Am I Now IFB?

[37818]

Oh boy, here we go. So we are more powerful than God?

No. Choices can be made against God's will. Or else sin would not be possible.

". . . Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. . . ." -- Acts of the Apostles 7:51.

". . . For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; . . ." -- Romans 1:18.

". . . For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; . . ." -- Romans 3:23.

 

[1689Dave]

"The New IFB" website lists these as their doctrines:
*FAITH ALONE FOR SALVATION
*ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED
*KING JAMES BIBLE ONLY
*TRINITY
*SOUL-WINNING
*HARD PREACHING
*ANTI-WORLDLINESS
*ANTI-CALVINISM
*ANTI-DISPENSATIONAL
*ANTI-ZIONISM
*POST-TRIB PRE-WRATH RAPTURE

Interesting... All of the IFB churches I know of are Dispensationalists. Hopefully not any more...

 

[37818]

Interesting... All of the IFB churches I know of are Dispensationalists. Hopefully not any more...

1 Corinthians 9:17, ". . . a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me. . . ."

Ephesians 1:10, ". . . That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: . . ."

Ephesians 3:2, ". . . If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: . . ."

Colossians 1:25, ". . . Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; . . . ."

Luke 16:2-4, ". . . And he called him, and said unto him, How is it that I hear this of thee? give an account of thy stewardship; for thou mayest be no longer steward. Then the steward said within himself, What shall I do? for my lord taketh away from me the stewardship: I cannot dig; to beg I am ashamed. I am resolved what to do, that, when I am put out of the stewardship, they may receive me into their houses. . . ."

 

[Reformed1689]

No. Choices can be made against God's will. Or else sin would not be possible.

OR, God allows sin to occur for a time

1 Corinthians 9:17, ". . . a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me. . . ."

Ephesians 1:10, ". . . That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: . . ."

Ephesians 3:2, ". . . If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: . . ."

Colossians 1:25, ". . . Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; . . . ."

Luke 16:2-4, ". . . And he called him, and said unto him, How is it that I hear this of thee? give an account of thy stewardship; for thou mayest be no longer steward.
Then the steward said within himself, What shall I do? for my lord taketh away from me the stewardship: I cannot dig; to beg I am ashamed. I am resolved what to do, that, when I am put out of the stewardship, they may receive me into their houses. . . ."

Yeah, you cannot deny the existence of dispensations. Now, some dispensationalists take it to crazy unbiblical extremes, but you cannot deny that there are different dispensations and be honest.

 

[1689Dave]

1 Corinthians 9:17, ". . . a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me. . . ."

Ephesians 1:10, ". . . That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: . . ."

Ephesians 3:2, ". . . If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: . . ."

Colossians 1:25, ". . . Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; . . . ."

Luke 16:2-4, ". . . And he called him, and said unto him, How is it that I hear this of thee? give an account of thy stewardship; for thou mayest be no longer steward. Then the steward said within himself, What shall I do? for my lord taketh away from me the stewardship: I cannot dig; to beg I am ashamed. I am resolved what to do, that, when I am put out of the stewardship, they may receive me into their houses. . . ."

Misses the point.

 

[robycop3]

My church CALLS itself IFB, but it's more nondenominational.

We don't believe nor follow ANY man-made doctrines of faith/worship. That includes the KJVO myth. (We use the NKJV & NASV.) Some of us are dispies; I'm a partial dispy, believing God used three dispensations: pre-Moses, Old Testament times, & the New Covenant, that is, the present age. We don't follow OSAS. We believe in salvation by faith, belief, & repentance beforehand. We baptize by full immersion. We evangelize. We turn no one away, believing EVERYONE living has the opportunity to be saved. The BIBLE is our ONLY authority in all matters of faith/worship, as we believe ALL the intel we have of God comes from Scripture.

 

[Bible Thumpin n Gun Totin]

I am a fundamental Baptist that attends a free will Baptist church.

The free will Baptists believe you can lose your salvation, but that it is very difficult to do so short of actually verbally renouncing Him. I can see where they get that belief from in Scripture.

I have never attended nor heard of an IFB church that believes you can lose your salvation.

Your NASB preference would fit in with a KJVP (King James preferred) Independent Fundamental Baptist, but your belief on salvation puts you firmly in the FWB camp.

The FWB church I attend would agree with the beliefs you listed at the bottom of your post 100% with the exception of them being dispensationalist. Perhaps an Independent Free Will Baptist Church would fit you?

Or dont worry about secondary doctrines so long as the congregation is born again and has the love of God. That's what we do haha. Take the meat and throw away the bones.

 

[John of Japan]

I had to google up New IFB, I was unaware that was the moniker he was using.

Me too. I'm glad he is distinguishing himself from us normal IFB folk, but his ilk ceertainly does not represent the original movement as he claims, which was mostly dispensational, pretrib premil.and was not KJVO.

 

[Reynolds]

IFB's are osas. Freewills believe you can lose your salvation

Traditionally yes. Thats changing.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

My question at this point is:

What's wrong with being identified as IFB?​

 

[Marooncat79]

The Freewill Baptists that I know believe if you lose it that you cannot be saved again and point to the Hebrews 6 passage as a proof text

 

[Calminian]

I must disagree, since there are many warnings about apostasy in scripture. Nearly every new testament book has at least one such warning. Jesus issues several warnings Himself about apostasy and a hell for Christians that did not love Him by obeying His commands.

This is yet another path I hope you will reconsider. There are definitely warnings in Scripture for those to taste, but do not eat the bread of life. It makes perfect sense that the apostles warned those in the Church to make sure they did not have unbelieving hearts. Jesus himself said that tares and wheats would both endure in the Church until the end. There are tares in every Church, who have not yet placed genuine faith in Christ. They are all vulnerable to fall from grace.

But this is not the fate of genuine saved believers.

Heb. 6:9 But, beloved, we are confident of better things concerning you, yes, things that accompany salvation, though we speak in this manner.

Heb. 10:39 But we are not of those who draw back to perdition, but of those who believe to the saving of the soul.​

 

[Dave G]

@Steven Yeadon

Steve,

1) Have you believed on Christ for the forgiveness of your sins?
2) Do you truly desire to repent of your sins and obey Him, and Him alone?
3) Do you love His word and find yourself returning to it, even after periods of discouragement and confusion, determined to trust Him and it no matter what?
4) Do you believe that He is your Deliverer?
5) Do you find yourself increasingly at odds with the ways of the world?
6) Do you hate sin...specifically your sin?
7) Have you ever felt very remorseful towards God for your sins?
8) Do you ever feel at peace with God?
9) Have you suffered rejection by family and friends for your trust in the Lord?
10) Does being a Christian shame you, or are you determined to love Him and follow Him despite the persecution?

If you can say, "Yes" to most ( hopefully all ) of these, then I'd say that you're a "Christian"...
Not an "IFB".

 

[Steven Yeadon]

My question at this point is:

What's wrong with being identified as IFB?​

Nothing wrong IMO, but to embrace more IFB or freewill positions is anathema at my first SBC church. So, I am adjusting to that. My original question was to find out if I am IFB or freewill or what? I have found an IFB church and visited and plan to keep going for now. I need to really figure out what the pastor thinks of my doctrine, since I of course, want there to be peace. I tried the freewill churches in town but they are all similar in that they are into emotionalism over the Word and its doctrines.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

Steve,

1) Have you believed on Christ for the forgiveness of your sins?
2) Do you truly desire to repent and obey Him, and Him alone?
3) Do you love His word and find yourself returning to it, even after periods of discouragement and confusion, determined to trust Him and it no matter what?
4) Do you believe that He is your Deliverer?
5) Do you find yourself increasingly at odds with the ways of the world?
6) Do you hate sin...specifically your sin?
7) Have you ever felt very remorseful towards God for your sins?
8) Do you ever feel at peace with God?
9) Have you suffered rejection by family and friends for your trust in the Lord?
10) Does being a Christian shame you, or are you determined to love Him and follow Him despite the persecution?

If you can say, "Yes" to most or all of these, then I'd say that you're a "Christian"...
Not an "IFB".

Thank you very much.

I can answer 'yes' to all questions, except 10, where I feel both answers to be true in their own way in my case. I am very shamed of the "foolishness" of the Gospel to those seeking great signs or rational proofs. People that want to believe on evidence instead of faith. This keeps me from evangelizing as much as I should.

 

[Dave G]

@Steven Yeadon

Steve,
As a former "IFB", I've learned many things over the years...

1) I'm not beholden to any institution of men, any "denomination" and any set of teachings that I am not satisfied are the truth of His word.
2) No one stands between me and my Saviour...not a pastor, a deacon, or anyone else.
3) No one has the right to dictate to me how I understand His words...He is my Teacher ( 1 John 2:20-27 ).
4) No one has the right to dictate how I serve the Lord...He works in me both to will and to do of His good pleasure ( Philippians 2:13 ).
5) No one has the right to tell me how to give of myself, or my money to the body of Christ.
6) Believers are not "of" this world, and will be hated of men for Jesus' sake.

Many more, but I think those are enough for now...

Try to ignore the pressure to evangelize, and simply focus on following your Saviour, a steady diet of His word, and resting in Him.
Your faith, if it's real ( and only you can answer that...time will tell ), is the evidence of your salvation ( Hebrews 11:1 ).
Trust Him, and seek Him daily, OK?

The single best thing you can do, no matter what "age" you may be as a believer in Jesus Christ, is to read His word...every day if possible.
Front to back, "rinse and repeat".

Don't worry so much about what "denomination" you fit into...
Be concerned with your personal relationship with Him above all else.
At the end of the day, you are not part of a "denomination"...

You are part of the body of Christ and one of His sheep.


May God be pleased to show you many things through His word, and may you cast your cares upon Him...for He cares for you.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

This is yet another path I hope you will reconsider. There are definitely warnings in Scripture for those to taste, but do not eat the bread of life. It makes perfect sense that the apostles warned those in the Church to make sure they did not have unbelieving hearts. Jesus himself said that tares and wheats would both endure in the Church until the end. There are tares in every Church, who have not yet placed genuine faith in Christ. They are all vulnerable to fall from grace.

But this is not the fate of genuine saved believers.

Heb. 6:9 But, beloved, we are confident of better things concerning you, yes, things that accompany salvation, though we speak in this manner.

Heb. 10:39 But we are not of those who draw back to perdition, but of those who believe to the saving of the soul.​

Let me explain what I mean by 'salvation' and 'apostasy.' If your definitions are different from mine that would be constructive to talk about.

Church discipline is one key to knowing who is or is not apostate. Those that let love of this world make them useless Christians are apostates after being warned of their sin and defiantly going to their sin according to the procedure in Matthew 18:15-17.

I also view those that deny the faith when faced with persecution as apostate.

Those two tests of denying the faith and being useless due to sin while defiantly resisting the church are what I mean about 'apostate.' These people are under church discipline and should be invited back into the faith. Death in one's sins seems to be the only guarantee of a horrific final destination.

'Salvation' is simply putting a small amount of faith in Jesus Christ and his atonement for our sins.

I think I disagree with most people only on whether those that are 'apostate' ever had significant faith in Jesus Christ and the deposit of the Holy Spirit. I may have an incorrect view of salvation, I may admit.

 

[xlsdraw]

Steve, which IFB church are you trying? And in what city? Are you still around the Orlando area?

 

[Steven Yeadon]

Steve, which IFB church are you trying? And in what city? Are you still around the Orlando area?

Calvary Baptist Church of Winter Garden in an exurb of Orlando.
Calvary Baptist - Winter Garden, FL

 

[xlsdraw]

Calvary Baptist Church of Winter Garden in an exurb of Orlando.
Calvary Baptist - Winter Garden, FL

My Father's family grew up in Winter Garden in the 40s and 50s. My uncle pastored Park Avenue Baptist in Winter Garden in the 60s and 70s. We've got an IFB conference at our church in Haines City this Monday-Wednesday. We host one every November at Landmark Baptist Church. I'm an over-the-road truck driver and have got to head out Saturday, so I'll have to watch it on the internet this time. I've been fortunate enough to attend the previous couple of years.