A woman teaching men?

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

Do you actually see men and women as part of a military structure where a jerk of a man can command a woman to do whatever he wishes because of rank of command?

Men and women are part of an undeniable hierarchy, and protestations can do nothing to alter God's hierarchy. A man cannot command a woman to do anything. A man can teach a woman and in matters of teaching God has made plain that men are of higher rank than women.

A husband on the other hand has "command authority" over only his wife and children and only insofar as his commands are Biblical. I.E he doesn't get to ask his wife to proposition the neighbor, or to wear men's clothing.

And yes, if the husband is a jerk the wife is told by God's inspired text to submit and obey such a jerk. Peter explains your exact example.
"Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;" 1 Peter 3:1

That mentality in the military lead to a lot of dead officers in Vietnam at the hands of "friendly fire."

Clearly God wasn't aware of this when He inspired Peter to write the above verse. Perhaps you need to correct Him?

Perhaps you can point me toward the Bible passage showing the man as lieutenant and the woman as sergeant while the kids as privates.

You have a verse on submissive wives winning their husbands to Christ through outstanding submission as an example for the family government, but if you'd like to see a similar rank structure in the Church Government:

"We ask you, brothers, to respect those who labor among you and are over you in the Lord and admonish you" 1 Thessalonians 5:12

"And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:35

Your rank categories in parentheses.
Pastor > Husband (Lieutenant) > Wife (Sergeant) > Children (Privates)

 

[Squire Robertsson]

I've always thought of my wife aka Herself as my Executive Officer (Number 1). That puts a certain burden on me as the Captian.

 

[5 point Gillinist]

And those who argue against male headship and leadership are trying to distort and rewrite the bible today!

That seems to happen regularly

 

[AustinC]

Men and women are part of an undeniable hierarchy, and protestations can do nothing to alter God's hierarchy. A man cannot command a woman to do anything. A man can teach a woman and in matters of teaching God has made plain that men are of higher rank than women.

A husband on the other hand has "command authority" over only his wife and children and only insofar as his commands are Biblical. I.E he doesn't get to ask his wife to proposition the neighbor, or to wear men's clothing.

And yes, if the husband is a jerk the wife is told by God's inspired text to submit and obey such a jerk. Peter explains your exact example.
"Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;" 1 Peter 3:1


Clearly God wasn't aware of this when He inspired Peter to write the above verse. Perhaps you need to correct Him?


You have a verse on submissive wives winning their husbands to Christ through outstanding submission as an example for the family government, but if you'd like to see a similar rank structure in the Church Government:

"We ask you, brothers, to respect those who labor among you and are over you in the Lord and admonish you" 1 Thessalonians 5:12

"And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church." 1 Corinthians 14:35

Your rank categories in parentheses.
Pastor > Husband (Lieutenant) > Wife (Sergeant) > Children (Privates)

There is role expectations given by God. "Command authority" is your law enforcement culture being added where God does not speak that way.
Women can, and do teach us many things. Women, in fact, are the main teachers in the traditional house as they raise and train the children in most circumstances. Reynolds, you are a product of your mama. You were subject under her and taught by her, even as a man.
You have created a man-made authority structure of command that is not so cut and dried in the Bible. You are welcome to such a military approach in your family, if the family is on board with it and functions without abuse under it.
I think your demand of utter silence on women teaching is not what Paul was teaching regarding women's roles. Why? Because of the roles we see of Christian women in the book of Acts we know they had an active voice in the growth of the church and we know they had greater empowerment in the church than they did in Roman society or local societies.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

That argument always baffles me. It presupposes that the men were somehow more educated than the women when it was both groups that were heavily into pagan worship.
Yes, it is for all time. Paul would have no reason to mention created order, or the fact that it was Eve who was deceived, not Adam - Adam willingly went into sin by following the woman who had usurped his role as leader. Aside from the fact that God taught Adam personally, He did not teach Eve but intended for Adam to shepherd her.

Question: Have you ever experienced an inspiring, knowledgeable, woman who could lead, teach and inspire a congregation because I have not. Please let me explain. I was raised in the RCC institution for 34 years and was never inspired, except for one priest who walked the town and visited with us primarily because my mom was a widow and my sister was cerebral palsy. Other than that, not inspiring, just same old same old. Years later, my wife and I would attend various Protestant churches, some bringing on board women pastors with various degrees of competencies still all pretty bad at inspiring. Even a female Methodist Bishop proved really bad leading me to wonder if there was some insight into Paul’s teachings about women pastors… and I still wonder.

Now besides that, I’m a fan of women. They raised me, mentored me, protected me, befriended me and always were my biggest supporters. So it always made me want to root for women in any job where they could excel but now I’m really wondering about their abilities in pastoring and teaching a Christian flock. Perhaps they are there to nurture, to love and to be model Christian’s to love and emulate… that’s a job in itself.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I've always thought of my wife aka Herself as my Executive Officer (Number 1). That puts a certain burden on me as the Captian.

Conversely I see my wife as my equal partner with insight into things that I’m immune to. My mother did much to raise us without the help of a husband… I saw her grow stronger and more complex as time went on( hard to explain here) only she knew our welfare and survival was dependent on her. And it was a evolutionary process.

I will give you an example that happened yesterday… I’m up for a job that is good pay however it will require me to travel Allot and she is just really upset I might take the job as I’m not as young as I once was and would probably hurt myself. I on the other hand am willing to sacrifice a few years for the money and more economic freedom. See she is really looking out for me. And that’s what she does for the family… a concerned wife and mother, grandmother who is far more smart and sensitive than I will ever be.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

There is role expectations given by God. "Command authority" is your law enforcement culture being added where God does not speak that way.

I think you may be confusing me with Reynolds, but I will forgive you comparing a Firefighter to LEO haha. The "command authority" is the only parallel I can think of to God's hierarchy. It won't be a 1 for 1 comparison, but it's the best comparison.

Women can, and do teach us many things. Women, in fact, are the main teachers in the traditional house as they raise and train the children in most circumstances. Reynolds, you are a product of your mama. You were subject under her and taught by her, even as a man.

No major gripes with any of that, agree with 99% of it.

You have created a man-made authority structure of command that is not so cut and dried in the Bible. You are welcome to such a military approach in your family, if the family is on board with it and functions without abuse under it.
I think your demand of utter silence on women teaching is not what Paul was teaching regarding women's roles. Why? Because of the roles we see of Christian women in the book of Acts we know they had an active voice in the growth of the church and we know they had greater empowerment in the church than they did in Roman society or local societies.

I think it's fairly cut and dried in the Bible. The only grey area I can see is where the Civil Government/Church Government and Family Government intermix. I don't demand utter silence on women teaching. God demands utter silence on women assuming teaching authority over men. Women are commanded to teach younger women and children.

Women are welcome to have an active voice in the whole Church. They are not welcome to teach or Pastor in it, and to take it back to the OP, that includes crafting teaching plans for Sunday School used by men.

 

[AustinC]

I think you may be confusing me with Reynolds, but I will forgive you comparing a Firefighter to LEO haha. The "command authority" is the only parallel I can think of to God's hierarchy. It won't be a 1 for 1 comparison, but it's the best comparison.


No major gripes with any of that, agree with 99% of it.


I think it's fairly cut and dried in the Bible. The only grey area I can see is where the Civil Government/Church Government and Family Government intermix. I don't demand utter silence on women teaching. God demands utter silence on women assuming teaching authority over men. Women are commanded to teach younger women and children.

Women are welcome to have an active voice in the whole Church. They are not welcome to teach or Pastor in it.

Are you two different people? I apologize for titling you by @Reynolds, but you are mostly twins in your thinking.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

Are you two different people? I apologize for titling you by @Reynolds, but you are mostly twins in your thinking.

Yes, different people, no problem haha. We have better BBQ in Western NC than in Georgia, which I think is where Reynolds is.

 

[AustinC]

Yes, different people, no problem haha. We have better BBQ in Western NC than in Georgia, which I think is where Reynolds is.

Yet you both pale in comparison with Kansas City or Memphis...

 

[Reynolds]

Yes, different people, no problem haha. We have better BBQ in Western NC than in Georgia, which I think is where Reynolds is.

Y'all definitely have better pulled pork in western NC. The places around here chop it instead of pulling it. We both know why.

 

[Reynolds]

Yet you both pale in comparison with Kansas City or Memphis...

NC and SC low country have KC and Memphis beat on whole hog and pulled pork. I will give you KC and Memphis on ribs.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

NC and SC low country have KC and Memphis beat on whole hog and pulled pork. I will give you KC and Memphis on ribs.

Texas has beef barbecue… my personal favorite. Fla is ribs & beans ( not so much ).

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Texas has beef barbecue… my personal favorite. Fla is ribs & beans ( not so much ).

Georgia is my favorite for pecans (covered in Chocolate)

 

[5 point Gillinist]

Question: Have you ever experienced an inspiring, knowledgeable, woman who could lead, teach and inspire a congregation because I have not. Please let me explain. I was raised in the RCC institution for 34 years and was never inspired, except for one priest who walked the town and visited with us primarily because my mom was a widow and my sister was cerebral palsy. Other than that, not inspiring, just same old same old. Years later, my wife and I would attend various Protestant churches, some bringing on board women pastors with various degrees of competencies still all pretty bad at inspiring. Even a female Methodist Bishop proved really bad leading me to wonder if there was some insight into Paul’s teachings about women pastors… and I still wonder.

Now besides that, I’m a fan of women. They raised me, mentored me, protected me, befriended me and always were my biggest supporters. So it always made me want to root for women in any job where they could excel but now I’m really wondering about their abilities in pastoring and teaching a Christian flock. Perhaps they are there to nurture, to love and to be model Christian’s to love and emulate… that’s a job in itself.

Women play a very valuable role within the body. My wife has been one of my best counselors, she has evened out my theological rigidities, helped me in wise responses, counseled me in spiritual lows, etc. she is of great comfort, and I agree with you that God has made them for that role. That being said I believe God's word is clear on the matter that the Man is both the spiritual head of the home, as well as of the local Church body. But as we see throughput scripture a wise, godly leader is not an overbearing dictator, but a humble servant, who seeks to serve - women are our co-equals, but God has designed us for different jobs.

 

[Reynolds]

Texas has beef barbecue… my personal favorite. Fla is ribs & beans ( not so much ).

I like beef Brisket Bbq.

 

[Reynolds]

Women play a very valuable role within the body. My wife has been one of my best counselors, she has evened out my theological rigidities, helped me in wise responses, counseled me in spiritual lows, etc. she is of great comfort, and I agree with you that God has made them for that role. That being said I believe God's word is clear on the matter that the Man is both the spiritual head of the home, as well as of the local Church body. But as we see throughput scripture a wise, godly leader is not an overbearing dictator, but a humble servant, who seeks to serve - women are our co-equals, but God has designed us for different jobs.

As Macarthur points out in his teaching on this subject, after the fall women have the natural desire to rule over men and to throw off the authority of men. It is the man's duty to not allow them to do that.

 

[AustinC]

As Macarthur points out in his teaching on this subject, after the fall women have the natural desire to rule over men and to throw off the authority of men. It is the man's duty to not allow them to do that.

Question, do you happen to have an icon of St John MacArthur in your house? Just curious.

 

[AustinC]

Georgia is my favorite for pecans (covered in Chocolate)

Tbilisi or Batumi pecans?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Tbilisi or Batumi pecans?

Don’t know