'All Scripture'

[Martin Marprelate]

No one that I have read in this discussion has mentioned that that both the Old and New Testaments were written by God as He inspired and used humans to record same.

I rather think that comes under the heading of 1 Timothy 3:16. 'God-breathed' certainly brings out this truth.

Now as then, He and only He knew the future so only He knew/knows how to include any future Scripture as part of His Word.

I rather think that Proverbs 30:5-6; 1 Timothy 3:16-17; Hebrews 1:1-2 and Revelation 22:18 militate against the idea that the Scriptures are somehow incomplete and that God may need to add to them.

 

[Adonia]

No one that I have read in this discussion has mentioned that that both the Old and New Testaments were written by Godas He inspired and used humans to record same.
Now as then, He and only He knee the future so only He knew/knows how to include any future Scripture as part of His Word.

This is true. The question really is are they to be looked at as authoritative or do they somehow have authority. I would say that the historical record of Christianity from the beginning until the 16th century say they are authoritative. Real humans actually made the decisions, only men can wield actual authority.

 

[JonShaff]

This is true. The question really is are they to be looked at as authoritative or do they somehow have authority. I would say that the historical record of Christianity from the beginning until the 16th century say they are authoritative. Real humans actually made the decisions, only men can wield actual authority.

No, you have zero authority. You in and of yourself cannot tell anyone to do anything. It is only by declaring "Thus saith the Word of God," do you have any influence on anybody.

 

[Adonia]

No, you have zero authority. You in and of yourself cannot tell anyone to do anything. It is only by declaring "Thus saith the Word of God," do you have any influence on anybody.

You are correct, I have no religious authority - but Bishops certainly do.

 

[JonShaff]

You are correct, I have no religious authority - but Bishops certainly do.

Do you have Scripture to prove that?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

In a world where WORD = WRITINGS ONLY, you would be correct. You are WRONG.

Again you are not allowing the scriptures to speak, You are forcing in the idea of "WRITINGS ONLY".


2 Corinthians 3

2You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

4Such confidence we have through Christ toward God. 5Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6who also made us adequate as servants of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.


Here just the opposite it claims NOT WITH INK. And that GOD makes the CHRISTIAN adequate servant of the new covenant. Not the letter, not the ink, not on tablets of stone.

Yet some here would say Yes scripture is totally and always right, but its WRONG about Christians being adequate servant.

The false teaching is that WRITINGS are the SUPERIOR form of communication. And that God can only defend and protect "WRITINGS".


Which verse is true?

1Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples, 2saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses; 3therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds; for they say things and do not do them.

1Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples, 2saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses; 3therefore all that they tell you, IGNORE, and instead open up a bible and do what it says ONLY.


Jesus Christ recognizes the AUTHORITY. His Jewish faith wasn't a false religion, But those in authority were corrupt, This doesn't negate the authority.

Finally to even recognize the bible you need someone else to pick the book out for you.

Give me your newest christian, let me put him in a room with thousands of gospels with fakes and forgeries and mistakes. He is not going to magically pick out the exact 66 books you got.

Philosophy FIRST, someone put the book in your hand and told you THIS IS the bible.

I

And what does that look like fleshed out? Authority to do exactly what?

abuse children and cover up crimes... at will.

 

[Adonia]

I

abuse children and cover up crimes... at will.

You have your reprobates as well, men who are Pastors, leaders in your churches who also sin terribly in the area of sexual crimes and immorality.

 

[Adonia]

Do you have Scripture to prove that?

You tell me. Mr. John Smyth used his authority (unilaterally I might add) to change orthodox Christian doctrine for the doctrine your Christian sect now believes. Just how was he able do that?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

You have your reprobates as well, men who are Pastors, leaders in your churches who also sin terribly in the area of sexual crimes and immorality.

You don’t say, however there isn’t a systematic coverup like you have. There is also something called a background checks that most use regarding pastoral candidates that we use as a part of the process.

 

[Adonia]

You don’t say, however there isn’t a systematic coverup like you have. There is also something called a background checks that most use regarding pastoral candidates that we use as a part of the process.

There was systematic coverups, but no longer. In todays world the authorities are called and people are removed from ministries. The Bishops, especially here in America, are on board with these actions. We have a good discernment process now which has been ongoing for some time, and yes, we also do background checks. These type of sinfulness is an evil in the Church and must be stamped out, and if Pope Francis covered up for Cardinal McCarrick the Pope should resign.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

There was systematic coverups, but no longer. In todays world the authorities are called and people are removed from ministries. The Bishops, especially here in America, are on board with these actions. We have a good discernment process now which has been ongoing for some time, and yes, we also do background checks. These type of sinfulness is an evil in the Church and must be stamped out, and if Pope Francis covered up for Cardinal McCarrick the Pope should resign.

I’m sorry but I remain skeptical for I have seen this before. The outraged laity must step up to the plate and exact meaningful changes... can you inform me how this is happening (in real-time). And let me say here that I’m not advocating distruction of the institution but real CHANGE & Transformation.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

You tell me. Mr. John Smyth used his authority (unilaterally I might add) to change orthodox Christian doctrine for the doctrine your Christian sect now believes. Just how was he able do that?

You are correct, I have no religious authority - but Bishops certainly do.

Oh but you do have Authority as the body of Christ... as the laity you can band together, deny them the money they need, shut down bad churches if need be. If it was done across the country that message would get back to Hippy Frank and his cronies back at the Vatican.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

You are correct, I have no religious authority - but Bishops certainly do.

It is the Lord Jesus Christ who has authority. He and no one else. "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me" (Matthew 28:18). Church leaders have authority only insofar as they follow His commands as laid down in His word. Of all others the Lord Jesus declares, "They are blind guides; leave them alone." Those Pastors who sin are to be rebuked publicly (1 Timothy 5:20).

Oh wow! That was my 5,000th post! Whoopee-doo!

 

[Martin Marprelate]

You tell me. Mr. John Smyth used his authority (unilaterally I might add) to change orthodox Christian doctrine for the doctrine your Christian sect now believes. Just how was he able do that?

He had the authority of the word of God which rather clearly indicates that baptism is for professing Christians only (Acts 8:12 etc.). But Baptists do not follow John Smyth; they follow Christ and His word.

 

[Adonia]

He had the authority of the word of God which rather clearly indicates that baptism is for professing Christians only (Acts 8:12 etc.). But Baptists do not follow John Smyth; they follow Christ and His word.

I think he had the authoritative word of God that he followed. He took that and became "the authority" that came up with the Baptist doctrine that all Baptists now look to. It's the same thing that the Mormons do, the Jehovah's Witnesses do, the Lutherans do, that every Christian faith tradition in effect does. Christians with different doctrines, besides the very basic ones that most Christian sects share.

 

[Adonia]

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me"

Which He then proceeded to give to others. Surely you are aware of where that is reflected in the Holy Writ?

 

[utilyan]

Rome has got their folks as much tied up in their false theology as the JW and mormons do theirs!
Rome will not let the bible be as it states to us it really is, or else their house built upon the sand of RCC theology will get blown away!

If you want a good laugh have a fresh regenerated Calvinst read and explain revelations to us.

Since they got their superior Gnostic super powers after hearing the gospel, should be a piece of cake.

 

[utilyan]

It's quite sad really--since I was saved, The Spirit testified to me that the Word of God was "Alive" and "Powerful". It was transformative, it was my spiritual meat. The Word of God directed me, comforted me, equipped me. The word of God is How I commune with God--accompanied by prayer. I want everyone to experience God through His Word like I do. It's sad that people will reject the Authority of Scripture and the Divine realities concerning them. I'm not saying that a piece of paper is divine--I'm saying that God has left His Truth with men and we can hear from God through His Word by His Spirit to grow into the fullness of the Stature of Christ.

Amen lets not add fake rules like "Scripture is the final and only authority."

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I think he had the authoritative word of God that he followed. He took that and became "the authority" that came up with the Baptist doctrine that all Baptists now look to. It's the same thing that the Mormons do, the Jehovah's Witnesses do, the Lutherans do, that every Christian faith tradition in effect does. Christians with different doctrines, besides the very basic ones that most Christian sects share.

John Smyth is not 'the authority' for anything. I doubt anyone here has ever read a book by him; I certainly haven't.

Believers' baptism was instituted by John the Baptist (Matthew 3:6), confirmed by the Lord Jesus (John 4:1-2) and followed by His disciples (Acts 2:41 etc.). The earliest Christians knew nothing of baptizing infants (c.f. Didache and Justin Martyr). Believers' Baptism was practised by many Christians long before John Smyth or the Reformation in the teeth of the most wicked persecution by the Church of Rome.

 

[Adonia]

John Smyth is not 'the authority' for anything. I doubt anyone here has ever read a book by him; I certainly haven't.

Believers' baptism was instituted by John the Baptist (Matthew 3:6), confirmed by the Lord Jesus (John 4:1-2) and followed by His disciples (Acts 2:41 etc.). The earliest Christians knew nothing of baptizing infants (c.f. Didache and Justin Martyr). Believers' Baptism was practised by many Christians long before John Smyth or the Reformation in the teeth of the most wicked persecution by the Church of Rome.

So you are saying that the definition of being a Baptist is an adult who is baptized?