Which point is that?
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1 Timothy 2:4 - "God wills ALL men to be saved"
- Thread starter ICHTHUS
- Start date
No worries. I even disagree with myself some times.Dr T you are one of my favorites on BB. I bow to your gift of wisdom, understanding and knowledge (Doesn't necessarily mean I fully agree).
HankD
You know what they say. When there are two baptists there are usually three opinions.
Right. By tomorrow there may be 4.No worries. I even disagree with myself some times.
You know what they say. When there are two baptists there are usually three opinions.
I remember a professor saying
"Class I am looking for students with only one hand.."
Puzzled looks...
You know, the ones who, when I ask a question, never say "on the other hand...".
HankD
Indeed we are all God's creation.
Are all of God's human creation adopted by God?
Ephesians 1:4-6
[4]Even before he made the world, God loved us and chose us in Christ to be holy and without fault in his eyes.
[5]God decided in advance to adopt us into his own family by bringing us to himself through Jesus Christ. This is what he wanted to do, and it gave him great pleasure.
[6]So we praise God for the glorious grace he has poured out on us who belong to his dear Son.
Which was?
THE HONEST REPROBATE.
1 John 5
9If we receive the testimony of men, the testimony of God is greater; for the testimony of God is this, that He has testified concerning His Son. 10The one who believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself; the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has given concerning His Son.11And the testimony is this, that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
John Calvin's Commentaries:
10. He that believeth not As the faithful possess this benefit, that they know themselves to be beyond the danger of erring, because they have God as their foundation; so he makes the ungodly to be guilty of extreme blasphemy, because they charge God with falsehood. Doubtless nothing is more valued by God than his own truth, therefore no wrong more atrocious can be done to him, than to rob him of this honor. Then in order to induce us to believe, he takes an argument from the opposite side; for if to make God a liar be a horrible and execrable impiety, because then what especially belongs to him is taken away, who would not dread to withhold faith from the gospel, in which God would have himself to be counted singularly true and faithful? This ought to be carefully observed.
Some wonder why God commends faith so much, why unbelief is so severely condemned. But the glory of God is implicated in this; for since he designed to shew a special instance of his truth in the gospel, all they who reject Christ there offered to them, leave nothing to him. Therefore, though we may grant that a man in other parts of his life is like an angel, yet his sanctity is diabolical as long as he rejects Christ. Thus we see some under the Papacy vastly pleased with the mere mask of sanctity, while they still most obstinately resist the gospel. Let us then understand, that it is the beginning of true religion, obediently to embrace this doctrine, which he has so strongly confirmed by his testimony
"all they who reject Christ there offered to them, leave nothing to him." --John Calvin.
One calls God a Liar by rejecting Jesus who God gave for THEM for ETERNAL LIFE.
If a "reprobate" says God did not let Jesus die for me, according to scripture HE IS A LIAR.
But our extremist buddies here would say the REBROBATE is Honest and telling the TRUTH, that Jesus did not die for him!
You have to make a case that John is in error because the reprobate is telling the TRUTH because Jesus Christ was not offered to them.
1 John 5
9If we receive the testimony of men, the testimony of God is greater; for the testimony of God is this, that He has testified concerning His Son. 10The one who believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself; the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has given concerning His Son.11And the testimony is this, that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
John Calvin's Commentaries:
10. He that believeth not As the faithful possess this benefit, that they know themselves to be beyond the danger of erring, because they have God as their foundation; so he makes the ungodly to be guilty of extreme blasphemy, because they charge God with falsehood. Doubtless nothing is more valued by God than his own truth, therefore no wrong more atrocious can be done to him, than to rob him of this honor. Then in order to induce us to believe, he takes an argument from the opposite side; for if to make God a liar be a horrible and execrable impiety, because then what especially belongs to him is taken away, who would not dread to withhold faith from the gospel, in which God would have himself to be counted singularly true and faithful? This ought to be carefully observed.
Some wonder why God commends faith so much, why unbelief is so severely condemned. But the glory of God is implicated in this; for since he designed to shew a special instance of his truth in the gospel, all they who reject Christ there offered to them, leave nothing to him. Therefore, though we may grant that a man in other parts of his life is like an angel, yet his sanctity is diabolical as long as he rejects Christ. Thus we see some under the Papacy vastly pleased with the mere mask of sanctity, while they still most obstinately resist the gospel. Let us then understand, that it is the beginning of true religion, obediently to embrace this doctrine, which he has so strongly confirmed by his testimony
"all they who reject Christ there offered to them, leave nothing to him." --John Calvin.
One calls God a Liar by rejecting Jesus who God gave for THEM for ETERNAL LIFE.
If a "reprobate" says God did not let Jesus die for me, according to scripture HE IS A LIAR.
But our extremist buddies here would say the REBROBATE is Honest and telling the TRUTH, that Jesus did not die for him!
You have to make a case that John is in error because the reprobate is telling the TRUTH because Jesus Christ was not offered to them.
Then you agree. God does not adopt all humanity, which means that some are predestined to eternal life while others are destined to hell.
Nope, I let the text speak for itself. Whether you allow the text to be what it is is another question.
What I note is that you refused to answer my question.
Does God adopt all humanity? The text is right there for you to answer my question.
Adopt in the context is no doubt a reference to regeneration.
There is no rule that requires me to answer your question.
But to satisfy what seems to be a question motivated by a Pharisaical attitude; the answer is - no He does not adopt the entire human race. The remainder of those not adopted are not technically destined for "hell" but are ultimately destined to be cast into the lake of fire in the state of eternal separation from God.
Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
HankD
In this context the word means very much as we use it today. As an adoptive father I am intimately familiar with the process.
1. First choose who we are going to adopt. Of all the children in the world, we chose her. (Chosen in Him.)
2. Legally making the child ours by issuing a new birth certificate showing me as father. (At our new birth we become fully His.)
3. Making her our full and complete heir who, one day, well possess all we have. (Our glorification - the full realization of our inheritance in Him.)
Lot's of good preaching in those adoption verses.
I would add. For all the explicit passages dealing new birth and adoption, I don't remember an explicit one dealing with disinheritance.
In this context the word means very much as we use it today. As an adoptive father, I am intimately familiar with the process.
1. First, choose who we are going to adopt. Of all the children in the world, we chose her. (Chosen in Him.)
2. Legally making the child ours by issuing a new birth certificate showing me as father. (At our new birth we become fully His.)
3. Making her our full and complete heir who, one day, well possess all we have. (Our glorification - the full realization of our inheritance in Him.)
Lot's of good preaching in those adoption verses.
Excellent point! Once a child of God always a child of God!
Right. Adoption is referring to regeneration and as hard as it seems for you to accept, predestination to heaven means that those not destined to heaven are...not going to heaven, but to hell.
This takes place because God as the Sovereign King makes His choice purely because He can. There is no reason to be proud of being chosen because there is nothing of value in us that God might choose us. Instead it is humbling that God would choose us wretches from other wretches. We praise God and thank Him eternally.
They used bible quotes to back that up
Who worships calvin? Dumbest excuse from anti calvins
That brings up an interesting question. What did our daughter do that caused us to adopt her? Answer: nothing. Absolutely nothing.
What do we do that causes God to adopt us? Same answer.
What did we do that caused our physical birth? Nothing.
What did we do that caused our spiritual birth? Same answer.
Agreed. But I certainly experienced both my physical and spiritual births.That brings up an interesting question. What did our daughter do that caused us to adopt her? Answer: nothing. Absolutely nothing.
What do we do that causes God to adopt us? Same answer.
What did we do that caused our physical birth? Nothing.
What did we do that caused our spiritual birth? Same answer.
Don't quite remember the physical.
HankD