Are there specific crimes? Technically all crimes should be reported. Some professions have a legal obligation to report specific crimes ie: theft, drugs, abuse.
I do 65 in a 65 and that isn't reportable.
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Biblical Solution to Spousal Abuse
- Thread starter Eladar
- Start date
I do 65 in a 65 and that isn't reportable.
Eladar wrote:
>>Same problem, divorce does not solve the problem and the same ends can be achieved short of divorce.<<
In some instances, no divorce doesn't solve it. Sometimes a restraining order will solve it. But in alot of cases, divorce makes it easier to get away and hide, which unfortunatly is what alot of victims of spouse abuse HAVE to do.
>>Same problem, divorce does not solve the problem and the same ends can be achieved short of divorce.<<
In some instances, no divorce doesn't solve it. Sometimes a restraining order will solve it. But in alot of cases, divorce makes it easier to get away and hide, which unfortunatly is what alot of victims of spouse abuse HAVE to do.
Prov. 26:12, "Do you see a man wise in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him."
If a man who abuses his wife does not take responsibility and blames his actions on her he is worse than a fool.
The fool says in his heart there is no God.
Any man who will abuse his wife and not consider God's wrath is worse than a fool.There is more hope for a fool than for him.
The best way to deal with an abuser in the church is for some men to confront him directly about his sin. If he will not change then bring it before the church. The problem is we have too many whimpy so called church leaders who will not confront these kind of men.
If a man who abuses his wife does not take responsibility and blames his actions on her he is worse than a fool.
The fool says in his heart there is no God.
Any man who will abuse his wife and not consider God's wrath is worse than a fool.There is more hope for a fool than for him.
The best way to deal with an abuser in the church is for some men to confront him directly about his sin. If he will not change then bring it before the church. The problem is we have too many whimpy so called church leaders who will not confront these kind of men.
Just one verse of scripture to support this statement and I'll retire the field.
tamborine lady
Active Member
1 Cor-10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:
11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.
12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.
13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.
The bold writing gives you the answer The Lord says for them not to separate, but if they do,don't remarry. Then it says "if he be pleased to dwell with her".
If a man is beating, or abusing his wife in any way, he is obviosly NOT PLEASED to dwell with her! God has called us to peace, What peace is there in a house where there is spousel abuse.
So, in a perfect world, she should leave him till he straightens up, and if he doesn't, then live alone and raise the kids.
But thats in a perfect world. The fact is that people do leave, get a divorce, marry again, and God forgives them!
It is not the way God set it up, but people are not perfect. How do you know when you get married if you're marrying an abuser?
So, there's your scripture. There's the answer you wanted.
If you know this women, tell her to get out NOW.
Working for Jesus.
Tam
I remembered reading this passage below would this be concidered along the abuse lines? If so she can be released and remarry in this situation.
Deuteronomy 24:1-4
1 When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house. 2 And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife. 3 And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;
Still in an abusive situation where the man hates the woman, it would be up to the abuser to give her the divorce. Right?
Deuteronomy 24:1-4
1 When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house. 2 And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife. 3 And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;
Still in an abusive situation where the man hates the woman, it would be up to the abuser to give her the divorce. Right?
tamborine lady,
Now to what I was going to post when I came on line:
I've decided it would be more helpful to clarify what this thread is about as opposed to going around in circles, so here is my attempt:
It seems to me that Christians basically fall into one of 4 categories on this subject:
1->There are those Christians who believe that God has preserved a special place in hell for those who at one point abuse their spouses (read wives). There should be no consideration given to these evil people and that any man who has ever struck his wife, for any reason at all, should be thrown in jail to rot until he dies and gets sent to hell.
2->Then there is another group of Christians that is not as extreme but still believes in their hearts that there is little to no hope of an abuser changing his stripes, therefore the only reasonable thing to do is to teach women to dump their abusive husbands and escape while they still can. Cut and run is the only viable solution that ensures the safety of women.
3->There is another group of Christians that believes abusers are human and that abuse is a form of sin that needs to be dealt with. There is hope for those who abuse their spouses (once again read wives) and that we should work to cure the problem instead of simply punishing the abuser. Although an abuser may be arrested at one point for his actions, this is no solution. The best solution is to fix the situation and exactly what steps need to be taken should be decided on a case by case basis.
4->There is still another group that believes the husband can behave however he wishes toward his family. The wife simply needs to accept this as a part of life and try to do better so that she doesn’t get beat.
It seems to me that those who fall into categories 1&4 are simply hateful people who have a totally screwed up view of reality. There is no possible way to communicate with these people. If such people post their views, all we can say is: “I see what you believe”
Those who have a realistic view of the situation fall into categories 2&3. I fall into category 3. It seems to me that so far those who disagree with me fall into category 2 with one or two possibly falling into category 1.
If we are to look at some of the difficult verses of the Bible and take them at face value, then category 3 is the view most consistent with the Bible. If we overlook certain verses and concentrate on verses that tell us to obey the laws of the land, then category 2 is the most consistent.
What I’m trying to deal with in this thread is how to apply the difficult scriptures properly so that those in category 4 can’t claim to be the only ones who choose to follow the Bible instead of the wisdom of man.
Instead, most of what I’ve had to deal with is people from categories 1 and 2 who feel it is their obligation to shout down any attempt to do anything but blame the abuser and tell women they must cut and run.
This is faulty logic. It is very possible that an abusive man is pleased to have someone to beat upon.
Now to what I was going to post when I came on line:
I've decided it would be more helpful to clarify what this thread is about as opposed to going around in circles, so here is my attempt:
It seems to me that Christians basically fall into one of 4 categories on this subject:
1->There are those Christians who believe that God has preserved a special place in hell for those who at one point abuse their spouses (read wives). There should be no consideration given to these evil people and that any man who has ever struck his wife, for any reason at all, should be thrown in jail to rot until he dies and gets sent to hell.
2->Then there is another group of Christians that is not as extreme but still believes in their hearts that there is little to no hope of an abuser changing his stripes, therefore the only reasonable thing to do is to teach women to dump their abusive husbands and escape while they still can. Cut and run is the only viable solution that ensures the safety of women.
3->There is another group of Christians that believes abusers are human and that abuse is a form of sin that needs to be dealt with. There is hope for those who abuse their spouses (once again read wives) and that we should work to cure the problem instead of simply punishing the abuser. Although an abuser may be arrested at one point for his actions, this is no solution. The best solution is to fix the situation and exactly what steps need to be taken should be decided on a case by case basis.
4->There is still another group that believes the husband can behave however he wishes toward his family. The wife simply needs to accept this as a part of life and try to do better so that she doesn’t get beat.
It seems to me that those who fall into categories 1&4 are simply hateful people who have a totally screwed up view of reality. There is no possible way to communicate with these people. If such people post their views, all we can say is: “I see what you believe”
Those who have a realistic view of the situation fall into categories 2&3. I fall into category 3. It seems to me that so far those who disagree with me fall into category 2 with one or two possibly falling into category 1.
If we are to look at some of the difficult verses of the Bible and take them at face value, then category 3 is the view most consistent with the Bible. If we overlook certain verses and concentrate on verses that tell us to obey the laws of the land, then category 2 is the most consistent.
What I’m trying to deal with in this thread is how to apply the difficult scriptures properly so that those in category 4 can’t claim to be the only ones who choose to follow the Bible instead of the wisdom of man.
Instead, most of what I’ve had to deal with is people from categories 1 and 2 who feel it is their obligation to shout down any attempt to do anything but blame the abuser and tell women they must cut and run.
tamborine lady
Active Member
Eladar, you quoted me: tamborine lady,
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If a man is beating, or abusing his wife in any way, he is obviosly NOT PLEASED to dwell with her!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Then you said:
This is faulty logic. It is very possible that an abusive man is pleased to have someone to beat upon.
Tam says:
The faulty logic is YOURS my friend. Don't twist my post just so you can go on with your agenda.
Actually, if you read it and think about it, it is a perfectly logical answer to your last post.
Peace,
Tam
P.S. In my other post, I said: So, in a perfect world, she should leave him till he straightens up, and if he doesn't, then live alone and raise the kids.
That's giving him a chanch isn't it?
I'm not twisting your words. I simply stated why he could still be pleased to live with her. You simply wish to close your eyes to this.
Perfectly logical as long as you don't mind twisting scripture to fit what you believe about the issue.
Yes, and this the right thing to do in certain situations. I just don't believe it is the right thing to do in all situations. Each case is different that is why I do not believe in a one size fits all approach.
tamborine lady
Active Member
whatever
Yet everything you have said to this point clearly places you in category four. You have rejected every suggestion that the woman seeks safety, and insist that anyone who disagrees with you either presents an unbiblical view or has "twisted" scripture to suit their unbiblical view.
I have yet to read a single post that suggests the abuser should rot in jail until they get placed in the deepest recesses of hell. I have yet to read a post that suggests that divorce is the only solution to an abusive situation.
What I have seen is many posts filled with compassion and concern for a woman who is in a dangerous position. Show me just one verse of Scripture that says a woman who is being abused should stay in that immediate situation. You have said that she should remain in the hope she leads her husband to the Lord.
1 Peter 3:1-6
1 In the same way, you wives, be submissive to your own husbands so that even if any of them are disobedient to the word, they may be won without a word by the behavior of their wives,
2 as they observe your chaste and respectful behavior.
Chaste and respectful behavior is not the same as cowering in fear. Will the man be won if she never cries out because after all the man can be won without a word.
3 Your adornment must not be merely external—braiding the hair, and wearing gold jewelry, or putting on dresses;
4 but let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God.
There is a big difference between a gentle and quiet spirit and a spirit that has been broken into submission. The only thing an abused woman has to hide is her "dirty little secret".
5 For in this way in former times the holy women also, who hoped in God, used to adorn themselves, being submissive to their own husbands;
6 just as Sarah obeyed Abraham, calling him lord, and you have become her children if you do what is right without being frightened by any fear.
In case you missed it:without being frightened by any fear.without being frightened by any fear.without being frightened by any fear.without being frightened by any fear.without being frightened by any fear.!
We do have a responsibility to the abuser.
Ezekiel 3:18-20
18 “When I say to the wicked, ‘You will surely die,’ and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.
19 “Yet if you have warned the wicked and he does not turn from his wickedness or from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered yourself.
20 “Again, when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness and commits iniquity, and I place an obstacle before him, he will die; since you have not warned him, he shall die in his sin, and his righteous deeds which he has done shall not be remembered; but his blood I will require at your hand.
You see, God is a God of JUSTICE as well as mercy. If I must be in error I will error on the side of mercy toward the victim.
Really? What have I said?
I see it saying this: It is best if a woman stays with her husband. But if the wife is not able to do this then she can leave, but she is not to divorce.
Music4him said:If a man isn't doing what the Lord tells him to do evidently its wrong....right?
To which I replied: Of course.
I am with Jim when it comes to what a perfect person should do. The problem is, there aren't too many people who are actually perfect when it comes to this matter. As a matter of fact, I'd say there are very very few...I'm sorry, but I do not believe people should be forced into a position of trying to be perfect, when God does allow the window.
If the desire is to save the marriage, then I do not know if throwing the guy in jail is the best solution. How difficult is it to find a job when one has a record? How much resentment is added on when the wife has the husband arrested?
I know these are not concerns if the wife simply wants out. But I believe these are valid concerns if the desire is to heal the screwed up union. I believe everyone would agree that when there is abuse, there is a screwed up union. One part of the body simply does not naturally attack the other half.
You said: A man who beats his wife does not beat her to persecute her for her faith in Jesus Christ. He beats her because he is an unrestrained bully. To equate the two is absurd.
To which I replied; I'm not sure you are correct here. If the wife hangs around in attempt to save her husband from damnation, then it could be argued that she was being beaten for her faith in Jesus Christ. My wife was telling me about Reba McEntire's sister who did hang around and her husband did come around and no longer abuses her. I'm sure that you find this example ridiculous, but that does not mean it could never happen. It took 15 years, but it did happen.
Yes, Jesus asked the one without sin to cast the first stone. Perhaps some here should apply this to those who commit the sin of abuse. I know it isn't popular, but it wasn't popular for Christ to stand up for the adultress either.
Can you find one post where I said that a man has the right to treat his wife however he sees fit and that the wife simply needs to get used to it.
Let's see what else I've said in in response to this from tamborine lady:So, in a perfect world, she should leave him till he straightens up, and if he doesn't, then live alone and raise the kids.
To which I replied: Yes, and this the right thing to do in certain situations. I just don't believe it is the right thing to do in all situations. Each case is different that is why I do not believe in a one size fits all approach.
I never said anyone in this thread believed this. I said that I thought a couple might, but that is not the same.
Evidently you have not been reading the solution that Dina prescribed. When that is the only solution given, it is easily understood to be the solution.
continued...
If the wife hangs around in attempt to save her husband from damnation, then it could be argued that she was being beaten for her faith in Jesus Christ. My wife was telling me about Reba McEntire's sister who did hang around and her husband did come around and no longer abuses her. I'm sure that you find this example ridiculous, but that does not mean it could never happen. It took 15 years, but it did happen.
On the contrary, I said that most women should not.
Why do you continue to create strawmen to knock down? I've already explained this, but I'll quote what I said again:
If the wife hangs around in attempt to save her husband from damnation, then it could be argued that she was being beaten for her faith in Jesus Christ. My wife was telling me about Reba McEntire's sister who did hang around and her husband did come around and no longer abuses her. I'm sure that you find this example ridiculous, but that does not mean it could never happen. It took 15 years, but it did happen.
