No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !

[Silverhair]

By nature all men spiritually speaking are in this world without God, Christ and no hope Eph 2:12

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

These lost people had a will but it was lost to the True God and Christ, in that regard they were without hope. Now they could and would worship false gods Acts 17 since by nature that's all we can do, that is to worship false gods.

Your ability to misuse the word of God can only come from one source BF.

You deny clear scripture and twist the word of God to fit your man-made philosophy.

 

[Silverhair]

All Gods Elect and the non elect are by nature spiritually dead, dead in sin Eph 2:1,5; Col 2:13. This means that all men naturally are living without spiritual life and alienated from God. Eph 4:18

Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

Col 1:21

And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled.

As such we are naturally in spiritual death Rom 8:6

6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

All by nature are carnal minded, that cant be helped, even if we are very pious and religious and moral.

In this state we have no affections or motion towards God Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Thats why Jesus says of man naturally Jn 6:44,65

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father. 4

Because God desires all to be saved He has used various means to draw all men to Himself.

Some will use their God given free will to reject Him others to trust in Him for their salvation.

It is sad to see someone work as hard as you do to deny the word of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

Revelation 22:17
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

John 4:14
But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

John 6:37
All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Ephesians 1:22
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

Sometimes I wonder how proud of themselves that the reformed will be as they stand in heaven and say “Look how well I deterred people from thinking that they can come to You.”

Funny how important it seems for some to say that people can’t come to Christ when the command of Christ is to go tell everyone to come to Him.
A very strange perversion of God’s instructions indeed!

Im afraid you lack understanding with those scriptures. Christ teaches no man has the ability to come to Him Jn 6:44

 

[Brightfame52]

You do not preach the gospel to those that are already saved BF. You are following man's philosophy rather than the word of God.

Lol If you expect for people to hear spiritually and believe the Gospel, they better be saved, otherwise they will never hear it, nor understand it spiritually, in that case its for their damnation.

 

[Brightfame52]

Your ability to misuse the word of God can only come from one source BF.

You deny clear scripture and twist the word of God to fit your man-made philosophy.

Thats every mans plight by nature, I know Paul was writing about gentiles, however its applicable to all men regardless of race.

 

[Silverhair]

Lol If you expect for people to hear spiritually and believe the Gospel, they better be saved, otherwise they will never hear it, nor understand it spiritually, in that case its for their damnation.

Do you actually think through what you post before you post it BF?

If a person is saved why would they need to hear the gospel so as to be saved?

You are using man's philosophy and it has lead you to a false conclusion.

 

[Brightfame52]

Because God desires all to be saved He has used various means to draw all men to Himself.

Some will use their God given free will to reject Him others to trust in Him for their salvation.

It is sad to see someone work as hard as you do to deny the word of God.

Again all men by nature are spiritually dead and alienated from God, their only hope is if God spiritually raises them from the dead. Mans will by nature is dead to God.

 

[Brightfame52]

Do you actually think through what you post before you post it BF?

If a person is saved why would they need to hear the gospel so as to be saved?

You are using man's philosophy and it has lead you to a false conclusion.

If a person isnt already of God [saved] they cannot and will not hear the word of God Jn 8:47

 

[Silverhair]

Thats every mans plight by nature, I know Paul was writing about gentiles, however its applicable to all men regardless of race.

Not all men will deny clear scripture and twist the word of God such as you do BF.

As God tells us we can hear and believe the gospel message and be saved. That is why we are to preach to the lost.

Your religion is so flawed it should not even be called religion but rather just the ramblings of a confused man.

 

[Silverhair]

Again all men by nature are spiritually dead and alienated from God, their only hope is if God spiritually raises them from the dead. Mans will by nature is dead to God.

I agree BF, we are all spiritually dead before we hear the gospel and believe the gospel and God saves us, makes us spiritually alive.

That is why Paul wrote:
Rom 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, first to the Jew, then to the Greek.

That is why we are to preach the gospel to dead men.

 

[Brightfame52]

Not all men will deny clear scripture and twist the word of God such as you do BF.

As God tells us we can hear and believe the gospel message and be saved. That is why we are to preach to the lost.

Your religion is so flawed it should not even be called religion but rather just the ramblings of a confused man.

By nature we are children of wrath and disobedience Eph 2:2-3

.
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

See when spiritually dead, even then we are not physically dead, and all we do by nature is disobedience to God, its our nature, your so called freewill cant stop it, our will at all times is disobedient, so much so we are called children of disobedience and deserving nothing but wrath. Even in our most sincere, honest religious seeking and endeavours, its all disobedience and subject to Gods eternal wrath.

 

[Brightfame52]

I agree BF, we are all spiritually dead before we hear the gospel and believe the gospel and God saves us, makes us spiritually alive.

That is why Paul wrote:
Rom 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, first to the Jew, then to the Greek.

That is why we are to preach the gospel to dead men.

Spiritually dead folk cant hear the gospel spiritually, so its mere foolishness to them 1 Cor 1:18

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Now get this, by nature we are of them that perish/lost, so the Gospel is to us naturally foolishness, but to them which are saved, its the power of God Rom 1:16 but you have to be saved.

 

[Silverhair]

By nature we are children of wrath and disobedience Eph 2:2-3

.
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

See when spiritually dead, even then we are not physically dead, and all we do by nature is disobedience to God, its our nature, your so called freewill cant stop it, our will at all times is disobedient, so much so we are called children of disobedience and deserving nothing but wrath. Even in our most sincere, honest religious seeking and endeavours, its all disobedience and subject to Gods eternal wrath.

Your logic is flawed BF. God holds man responsible for the choices he makes. If man chooses to reject His son then they are condemned but if they choose to trust in His son then they will be saved. That is free will BF even if you can not see it or believe it.

Joh 3:17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

 

[Silverhair]

Spiritually dead folk cant hear the gospel spiritually, so its mere foolishness to them 1 Cor 1:18

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Now get this, by nature we are of them that perish/lost, so the Gospel is to us naturally foolishness, but to them which are saved, its the power of God Rom 1:16 but you have to be saved.

You have to hear and believe before you are saved BF.

You are trusting man rather than God and if you continue in that view you will be lost.

 

[Brightfame52]

Your logic is flawed BF. God holds man responsible for the choices he makes. If man chooses to reject His son then they are condemned but if they choose to trust in His son then they will be saved. That is free will BF even if you can not see it or believe it.

Joh 3:17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Its not my logic, its the word of God, man by nature is a child of disobedience or of unbelief. See its natural for man by nature to be an unbeliever, or disobedient, thats why theyre called the children of disobedience Eph 2:2 disobedience is their parent.

 

[Brightfame52]

You have to hear and believe before you are saved BF.

You are trusting man rather than God and if you continue in that view you will be lost.

The unsaved, not of God cannot hear to be saved. Here who Jesus says hears to be saved Jn 8:47

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

You have to hear and believe before you are saved BF.

You are trusting man rather than God and if you continue in that view you will be lost.

Furthermore, it must be given a person to believe on Christ, he cannot do it otherwise Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

 

[Silverhair]

Its not my logic, its the word of God, man by nature is a child of disobedience or of unbelief. See its natural for man by nature to be an unbeliever, or disobedient, thats why theyre called the children of disobedience Eph 2:2 disobedience is their parent.

Disobedience does not mean unable to hear and believe BF, that is something that your false religion has brought into the text because of the pagan philosophy upon which it is based.

 

[Silverhair]

Furthermore, it must be given a person to believe on Christ, he cannot do it otherwise Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

When will you stop your cherry picking out of context verses BF. You just continue to show your complete lack of understanding of the word of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

Disobedience does not mean unable to hear and believe BF, that is something that your false religion has brought into the text because of the pagan philosophy upon which it is based.

Yes it does, one must not only hear the Gospel but obey the Gospel Rom 10:16

But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

The natural man cannot do either . How many times do you need to see what Jesus said, who is it that hears the words of God ? Jn 8:47