to me. IFB is an identifiable group. Fundamentalism in general is much broader. You are not posting like an IFB. I'm sorry.
     
  16. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,687
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Faith:
    Baptist
    But not stated in post 14. :)

    Were any of the OT saints saved with the blood of Jesus before He died? Nope

    Here is my statement, once saved, always saved.
    Here may be Charlie24 view, once saved, not necessarily always saved. Who knows?
    What does it mean to be saved? To be transferred spiritually into Christ's spiritual body!
     
  17. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It's a beautiful day here, Van. The sun is shining, the birds are chirping, it's around 70 degrees.

    A light breeze, just enough to feel comfortable. I looked out in the pasture and the horses are running throwing their heads up in the air feeling frisky and happy.

    The Lord has given us a gorgeous day here in NC, despite the hurricane we had coming past here.
     
  18. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Messages:
    28,687
    Likes Received:
    1,131
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Here is my statement, once saved, always saved.
    Here may be Charlie24 view, once saved, not necessarily always saved. Who knows?
    What does it mean to be saved? To be transferred spiritually into Christ's spiritual body!
     
  19. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    17,747
    Likes Received:
    1,360
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I think this explains the point being made.
     
  20. Charlie24

    Charlie24 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2023
    Messages:
    331
    Likes Received:
    24
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Contrary to some here, it does explain it.

    Whether it's believed or not is totally up to the individual.

    I'm just presenting what I believe to be true.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
Loading...