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@JonC as you have seen from the responses the calvinisst view requires punishment for sins whereas the bible points to forgiveness of sins. Those that trust in God are forgiven, Eph 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved through faith,... Isa 45:22 Turn to Me and be saved, all the ends...

Have you even made the effort to look at the foundations of your view? I doubt that you have so I really cannot take you seriously. All I see from you is a parroting of the same calvinist line. When you oppose scripture and say it has another meaning than what is written then you are...

I have done just that and all you do is say I do not accept the calvinist view. That is true as I hold the word of God as we find in the bible not the altered view that you are trying to promote. Your particular view comes from the 4th century man-made view of augustine and later calvin and...

Z all you do is parrot the teachings of other calvinists. Have you ever taken the time to look at the foundations of your religion? I doubt that you have. Calvinism is not the gospel Z. That is your first mistake. I have tried to point you back to the truth as found in the word of God but you...

Trusting in God human-centric? You must be thinking of calvinism. That is the view where the person thinks they were so special that God picked them out for salvation over all the rest of humanity. Now that is human-centric. Only God saves and He has chosen to save those that freely trust in...

So are you suggesting that only calvinists can be saved? Only two views of Calvinism "If Calvinism is an error: The reason most Christians reject it is because they have good discernment. If Calvinism is true: The ultimate reason most resist it is because God sovereignly and unchangeably...

On this we do agree Z.

Your understanding has to filter the word of God through the calvinist theory from the 4th century. My truth comes from the word of God as found in scripture, no filter needed.

Yes the truth of God's word will stand which is why I do not follow your man-made calvinist theory.

What is God's purpose @atpollard? That those that would repent and trust in Him would be saved. God is Omniscient and thus has full foreknowledge of all who would freely trust in Him. Those that trust in Him are predestined to be conformed to the image of His son. All are called but not all...

I know what the bible says Z. You have chosen to view His foreknowledge as causative where I see His foreknowledge as just what it says. He knew beforehand those that would freely trust in Him.

@Charlie24 you have to remember that for the calvinist the word of God is only understood by cherry picked verses. It seems the KY and Z cannot accept the truth of God's word in Ezekiel in regard to Exodus.

Just as you are selective in the version that you have used KY. Eze 20:35 And I will bring you into the wilderness of the people, and there will I plead with you face to face. Eze 20:36 Like as I pleaded with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I plead with you...

Do would seem you understand what those words means Z? omniscience noun the quality or state of being omniscient. infinite knowledge. foreknowledge noun knowledge of something before it exists or happens; prescience.

Then you have to deal with these words: Rom 9:27 And Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: "Though the number of the sons of Israel be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant of them will be saved; Rom 9:28 for the Lord will execute his sentence upon the earth fully and without cutting it short."

All people have the ability to believe but not all will believe.

They are responding to the drawing of God by other than the gospel. Act 10:35 "But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. NKJV Here in vs 35 we see the conditions for salvation in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted...

So @Marooncat79 your saying that God can be fooled by a persons heart. That's not the God we see in scripture is it? I am thankful that the God I serve does not need to hear words but looks at the heart.

Baptized in a non-RC church is not for salvation but is a public confession of you r faith in God. In the RCC it is for salvation. You can correct me on the RCC if I have that wrong. That is what I was told by friends who were RCC.

We are talking both OT & NT as God does not change. Calvinism, not even close. Calvinism, only a select group can be saved, Bible all of humanity can be saved. God desires all to come to Him and has provide the means for man to know Him. God is not limited by man opinions. Creation, so we...