I have not looked at or studied his writings, so I cannot Comment on him directly.Have you ever read &studied Baruch Spinoza… in short he denied Christ…typical of his years of rabbinical studies. Spinoza denied Christ as massiah and denied determinism. Tell me, was he saved?
Was Spinoza a heretic or a theologian? - UW Stroum Center for Jewish Studies
Spinoza, the philosopher who was excommunicated from Judaism, distinguished between religion and superstition. What did Spinoza teach about Jewish faith?jewishstudies.washington.edu
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Not Everyone
- Thread starter Zaatar71
- Start date
Good, so you agree with his quote then!
Did you mis type this? God for sure is not going to save everyone, that is certain from scripture. Perhaps you did not type what you intended??
That is not taught here, as it would contradict several portions of scripture such as Isa.46:9-11
No, that is your invention, it is not scriptural at all.
You twist things into a knot like some kittens playing in a basket of yarn.
Here is another quote that you men will find helpful from Brother Z;
The term election, that so very frequently occurs in Scripture, is there taken in a fourfold sense, and most commonly signifies "That eternal, sovereign, unconditional, particular and immutable act of God where He selected some from among all mankind and of every nation under heaven to be redeemed and everlastingly saved by Christ."
It sometimes and more rarely signifies "that gracious and almighty act of the Divine Spirit, whereby God actually and visibly separates His elect from the world by effectual calling." This is nothing but the manifestation and partial fulfilment of the former election, and by it the objects of predestinating grace are sensibly led into the communion of saints and visibly added to the number of God's declared professing people. Of this our Lord makes mention: "Because I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hates you" (John 15:19)
The term election, that so very frequently occurs in Scripture, is there taken in a fourfold sense, and most commonly signifies "That eternal, sovereign, unconditional, particular and immutable act of God where He selected some from among all mankind and of every nation under heaven to be redeemed and everlastingly saved by Christ."
It sometimes and more rarely signifies "that gracious and almighty act of the Divine Spirit, whereby God actually and visibly separates His elect from the world by effectual calling." This is nothing but the manifestation and partial fulfilment of the former election, and by it the objects of predestinating grace are sensibly led into the communion of saints and visibly added to the number of God's declared professing people. Of this our Lord makes mention: "Because I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hates you" (John 15:19)
ibid;
By election is sometimes meant, "God's taking a whole nation, community or body of men into external covenant with Himself by giving them the advantage of revelation, or His written word, as the rule of their belief and practice, when other nations are without it."
In this sense the whole body of the Jewish nation was indiscriminately called elect, because that "unto them were committed the oracles of God" (Deuteronomy 7:6). Now all that are thus elected are not therefore necessarily saved, but many of them may be, and are, reprobates, as those of whom our Lord says (Matt 13:20), that they "hear the word, and anon with joy receive it," etc. And the apostle says, "They went out from us" (i.e., being favored with the same Gospel revelation we were, they professed themselves true believers, no less than we), "but they were not of us" (i.e., they were not, with us, chosen of God unto everlasting life, nor did they ever in reality possess that faith of His operation which He gave to us, for if they had in this sense "been of us, they would, no doubt, have continued with us" (1 John 2:19), they would have manifested the sincerity of their professions and the truth of their conversion by enduring to the end and being saved.
By election is sometimes meant, "God's taking a whole nation, community or body of men into external covenant with Himself by giving them the advantage of revelation, or His written word, as the rule of their belief and practice, when other nations are without it."
In this sense the whole body of the Jewish nation was indiscriminately called elect, because that "unto them were committed the oracles of God" (Deuteronomy 7:6). Now all that are thus elected are not therefore necessarily saved, but many of them may be, and are, reprobates, as those of whom our Lord says (Matt 13:20), that they "hear the word, and anon with joy receive it," etc. And the apostle says, "They went out from us" (i.e., being favored with the same Gospel revelation we were, they professed themselves true believers, no less than we), "but they were not of us" (i.e., they were not, with us, chosen of God unto everlasting life, nor did they ever in reality possess that faith of His operation which He gave to us, for if they had in this sense "been of us, they would, no doubt, have continued with us" (1 John 2:19), they would have manifested the sincerity of their professions and the truth of their conversion by enduring to the end and being saved.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
First off we should deal with what I had said in response to your comment.
Actually the Holy Spirit gives a new heart in response to the person repenting and believing.
Do you agree with my comment Yes or No?
xxxx
Now lets look at Eze 36:24-29
We must note that here God is speaking of Israel's restoration, after 70 years in Babylon. This is referring to the restoration of Israel not about how God makes Christians.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
That is an assumption that Zanchius has made and it would seem so have you.
When Christ says He will draw all to Himself what do you think that means?
When we are told that God desires all to be saved what do you think that means?
Were both the Father and the Son being disingenuous?
What about what the John writes here?
Joh 3:17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him.
Did the Holy Spirit guide him wrong when he wrote this down?
The bible is clear that God's plan, His design, was for all to be saved. That is why the Holy Spirit convicts the whole world, Joh 16:8, and Christ is the atoning sacrifice for the whole world 1Jn 2:2. And what about the Father when He sent His son to save anyone that would believe Joh 3:16.
It seems to me that those of the calvinist view are more concerned about defending their calvinism than God.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I have shown you many times from scripture the error of your view and your DoG/TULIP.
Actually if you took the time to look into the foundations of your C/R view you would see where Augustine brought pagan philosophy into the church. But as usual none of those of the C/R view will check it out as it would upset the view they have so carefully constructed.
The fact that Augustine brought pagan philosophy into the church is historical fact. That Calvin and later calvinists carried it on is obvious in their teachings.
The same could be said of the TULIP theory. But we know God desires all to be saved and that He so loved the world that He gave His Son.
We know that God reaches out to man through the preaching and hearing of His Gospel.
We know that God has charged us believers to spread the Gospel throughout the the world He loves.
We know that John said Christ is the satisfaction for not only our sins, but the sins of the whole world.
We know that the Scripture has said "for whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
And finally, we know that through the hearing of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, God has reached out for man first and is willing to save anyone who will call on Him who believe on His Son.
"For many are called but few are chosen."
The chosen are they who hear the Gospel and believe, calling on God in repentance and for mercy, seeing they are lost in this world with no hope.
They were predestined before the foundation of the world to be conformed into the image of Christ.
They were predestined to a plan, the plan God chose for man to be saved through His crucified Christ.
Here Silverhair avoids the direct response to the point made by the Ezkiel 36 reference, using a dispensationally based excuse that avoids facing the music of his man centered response.
No, obviously I do not agree with your man centered comment about God responding to mans response.
Why in your faulty scheme was God not able to do His designed plan of saving everyone?
Did some work of man need to be added?
Did Ezk 36 say anywhere that God waits for mans response, or does it say as we posted that God says all the action comes from God?
Sorry but this bogus post will no longer be counted as an honest post.
You are free to ignore truth, but the truth is not going to change
Many have told you truth, you just oppose yourself and resist.
Yes, opposing a theory that has never been established from Scripture.
It's all theory and contradicts verse after verse in Scripture.
Okay, you have had your say and cannot seem to respond to truth, so,thanks for your responses be that what they are.
Yes, you did give me a say, I thank you for that!
ok, we do not have to be enemies,lol
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I directly answered your post you just do not like the answer that comes from actually reading the verses in question.
Then you are denying the word of God @Zaatar71.
Eph 1:13 In Him, you also,
1] after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation the invitation
2] having also believed, the response
3] you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, God's response
Rom 10:13 for
1] "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD our response to the gospel message
2] WILL BE SAVED." God's response
Again God responds to the response of the person by saving them.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
First off Eze 36 is not about salvation as you would know if you actually studied the verses. And need I remind you I pointed out to you already.
Since faith is not a work but is a required condition for one's salvation you just proven that you do not know or understand the bible.
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
Eph 2:9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Rom 4:4 Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due.
Rom 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,
Rom 4:6 just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
So @Zaatar71you can either believe the word of God or the word of some calvinist teacher. But only one is right and it is not your calvinist teacher.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
So I take it that you are afraid of what you will find so you choose to stick your head in the sand.
It would seem the truth is more that you can bear.