Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Just so. It appears that he doesn't know the difference.
How many colors of calvinism are there? You all seem to make up whatever you want and call it calvinism. Do you really know what you are?
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Just so. It appears that he doesn't know the difference.
More baseless accusations. You are making a fool of yourself, man.So you do not hold to the TULIP? If not why do you say you hold to mainstream Calvinism
What was the accusation Martin?More baseless accusations. You are making a fool of yourself, man.
I have explained my beliefs to you at length, including on this thread, especially on Page 3. Here is an extract from Post#23:What was the accusation Martin?
I asked a question are you not capable of understanding that?
You have been answered. If you have the reading and comprehension skills of a six year-old, that is not my fault. Again, if you would like something that I have written clarified for you, just ask (nicely, please!).You are just making a fool of yourself by your non answers.
There are as many variations on non-Calvinism as there are non-Calvinists. I assure you that John and Charles Wesley would not have recognized you as an Arminian, but would have written you off as a Pelagian.Or are you concerned that once you make a clear statement you won't be able to dance around as much?
There are as many variations of Calvinism as there are people that claim to be Calvinist.
More like you keep confusing Hyper Calvinist and "normal" Calvinist theologyThere is the problem @David Lamb he said he holds to mainline calvinism which has one saved then given faith and then he says you have to have faith before you are saved.
My question for him and you is what do you actually believe? Do either of you hold to the TULIP? If you do not hold to the TULIP why do you call yourselves calvinists?
The bible does not support your elect before the foundation of the world. One is only elect when they are in the Elect one, Christ Jesus, in other words saved. Were you in Christ prior to creation?
Did you have every spiritual blessing before you trusted in Christ?
But I have to ask if God chose a select group to be saved then He also chose all those not to be saved by not choosing them. But then we see in
1Ti 2:3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
This passage makes it abundantly clear that God wills the salvation of every person. We see this shown in these passages also. John 3:17; John 12:32; 1John 2:2
So is God confused or is He being disingenuous or more likely you and Martin have misunderstood Eph 1:4.
More baseless accusations. You are making a fool of yourself, man.
Gentlemen, let all who name the name of Christ depart from iniquity...You are just making a fool of yourself by your non answers.
You know, it's okay to differ with people. And even try to convince people of your position. But calling it false doctrine or an errant view or bad exegesis will never convince anyone. It just irritates people with your arrogance.So you continue to ignore Greek scholars that point out the correct understanding of Act 13:48 so you can hold to your errant view.
Exegesis by Greek scholars does not seem to matter when it comes to supporting your calvinist views.
But you even ignore the obvious understanding found from the context.
As many as were ordained to eternal life (hosoi ēsan tetagmenoi eis zōēn aiōnion). Periphrastic past perfect passive indicative of tassō, a military term to place in orderly arrangement. The word “ordain” is not the best translation here. “Appointed,” as Hackett shows, is better. The Jews here had voluntarily rejected the word of God. On the other side were those Gentiles who gladly accepted what the Jews had rejected, not all the Gentiles. Why these Gentiles here ranged themselves on God’s side as opposed to the Jews Luke does not tell us. This verse does not solve the vexed problem of divine sovereignty and human free agency. There is no evidence that Luke had in mind an absolutum decretum of personal salvation. Paul had shown that God’s plan extended to and included Gentiles. Certainly the Spirit of God does move upon the human heart to which some respond, as here, while others push him away. Word Pictures in the New Testament (A. T. Robertson)
As many as were ordained to eternal life believed.—Better, as many as were disposed for. The words seem to the English reader to support the Calvinistic dogma of divine decrees as determining the belief or unbelief of men, and it is not improbable, looking to the general drift of the theology of the English Church in the early part of the seventeenth century, that the word “ordained” was chosen as expressing that dogma. It runs, with hardly any variation, through all the chief English versions, the Rhemish giving the stronger form “pre-ordinate.” The Greek word, however, does not imply more than that they fell in with the divine order which the Jews rejected. Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
Pride, as well as jealousy of the Gentiles who were crowding into the fold, stirred the Jews to antagonism, but they could not eradicate the seed which had been so profusely scattered. Large numbers believed, and as they experienced salvation in Christ, they discovered that they were in line with an eternal purpose. This is the meaning of ordained in Act_13:48. Through the Bible Day by Day (F. B. Meyer)
Ordained to eternal life—Should be rendered, disposed to eternal life. It plainly refers to the eager predisposition just above mentioned in the heart of many of these Gentiles on learning that old prophecy proclaims a Messiah for them. As many as were so inclined to the eternal life now offered committed themselves by faith to the blessed Jesus.
Rarely has a text been so violently wrenched from its connections with the context, and strained beyond its meaning for a purpose, than has been this clause in support of the doctrine of predestination. There is not the least plausibility in the notion that Luke in this simple history is referring to any eternal decree predestinating these men to eternal life. The word here rendered ordained usually signifies placed, positioned, disposed. It may refer to the material or to the mental position. It is a verb in the passive form, a form which frequently possesses a reciprocal active meaning; that is, it frequently signifies an action performed by one’s self upon one’s self. Thus, in Romans 9:22, The vessels of wrath fitted to destruction are carefully affirmed, even by predestinarians, to be fitted by themselves. Indeed, the very Greek word here rendered ordained is frequently used, compounded with a preposition, in the New Testament itself, in the passive form with a reciprocal meaning. Thus, Rom_13:1, Be subject unto the higher powers, is literally, place yourselves under the higher powers. So, also, Rom_8:7; 1Co_16:16; Jas_4:7, and many other texts. The meaning we give is required by the antithesis between the Jews in Act_13:46 and these Gentiles. The former were indisposed to eternal life, and so believed not; these were predisposed to eternal life, and so believed. Daniel Whedon''s Commentary
So you continue to ignore Greek scholars that point out the correct understanding of Act 13:48 so you can hold to your errant view.
You know, it's okay to differ with people. And even try to convince people of your position. But calling it false doctrine or an errant view or bad exegesis will never convince anyone. It just irritates people with your arrogance.
@Silverhair
You do realize that there are greek scholars that take a calvinistic view of Acts 13:48 dont you ?
Which comment BF?
@Silverhair
The one you made, maybe you need to pay attention to your own comments and peoples responses to them duh