An honest critique Monsieurs.

[SovereignGrace]

He can't. His hatred of the Gospel of Salvation by Grace alone through faith alone, and those who preach it, compels him to attack all that is good, and holy, and Godly.

Here's another dandy. I listened to a few minutes of Creflo Dollar. He was preaching on prayer, too. He then said something like..paraphrasing here...God will put you in a place where you have to look up to Him. How does that jive with free will theology? Again, they can not see the inconsistencies rife in their doctrine of free will. Sad really.

 

[steaver]

What part of didn't you understand?

How could she call out unless God made her? What does he mean "if she is calling out". You see how Calvinist get stumped when the rubber meets the road?

 

[SovereignGrace]

Seriously, you have no clue what Calvinism is. Just. Please. Stop. You are making yourself look bad on here.

 

[steaver]

How could she call out unless God made her? What does he mean "if she is calling out". You see how Calvinist get stumped when the rubber meets the road?

This received two "dumbs". Amen!

I have a hunch, just a hunch, but I wouldn't doubt the Holy Spirit was burning within your heart urging you to tell her 'God cares, and God sees your problems and loves you and wants to have a personal relationship with you through Jesus Christ. God wants you to have an abundant life and eternal life with Him'. But Calvinism quenches the Spirit, and your mind could not bring yourself to obey the Spirit. For the doctrine of Calvinism cannot tell a stranger God loves them. Kinda sad.

I could be wrong, that's between you and God, only you know how the Spirit was leading you at the time. I know when I am confronted with these situations the Holy Spirit wells up inside me directing me to tell them Jesus loves them and desires to have a relationship with them. As the conversation continues the Spirit leads me to invite the person to place their trust and faith in Jesus Christ and pray, calling on Him for the wonderful power of regeneration through the Holy Ghost!! What a blessing being counted as worthy to work the fields of harvest with the Holy Ghost Himself!! Praise Jesus!!!

 

[steaver]

Here's another dandy. I listened to a few minutes of Creflo Dollar. He was preaching on prayer, too. He then said something like..paraphrasing here...God will put you in a place where you have to look up to Him. How does that jive with free will theology? Again, they can not see the inconsistencies rife in their doctrine of free will. Sad really.

I cannot listen to Cleflo nor Jakes anymore. They have become showmen. maybe they even were twenty years ago but I was a babe in Christ and didn't realize it.

 

[steaver]

Obey the Great Commission and obey the Great Commandment. "Love thy neighbor as thyself." And John 13:35 "By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another."

I'm curious, why do you think Jesus commanded us to love thy neighbor, which would be all, lost or saved, but He Himself, according to Calvinism, does not love everyone? How is it that all men shall know that we are His disciples if we love everyone? Would it be because our Lord loves everyone? The scripture says by loving everyone we identify with Jesus Christ. I don't see how that works in the Calvinism model which declares God does not love everyone.

 

[SovereignGrace]

I cannot listen to Cleflo nor Jakes anymore. They have become showmen. maybe they even were twenty years ago but I was a babe in Christ and didn't realize it.

Creflo I listen to very little. Jakes has actually had a few good sermons. His 'He-motions' sermon is really good, in my opinion.

 

[steaver]

He can't. His hatred of the Gospel of Salvation by Grace alone through faith alone, and those who preach it, compels him to attack all that is good, and holy, and Godly.

You received two likes for this. That makes three here who believe non-cals hate the Gospel and hate God. Nice witness to the board there brothers.

 

[SovereignGrace]

I'm curious, why do you think Jesus commanded us to love thy neighbor, which would be all, lost or saved, but He Himself, according to Calvinism, does not love everyone? How is it that all men shall know that we are His disciples if we love everyone? Would it be because our Lord loves everyone? The scripture says by loving everyone we identify with Jesus Christ. I don't see how that works in the Calvinism model which declares God does not love everyone.

Well, we have a sin problem to begin with. We have the capabilty of hating people who do good for us...talking about sinners here. Even as saved people, our flesh causes us to sin. We are to love everybody, but God hated Esau, and all them that work iniquity. So God's hatred towards sinners is holy hatred. God's vengenence is holy vengence. God's wrath poured out upon sinners is holy wrath. When we take vengence into our own hands, we sin. Why? God is the one who repays(takes vengence) them for their wickedness. God's wrath, hatred was poured out on Christ upon the cross. Why? Christ 'became' sin by ingesting God's wrath(taking our sins upon Himself) and God crushed His only Son. If Christ had not done this, there's no propitiation. No propitiation.

God's love is focused solely on Christ. The reason why we are loved is because God saw us in Christ from/before the creation of the world.

 

[SovereignGrace]

You received two likes for this. That makes three here who believe non-cals hate the Gospel and hate God. Nice witness to the board there brothers.

The gospel is not 'Christ was thinking of you while He was being tortured on the cross' as many state. The gospel is Christ bore the guilt of sin upon Himself, suffered in the stead of who He mediated for. The goal of the cross was to please the Father and not sinners. God was the offended party, not sinners. The cross was propitious to God, not sinners.

Until people take themselves out of the gospel picture, they will never truly grasp all the gospel entails. The cross was between God and His Son. We reap the benefits of that dealing, however. If Christ had not done this, we'd all be lost.

 

[Rippon]

But Calvinism quenches the Spirit, and your mind could not bring yourself to obey the Spirit.

Those sort of sentiments indicates that the Holy Spirit is not the source of your impressions.

 

[steaver]

Well, we have a sin problem to begin with. We have the capabilty of hating people who do good for us...talking about sinners here. Even as saved people, our flesh causes us to sin. We are to love everybody, but God hated Esau, and all them that work iniquity. So God's hatred towards sinners is holy hatred. God's vengenence is holy vengence. God's wrath poured out upon sinners is holy wrath. When we take vengence into our own hands, we sin. Why? God is the one who repays(takes vengence) them for their wickedness. God's wrath, hatred was poured out on Christ upon the cross. Why? Christ 'became' sin by ingesting God's wrath(taking our sins upon Himself) and God crushed His only Son. If Christ had not done this, there's no propitiation. No propitiation.

God's love is focused solely on Christ. The reason why we are loved is because God saw us in Christ from/before the creation of the world.

You did not address the loving ALL, lost or saved, is US Christians identifying with Jesus Christ/God.

 

[steaver]

The gospel is not 'Christ was thinking of you while He was being tortured on the cross' as many state. The gospel is Christ bore the guilt of sin upon Himself, suffered in the stead of who He mediated for. The goal of the cross was to please the Father and not sinners. God was the offended party, not sinners. The cross was propitious to God, not sinners.

Until people take themselves out of the gospel picture, they will never truly grasp all the gospel entails. The cross was between God and His Son. We reap the benefits of that dealing, however. If Christ had not done this, we'd all be lost.

And this has something to do with some Calvinist declaring non-cals hate the Gospel and hate God???

 

[steaver]

Those sort of sentiments indicates that the Holy Spirit is not the source of your impressions.

Of course a Calvinist would say as much. But I know the Holy Spirit brother. And I follow His lead when witnessing. He guides me into all truth. I can witness to depressed and distraught strangers with my convictions. Can you? How would you have handled this girl brother? What would you have said to help her?

 

[Rippon]

Steaver, when you make a categorical statement like "Calvinism quenches the Spirit" --the Holy Spirit has not directed you to say such a wicked thing.

 

[SovereignGrace]

And this has something to do with some Calvinist declaring non-cals hate the Gospel and hate God???

No. But your view of the gospel differs from ours. Sinners had nothing to do with the cross. We were not the offended party, God was. God was vindicated by Christ dying under His divine, holy wrath. We are the foil, as Voddie Baucham stated. Go to youtube and type in 'what is the gospel by Voddie Baucham. Go to 21:00 and start from there.

 

[SovereignGrace]

You did not address the loving ALL, lost or saved, is US Christians identifying with Jesus Christ/God.

Yes I did. Go reread what I said. God is holy we are not.

 

[TCassidy]

That makes three here who believe non-cals hate the Gospel and hate God.

Please stop lying about what others believe. Nobody in this thread believes non-Calvinists hate the gospel and hate God. Your conduct has proven to us that YOU hate the Gospel and the God of the Gospel. Don't try to blame others for your hatred.

 

[steaver]

Please stop lying about what others believe. Nobody in this thread believes non-Calvinists hate the gospel and hate God. Your conduct has proven to us that YOU hate the Gospel and the God of the Gospel. Don't try to blame others for your hatred.

My conduct? Please provide a quote that shows I have ....

"....hatred of the Gospel of Salvation by Grace alone through faith alone, and those who preach it",...and ... compels him (me) to attack all that is good, and holy, and Godly".

If you cannot, then who is doing the lying?

Also, the three who agreed with TC ( Blessedwife, SG and Icon ) should also provide the quotes of me showing these things I am accused of.

 

[steaver]

Steaver, when you make a categorical statement like "Calvinism quenches the Spirit" --the Holy Spirit has not directed you to say such a wicked thing.

Let me ask you a question. Are those who reject Calvinism quenching the Spirit?