Biblical Solution to Spousal Abuse

Sorry for the double post, but I lost a long post last night, and I don't want to lose another one so I'm breaking it up...

There is one aspect to all of this that people seem to be ignoring: We are dealing with marriage here. We are dealing with two people who are one. In this discussion, I believe it is important to keep this in perspective. Are we trying to save a marriage or are we trying to get out of the marriage with as little damage as possible?

If the desire is to save the marriage, then I do not know if throwing the guy in jail is the best solution. How difficult is it to find a job when one has a record? How much resentment is added on when the wife has the husband arrested?

I know these are not concerns if the wife simply wants out. But I believe these are valid concerns if the desire is to heal the screwed up union. I believe everyone would agree that when there is abuse, there is a screwed up union. One part of the body simply does not naturally attack the other half.

While reading through this, after shaking my head, I found some verses that while they SEEM to not apply, I really think they do.

Exodus 21:12-35 (New International Version)
Personal Injuries
12 "Anyone who strikes a man and kills him shall surely be put to death. 13 However, if he does not do it intentionally, but God lets it happen, he is to flee to a place I will designate. 14 But if a man schemes and kills another man deliberately, take him away from my altar and put him to death.
15 "Anyone who attacks [a] his father or his mother must be put to death.

16 "Anyone who kidnaps another and either sells him or still has him when he is caught must be put to death.

17 "Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.

18 "If men quarrel and one hits the other with a stone or with his fist and he does not die but is confined to bed, 19 the one who struck the blow will not be held responsible if the other gets up and walks around outside with his staff; however, he must pay the injured man for the loss of his time and see that he is completely healed.

20 "If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, 21 but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property.

22 "If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely [c] but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman's husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

26 "If a man hits a manservant or maidservant in the eye and destroys it, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And if he knocks out the tooth of a manservant or maidservant, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the tooth.

28 "If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible. 29 If, however, the bull has had the habit of goring and the owner has been warned but has not kept it penned up and it kills a man or woman, the bull must be stoned and the owner also must be put to death. 30 However, if payment is demanded of him, he may redeem his life by paying whatever is demanded. 31 This law also applies if the bull gores a son or daughter. 32 If the bull gores a male or female slave, the owner must pay thirty shekels [d] of silver to the master of the slave, and the bull must be stoned.

33 "If a man uncovers a pit or digs one and fails to cover it and an ox or a donkey falls into it, 34 the owner of the pit must pay for the loss; he must pay its owner, and the dead animal will be his.

35 "If a man's bull injures the bull of another and it dies, they are to sell the live one and divide both the money and the dead animal equally.

Dina,

What conclusions do you draw from these verses?

Well, reading it closely, the one thing that stands out is that there is NO mention of a husband striking his wife.

But then read verse 22 "If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman's husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise."
Here are a few things that stand out to me.

"If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury"-Injury to who? The baby or the woman? Prematurity itself can be a serious injury and/or death to the child. As well as complications to the woman.
"the offender must be fined whatever the woman's husband demands and the court allows."-No serious injury but the husband can still demand-and get- a fine.
"23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise."-Again, there is no mention as to whether the serious injury is to the baby or the woman, but what is clear is that there is a punishment for the behavior-and the punishment is "equal" to the crime.

26 "If a man hits a manservant or maidservant in the eye and destroys it, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And if he knocks out the tooth of a manservant or maidservant, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the tooth." Manservants/Maidservants are slaves. Yet, God is saying that if you injure a SLAVE because you HIT them, they are to be FREE.

28 "If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible. 29 If, however, the bull has had the habit of goring and the owner has been warned but has not kept it penned up and it kills a man or woman, the bull must be stoned and the owner also must be put to death. 30 However, if payment is demanded of him, he may redeem his life by paying whatever is demanded. 31 "This law also applies if the bull gores a son or daughter"
Here where see what happens when a man, woman, son, and daughter are injured or killed by a bull. If the bull gored a man/woman to death, he is to be put to death. If the bull has a habit of goring, but not causing death, and is not penned properly, then causes death, not only is the bull stoned, but the owner of the bull as well, unless payment is demanded, then the owner may pay the demand and it sounds like there is no limit on the demand that could be made in this case.

32 "If the bull gores a male or female slave, the owner must pay thirty shekels of silver to the master of the slave, and the bull must be stoned."
This seems pretty clear, not only is bull stoned, but the owner my pay 30 shekels of silver as well.
The next verses apply to injury/death to animals and the punishments for causing the injury/death.

So, as I said above there is no mention on if a husband strikes a wife, but I think it is very clear that there are punishments in place. If a slave owner can not stike a slave without punishment, why would he then be able to strike his wife and not have punishment.

Like was mentioned above, there is common sense involved. I'm 100% with Scarlett on this. If abuse is going on , GET OUT!!!!!

A man who beats his wife does not beat her to persecute her for her faith in Jesus Christ. He beats her because he is an unrestrained bully. To equate the two is absurd.

Instead of searching for Scripture that says "Thou shalt not beat the Mrs." search the Word for a husband's responsibilities to his wife.


Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her, so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word... Ephesians 5:25-26 NAS95

Jesus did not abuse His bride and expect her to just take it like a good little martyr. Jesus gave His very life for her. If a man raises his hand to his wife, he has committed a crime against her (his responsibility to man) and sinned against her and himself (his responsibility to God).

A biblical solution to spousal abuse is to get him into Christian counseling soon after his release from jail.

If the desire is to save the marriage, then I do not know if throwing the guy in jail is the best solution. How difficult is it to find a job when one has a record? How much resentment is added on when the wife has the husband arrested?

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How difficult would it be to get a job if he was to kill her? His employment is the least of the concerns here. Hmmmm, what was the rest? He hits her, she has him arrested and you are concerned that HE will harbor resentment??!! Evel Knievel couldn't make that leap!

Scarlett O presented more than enough Scripture for you to digest along with sound and reasonable discussion. Bless you SO!

Would you accept what she said if you heard the same thing from a man instead of sitting under a woman's teaching?

Dina

If a slave owner can not stike a slave without punishment, why would he then be able to strike his wife and not have punishment.

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Is there a punishment for striking the slave, or is there a punishment for doing damage? It seems to me that according to the verses you quoted, if a man hit his slave in the eye, but the eye healed just fine, then there was no penalty.

Like was mentioned above, there is common sense involved. I'm 100% with Scarlett on this. If abuse is going on , GET OUT!!!!!

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What about this common sense?

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man finds a girl who is a virgin, who is not engaged, and seizes her and lies with her and they are discovered, then the man who lay with her shall give to the girl's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall become his wife because he has violated her; he cannot divorce her all his days.


I'm sure that I've infuriated you by this point, so I see no purpose in writing more until later.

A man who beats his wife does not beat her to persecute her for her faith in Jesus Christ. He beats her because he is an unrestrained bully. To equate the two is absurd.

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I'm not sure you are correct here. If the wife hangs around in attempt to save her husband from damnation, then it could be argued that she was being beaten for her faith in Jesus Christ. My wife was telling me about Reba McEntire's sister who did hang around and her husband did come around and no longer abuses her. I'm sure that you find this example ridiculous, but that does not mean it could never happen. It took 15 years, but it did happen.

Did a google search and found this to varify the story:

Other Abraham titles include A TENDER ROAD HOME (Broadman & Holman), the poignant story of country music star, Susie Luchsinger (Reba McEntire's sister), and the difficult journey she and her husband Paul have made through the horrors and pain of spousal abuse, and their overcoming love that brought them out of a nightmare into freedom and renewal.

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Here is the link to the page I quoted. It's toward the middle of the page.

Link

Instead of searching for Scripture that says "Thou shalt not beat the Mrs." search the Word for a husband's responsibilities to his wife.

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You misunderstand the purpose of this thread. The purpose of the thread is supposed to be about what to do when this evil happens. How are we to react from a Biblical perspective. The story of Reba's sister is the kind of story that would never happen if abused women simply followed society's advice.

Wives are not slaves nor property. The passages cited are irrelevant.

What about this common sense?

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More like uncommon nonsense on your part not God's. What does this have to do with spousal abuse?

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man finds a girl who is a virgin, who is not engaged, and seizes her and lies with her and they are discovered, then the man who lay with her shall give to the girl's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall become his wife because he has violated her; he cannot divorce her all his days.

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Why is he compelled to marry her? Because when he lay with her, they became one flesh. He stole what was not his. The fifty shekels was punitive because he VIOLATED her and stole the father's right to arrange her marriage.

Secondly, this verse has nothing to do with a present situation for neither a Christian nor an unbeliever are subject to the Law.

Third, the following is neither expressed or implied in this verse:

1. Rape is okay.
2. She must have been asking for it.
3. She got what she deserved.
4. He ought to smack her around when they get home because she is a bad girl.
5. He can keep raping or abusing her once married.

Spend some time in Genesis 34. The remedy for rape there cost a lot of men their lives.

I'm sure that I've infuriated you by this point, so I see no purpose in writing more until later.

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I don't know if you've gotten to Dina yet, but I'm about to blow a head gasket with your posts. If your only goal is to infuriate, you need to find a different issue. What's your motivation? Where's your heart?

Why is he compelled to marry her? Because when he lay with her, they became one flesh. He stole what was not his. The fifty shekels was punitive because he VIOLATED her and stole the father's right to arrange her marriage.

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Yes, they became one.

Secondly, this verse has nothing to do with a present situation for neither a Christian nor an unbeliever are subject to the Law.

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I agree. It was in response to Dina's statements. I find it a little strange that you seem to accuse me of bringing up the verses that Dina brought up. If you have a problem with those verses being used concerning this subject, then it seems more approriate that you make that comment in a response to her not me.

Third, the following is neither expressed or implied in this verse:

1. Rape is okay.
2. She must have been asking for it.
3. She got what she deserved.
4. He ought to smack her around when they get home because she is a bad girl.
5. He can keep raping or abusing her once married.

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I believe that it is implied that he can continue to have sex with her after he married her. True, I do not believe it would have been classified as rape, but I believe there are those today who would classify it as such.

I don't know if you've gotten to Dina yet, but I'm about to blow a head gasket with your posts. If your only goal is to infuriate, you need to find a different issue. What's your motivation? Where's your heart?

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My original was not to infuriate, to tell you the truth, it was not my goal with Dina either. I was simply giving a counter example that I believe would have that result. The counter example was used to show that her statement had problems.


As to what was my original intent, see what I wrote about Reba's sister.

If I stood by and let my neighbor beat thier spouse to a pulp I would feel just as guilty if I did the beating myself. The bible teaches us to "love our neighbors". Its not love standing by and letting this go on!

Any suggetion how to bibically stop spousel abuse? (I have alot of ideas) But #1 for me, it would be calling the police. That is a good start.

Proverbs 31:8-9
8 Open thy mouth for the dumb in the cause of all such as are appointed to destruction.

9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.

BTW, Just to let you know I'm not infuriated yet. Jesus is my peace.

BTW, He kept a woman caught in adultry from being stoned to death by changing the subject and by getting the people who were going to do the stoning on their selfs. Got the woman out of harms way.

You'd think sooner or later we'd grow a brain like that?

You cite one example. Let me offer these:

In 2001, the U.S. Department of Justice found that more than half a million American women (588,490 women) were victims of nonfatal violence committed by intimate partners. That same year, women accounted for 85 percent of the victims of intimate partner violence.

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Domestic violence and the police: Studies in Detroit and Kansas City (pp. 22-33). Washington, DC: Police Foundation.

This study was undertaken to determine whether or not there was a relationship between prior domestic disturbances and subsequent homicides or aggravated assaults. Findings indicated that in the two years preceding any reported homicide or assault, police had been at the address at least once in 85% of the cases and at least five times in approximately 50% of the cases. In addition, the violence was preceded by threats in over 50% of the cases. These findings indicated that police do have a significant early warning system in these cases thereby allowing for better and effective intervention techniques.

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Can God change the heart of an abuser? Absolutely.

Can God heal a marriage ravaged by spousal abuse? Absolutely.

Can it happen while the abused is at a safe distance? Absolutely. Unfortunately, 85% of the time the violence escalates

Have you read A Tender Road Home? I venture to guess they had their times apart. If Susie Luchsinger never removed herself and her children from potential peril, I would have little interest in anything else she would have to say.

Have you ever sat with a woman with teeth knocked out, blood coming out of her nose, and eyes blackened? Have you ever sat with a church elder who was known for his public piety who had, in secret, repeatedly molested his daughters for decades?

If you have a problem with those verses being used concerning this subject, then it seems more approriate [sic]that you make that comment in a response to her not me.

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Okay. Hey, Dina, what he said.

Music4Him,

If I stood by and let my neighbor beat thier spouse to a pulp I would feel just as guilty if I did the beating myself. The bible teaches us to "love our neighbors". Its not love standing by and letting this go on!

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I agree.

Any suggetion how to bibically stop spousel abuse? (I have alot of ideas) But #1 for me, it would be calling the police. That is a good start.

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The question is more "what should be a spouses response". I know that the title of the thread isn't quite right. In any case, I know your opinion.

BTW, He kept a woman caught in adultry from being stoned to death by changing the subject and by getting the people who were going to do the stoning on their selfs. Got the woman out of harms way.

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Yes, Jesus asked the one without sin to cast the first stone. Perhaps some here should apply this to those who commit the sin of abuse.

I know it isn't popular, but it wasn't popular for Christ to stand up for the adultress either.

Padredurand,

Can God change the heart of an abuser? Absolutely.

Can God heal a marriage ravaged by spousal abuse? Absolutely.

Can it happen while the abused is at a safe distance? Absolutely. Unfortunately, 85% of the time the violence escalates

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Are you dealing with Christian women here who have the heart to stay for Christ? Probably not. As I said earlier, I would say that most women could not pull this off. That is why I said that most women should get away. Or did you miss that part?

Have you read A Tender Road Home? I venture to guess they had their times apart. If Susie Luchsinger never removed herself and her children from potential peril, I would have little interest in anything else she would have to say.

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No, I did not read the book. As I said, my wife relayed the story to me. I did a google search and found the link to support the validity of the story.

I wouldn't expect you to have any interest in what she said, except in the light of how it reflects what the Bible says.

Have you ever sat with a woman with teeth knocked out, blood coming out of her nose, and eyes blackened? Have you ever sat with a church elder who was known for his public piety who had, in secret, repeatedly molested his daughters for decades?

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No, I have not. My sister in law had the misfortune of being molested by her father who happened to be an elder.

The problem is that you're not attacking my words. You are attacking what the Bible says. As was pointed out earlier, the Bible never promises to keep us safe from abuse. On the contrary, the Bible says that we will be abused. As I pointed out earlier, the abuse the wife would be taking would be for Christ since it would be an attempt to win her husband over. It seems to me that you really don't want to hear that.

The person who does the abuse is mentally sick (or posessed?) and needs help. (I know it is hard to have mercy for someone who will abuse another.) But first the person who is being hurt needs to get out of that situation and get their self strong. I cannot see the relationship being repaired if changes arn't made i.e. putting God first in the relationship.

Yes, Jesus asked the one without sin to cast the first stone. Perhaps some here should apply this to those who commit the sin of abuse.

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Jesus said that to prevent harm to the woman not to protect the stone throwers.

What does God expect from the abuser?
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit;A broken and a contrite heart, O God, You will not despise. Psalm 51:17

That is a rare quality to find in someone driven by control and power. That is not to say I would never counsel a man involved in an abusive situation. I just can't see me holding his hand and saying, "Poor misunderstood baby."

Back to your OP: It's a long road from that first hit to reconciliation. The sin is forgiven in an instant. It takes a lifetime to unravel the consequences and effects of sin. Just ask David.

On the contrary, the Bible says that we will be abused.

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No. You are wrong. It says we will be persecuted for His sake. For a wife beater to say he smacks his wife around because she is a Christian will also smack her around for wearing curlers outside, burning toast or any excuse. If the woman stayed in peril in the hope her husband would be won for Christ and he killed her, she is not a martyr. She would be a murder victim. That dog won't hunt.

[ February 12, 2005, 08:28 PM: Message edited by: padredurand ]

I have two relatives who are in law enforcement. Both have said that a man who beats his wife is a coward and that he would never hurt another man.

Music4Him,

(I know it is hard to have mercy for someone who will abuse another.)

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Will? Or did?

Even if the abuser continues to abuse, how many times did Jesus say we are supposed to forgive? Seven times?

By the way, does this mean I am saying the wife must stay and get beat again? No, I am not saying that.

I cannot see the relationship being repaired if changes arn't made i.e. putting God first in the relationship.

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I agree, God is the solution. I simply don't see how going to jail is a prerequisite for turning from sin and turning to God.


Padredurand,

Jesus said that to prevent harm to the woman not to protect the stone throwers.

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Yes, this is true. Do you believe that this statement should only apply to women who are in danger?

What does God expect from the abuser?
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit;A broken and a contrite heart, O God, You will not despise. Psalm 51:17

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How is this different from any other sinner?

That is a rare quality to find in someone driven by control and power. That is not to say I would never counsel a man involved in an abusive situation. I just can't see me holding his hand and saying, "Poor misunderstood baby."

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So how is this different than any other sinner?

Back to your OP: It's a long road from that first hit to reconciliation.

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Yes, it is difficult to forgive.

The sin is forgiven in an instant.

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Not from the heart. If it was, then it wouldn't be a problem.

It takes a lifetime to unravel the consequences and effects of sin. Just ask David.

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How is this any different from all sins?

I have two relatives who are in law enforcement. Both have said that a man who beats his wife is a coward and that he would never hurt another man.

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Still casting stones I see.