"Well, so far we have encountered points where you think they believe something, and I think they believe another. There is a good chance that you are experiencing a 'personal' belief of a Catholic (which may differ from the official position), and I am going off what I have read, from a theology student of a Fransican university, and ALL the sites that he has pointed me to."
If you are going off of what you have read from a theology student perhaps it is the opinion of the theology student? I am going off of what I read in the catachism and then bouncing that off of a priest, two theology students (each from a different rite), and several laypeople. Nonetheless, I am providing references to where the catachism talks about something, which is of course the official doctrine of the church.
"Has anyone shown you what is wrong with Salvation by works?"
Salvation by the works of the mosaic law would be a really bad thing, cause it doesn't work. I'm glad they don't believe in that though. From what I understand they confirm Ephesians 2:8-9, John 3:16, and Romans 3:23-26. Yet they also confirm that faith WITHOUT works is dead, and that we must perservere to the end. They affirm that as the bible says, salvation is by faith working in love.
What about praying to the dead?
Actually they pray to the living. Those who are in heaven aren't dead. They are very much alive and face to face with God. Remember, the Bible tells us to offer up intercessions.
"What language barrier? This is ENGLISH speaking Catholics calling her this!"
When I say language barrier I mean, what you think a word means, verses what definition they give it.
"I will, if you can show me that the word mediator and redeemer means something other than mediator and redeemer!"
They believe that Mary, like the other saints that they ask for prayer from, brings our prayers to Jesus. They do not believe Mary is a "mediator" between us and God. Like if you were to ask a friend to pray for you, they believe that she will pray for us. (Ask things of God on our behalf)
"I didn't ever say they believed that Mary was 'Savior' with Jesus. I do not recall anyone EVER saying THAT."
Sorry, I meant it purely as a hypothetical example.
"But they DO call her coredeemer and comediator."
co=with. They believe that she played a part in our salvation (the redemption of the world) by saying "yes" to God. She brought the Savior into the world (can I get an Amen?). And that is what they mean when they say that she "played a part in our salvation". She never paid for one of our sins. She didn't hang on the cross for us. She simply allowed God to use her and work through her.
"Which gives her communicative ability between God and man"
No, she has to go to Jesus too just like we do.
"And the redeemer part, is really rediculous considering that if SHE hadn't have taken the task, someone else would have. It is really ludicrous to imply that her CONSENTING to God's Will makes her have a PART in the Redemption of mankind to God."
Do you also think it is luicrous to think that Moses played a part in the Jews freedom from Egypt by allowing God to work through him?
"People do God's Will ALL the time, all over the world. Why does it make HER special, that she consented to do God's Will?"
How many other people brought the Savior into the world? We believe she is special because the Bible tells us so- God's angel said "Hail Mary, Blessed are you among woman".
"The point was to see if Protestant churches had doctrines that connected them to the CC. Not to discuss the actual doctrines."
Of course they are connected. As you said- Luther WAS a Catholic monk :-D
"Then I was told that the 7 sacrements are necessary for Salvation."
Ah those. We should probably bring that discussion into a new thread as it is a huge one.
How does wafers add to salvation?
Read
THIS
Okay, so where is the problem?
"Why would I do that? No, I am talking about the kneeling before things OTHER than God"
I asked because you weren't clear on what you meant. You mean like kneeling before an alter an alter of God? Or something like that?
I don't think it is necessarily wrong to kneel before someone else- like how people kneel before the Queen of England. It simply shows her reverance and respect. Sure doesn't mean that they worship her, or place her above God or make her their God.
