A question of headship and leadership

The passage says that which is perfect or complete. The complete revelation of God has come.

What you believe the gift of healing isn't what the Scriptures are referring to as healing. The bolded part is where they had the gift of healing. No one today has that.

That's not the gift of tongues as mentioned in Scripture. The gift was a sudden knowing of a language, not learning the language.

Well, as I just showed, you don't seem to believe in the sign gifts either. God healing people doesn't equal someone with the ability to heal someone. People knowing a foreign language isn't equal to someone having the gift of tongues.

 

I was unable to get back yesterday to this scintillating discussion. However, JBH, I disagree that you showed me anything other than your opinion, which disagrees with mine. You see, the problem is, many people tend to close their minds to any other possibilities rather than the one they stand upon. Me, I stand upon the Rock, and know that God, the Father, is MORE than able to do or will anything He desires at any time He desires. He made a donkey talk, He raised the dead, He moved a two-ton stone, He turned water into wine....He can do anything He desires. I think He can also still use people in the manner in which He desires....people who are committed and dedicated, open to God's Will in their lives. That includes healing, tongues or anything else.
Until the day Christ Jesus steps foot on this earth once again, when His work is complete, when He ushers in the Millenial Kingdom and He rules and reigns....then will all be perfect and complete.

We tend to think of signs and miracles as huge earthshattering things. Why does it have to be? Isn't hearing the gospel for the first time in your native tongue a huge thing? Isn't having Doctor's Without Borders come to your little African village and being able to do surgery on a little native girl with a cleft palate a miracle of healing? You see, I believe THESE are the sign gifts today. When that precious little girl can smile at her mother and father they're more willing to listen to the Gospel over the village witch doctor. When that missionary comes to a jungle village and can speak the language they're open to listening and accepting. THOSE are today's miracles....those are the sign gifts if we simply stop to accept them.

 

Amen, on this I agree and why we must walk so carefully, talk honestly, and be about the Master's business. It's why I can not, or will not be silent.

 

oops...duplicate post

 

Did you rewrite the Bible? Here is one place where the gifts are listed:

And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. (1 Corinthians 12:28)

I believe you have the same Bible that I have. We can't change what it says. They are the same gifts that are written there, and the sign gifts and the revelatory gifts have ceased.

 

But he doesn't do those miracles now does he?
Who walks on water today?
Who has power to calm the sea, instantly?
Who has the power to raise the dead once they are buried?
Who has the power to change water into wine?

What was Jesus doing. He was doing miracles that no one else could do, demonstrating his deity. Even after that they still rejected him.

God can heal, but there is no such thing as the gift of healing today. That is a totally separate issue than believing that God can heal. That is what I emphasized from the beginning.

As for tongues, I challenged you to show me one person in the entire earth that has the Biblical gift of speaking in tongues (actual foreign languages, previously unknown and unheard to them).

If you are speaking of:
But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. (1 Corinthians 13:10)
The word perfect means complete, and it is referring to the Word of God which was completed at the end of the first century. At that time the sign gifts such as prophecy, tongues, revelatory knowledge, tongues, healing, miracles, etc. all ceased. They don't happen any more. Demonstrate that they do. Remember they are gifts.

It is not a miracle. A miracle is supernatural--above the natural--when the natural is suspended. God suspended the natural laws of gravity when he came walking on water and bidded Peter to do the same. The fact that He could walk on water was a miracle--supernatural--above the realm of the laws of nature. That is what a miracle is. We take this word and make it too common that we lose its significance.

No, it is God using a doctor to heal someone. It might even be an answer to prayer. But it is not a miracle.

That is a natural response. It is not a miracle.

Those are not sign gifts. I am on the mission field now, as I post. I have to speak another language that I struggled with to learn. That is not a gift. God did not give me the gift of tongues. Nevertheless many have heard and listened, and accepted. These are not miracles. This is a fulfillment of the Great Commission, something every Christian ought to be involved in.

 

I showed you that what you are saying are the sign gifts are not the sign gifts. Someone learning a language is not what happened at Pentecost when they received the gift of tongues.