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Are all reformed baptists Under "new Covenant theology" then?
- Thread starter JesusFan
- Start date
I do believe the word of God states; We receive the Spirit by the hearing of faith.
Does that have to do with a covenant? Well maybe this one.
And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the LORD, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only [son]: That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which [is] upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies; And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.
The faith they heard about that brought them the Spirit was that, that seed of Abraham, the only begotten Son of God came and was obedient unto death even the death of the cross and God the Father by his Spirit raised him from the dead. He ascended on high received the promise of the Holy Spirit and then we received the Spirit.
It was that covenant with Abraham by which we have a connection with God the Father.
Reformed or not.
Galatians 3
1O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
You ask if this has to do with a covenant, the answer is yes. Now what is the faith by which we receive the Spirit of God. If the answer is anything other than faith in Christ, I would disagree with it.
But again...
I do believe the word of God states; We receive the Spirit by the hearing of faith.
Does that have to do with a covenant? Well maybe this one.
Read Galatians 3, Percho, and then tell me what it is Paul has to say about covenants.
The New Covenant is throughout the New Testament, but, why is this never talked about?
Look forward to a response, and, hey...you never said if the response I gave before "helped"...lol.
God bless.
And I think you make my point concerning "labels."
how so?
As was not labeling either groups, just the truth that AoG is considered to be part of Christianity, while the WoF wing is not!
based upon their respective theologies!
how so?
As was not labeling either groups, just the truth that AoG is considered to be part of Christianity, while the WoF wing is not!
based upon their respective theologies!
The basic idea is that you have declared that those in AoG are part of Christianity, and basically denied even the possibility that there are those that are involved in WoF could be saved.
When you have spoken to each member of these groups, then you can judge (for yourself) whether they belong to Christ. Until then, the burden is on you to actually speak to them, find out what they believe, and then examine the basis of that belief
You might find those in AoG that reject speaking in tongues is anything other than speaking a known language one has never learned for the purpose of communicating the Gospel, and you might find some in the WoF that do not believe a name it and claim it mentality.
I don't know if you followed this conversation or not, but my point was simply not to assume that because someone runs under a heading...that you know either their beliefs or their spiritual condition.
God bless.
The basic idea is that you have declared that those in AoG are part of Christianity, and basically denied even the possibility that there are those that are involved in WoF could be saved.
When you have spoken to each member of these groups, then you can judge (for yourself) whether they belong to Christ. Until then, the burden is on you to actually speak to them, find out what they believe, and then examine the basis of that belief
You might find those in AoG that reject speaking in tongues is anything other than speaking a known language one has never learned for the purpose of communicating the Gospel, and you might find some in the WoF that do not believe a name it and claim it mentality.
I don't know if you followed this conversation or not, but my point was simply not to assume that because someone runs under a heading...that you know either their beliefs or their spiritual condition.
God bless.
As I said, the teachings of the WoF are heretical, though there are some saved there despite that!
Darrell C
Thanks again for the good posts and discussion. Sometimes it is good to see others have travelled a similar path....and considered some of the very same up's and downs....just with different faces on the people.
I agree with most of what you have put forth....and you raise some good ideas for thinking about and implementing.
Jf..... I have and have had charasmatic friends who I believe are brothers despite some wrong ideas. Darrell made the point that we have to sort people out one at a time.....this is scriptural also Phil 3:
Thanks again for the good posts and discussion. Sometimes it is good to see others have travelled a similar path....and considered some of the very same up's and downs....just with different faces on the people.
I agree with most of what you have put forth....and you raise some good ideas for thinking about and implementing.
Jf..... I have and have had charasmatic friends who I believe are brothers despite some wrong ideas. Darrell made the point that we have to sort people out one at a time.....this is scriptural also Phil 3:
15Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
16Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing.
17Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.
18(For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:
19Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
20For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
What are you saying Percho? Are you saying that a "Reformed Baptist" is automatically a "Covenant Theology" believer? If your led to that conclusion, you'd be wrong. But if you are looking for a dividing line, then look to Election vs Humanism. More succinctly, either God is either Totally Sovereign or He is not.
I am strictly Election. I believe free will is nothing but one wanting to be the deciding factor in his own destiny and I do not believe God gives us this choice for if he did none would be saved.
Election = Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee:
Some will say Abram choose to depart. Well he departed howbeit in somewhat of a different manner than God had told him to. God elected and Abram obeyed. I am not real sure free will wasn't the fruit that was eaten.
God then made a covenant with Abraham which would bring the blessings of Abraham on God's elect regardless of what they believe.
Did Paul discover he was of the elect when he was holding Stephen's coat or when he was in the wilderness for three years being taught by Jesus?
glfredrick
New Member
Coming to understand the doctrine of God's election is generally not one's first foray into theology. That comes with maturity when one begins to grasp the more intricate concepts of God's revelation, hence my co-opting of the quote in my signature.
I would say that most people find that they had a lot to do with their own salvation until they learn more about the God they now serve. Some, seemingly, never grow in their understanding of God to the point where they get over themselves...
I would say that most people find that they had a lot to do with their own salvation until they learn more about the God they now serve. Some, seemingly, never grow in their understanding of God to the point where they get over themselves...
As I said, the teachings of the WoF are heretical, though there are some saved there despite that!
And that I can agree with.
God bless.
Darrell C
Thanks again for the good posts and discussion. Sometimes it is good to see others have travelled a similar path....and considered some of the very same up's and downs....just with different faces on the people.
I agree with most of what you have put forth....and you raise some good ideas for thinking about and implementing.
Jf..... I have and have had charasmatic friends who I believe are brothers despite some wrong ideas. Darrell made the point that we have to sort people out one at a time.....this is scriptural also Phil 3:
Thanks, Iconoclast, and good point made here.
I am opposed to many, if not most, of Charismatic distinctives, which range from mild to insane, depending upon the individul fellowships. I love to debate the distinctives, but I have learned that I have to be careful that those I debate certain issues with are in fact at a point where they can discuss their beliefs without resorting to emotional response. There are not too many that can actually do that.
God bless.