Are Immunizations unhealthy and sinful?

[mareese]

We purify our water.

We don't eat white sugar or non-organic flour.

We don't use hydrogenated oil.

We don't use milk unless it's from cows that have been pure fed and grazed and the milk has not been altered.

We eat organic when available, in fact I'm an advisor for our organics group.

We eat fresh lettuce, vegetables, fruits.

We limit our meat intake.

We don't use aluminum pots and pans.

We live in a small town and we enjoy the slower pace of life, meeting friends, meeting neighbors, going for walks, etc.

The children are vaccinated.

Our philosophy in life is "natural." We eat as close to natural as we can without artifical color, preservatives, hormones, antibiotics, herbicides, etc.

Life is good for us too.

 

[rlvaughn]

Hey, Hank. Certainly all milk is not cow's milk, pasteurized, or from animals fed growth hormones. I took Paul's statement as an absolute statement. So let me rephrase that question to get more at what I was thinking.

When you say "we don't use milk", do you mean no milk of any kind at all absolutely period? If so, why?

Thanks.

 

[av1611jim]

Originally posted by Paul33:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Charles Meadows:
Vaccines are injected directly into the bloodstream.

No - they're generally given as intramuscular injections.

Yes, Yes. And then it goes into the bloodstream of the person without passing through the kidneys and liver first. </font>[/QUOTE]I would dispute this. (I am not a doctor) My understanding is that our blood is filtered by our kidneys and liver in "nano-seconds" or a metter of a few heartbeats. It appears Paul is saying that the vaccine never enters the kidneys or liver. I think you are wrong here Paul.

In HIS service;
Jim

 

[Paul33]

Originally posted by rlvaughn:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Paul33:
We don't use milk.

Paul, not to throw you way off topic, but I'm curious about this one; from a Biblical standpoint. </font>[/QUOTE]Homogenized milk changes the chemical elements in the milk and when digested in humans leads to blocked arteries.

No scriptural basis, just scientific discovery. Also, milk from cows causes alot of allergies and sinus problems in many people.

In my wife's case, little red bumps on her arms cleared up. In my case, no more stuffy nose!

Not absolute. We still eat Breyer's ice cream. Yes I know it has "white" sugar and milk, but we enjoy it now and then. We also eat hard cheese, grated on salads.

We don't drink cow's milk.

Hope this helps and clarifies.

 

[rlvaughn]

Yes, thanks. Was just wondering if you rejected milk absolutely for some reason, or just didn't want the cow's milk, or just didn't want the pasteurized homogenized vitamin D stuff from the store. And I hear about a lot of people who have milk allergies.

BTW, I do drink cow's milk and use milk products, but also like the Silk soy milk.

 

[Ed Edwards]

It only makes sense -- cows milk contains
everything God knew would be needed --
needed by baby cows.

 

[TexasSky]

because they remember grandma's scary stories of polio and because no one talks about the risks.

I'm not a grandmother, and I remember polio, and it is FAR FAR worse than the risks of the vaccine.

I was born the year the vaccine came out. It wasn't distributed nation wide for a few more years. By then my older sister and one of my cousin's aunts (the side of her family that was not related to us) had contracted the disease.

You have no idea the horror of polio was.

My sister was, prior to the disease, a healthy, active child. She ran, laughed, leapt, taught me to jump rope, rode horses, tap danced.

She was declared legally dead when the polio hit because she stopped breathing. My mother got down on her knees and begged God to give her back her daughter.

We spent years and years just getting to a point where my sister could stand. There were wheel chairs, and wax treatments, and rehab centers, and leg braces.

She was mocked by kids because she had to wear built up shoes and leg braces or use a cane. She was ignored by her peers because she couldn't keep up.

Once, on a church outing, she was with a group of friends at an amusement park, but they said she was "keeping them from getting in the good lines," because she couldn't walk quickly enough. She told them to go on without her. Then she lost her purse on a roller coaster. So she spent 6 hours at a Six Flags Theme Park alone, without food, and only the drinking fountain.

I used to go to bed at night with a warning from my parents, "If she stops breathing....,"

In her case, because of when it hit, and how it hit, part of her body grew and part didn't for a few years. So she ended up with a horrid curve and hunch. They told us, during her junior year of high school, if it wasn't repaired, it would kill her because it was pressing on her vital organs.

She had surgery to put a 6 inch steel rod into her back. Spent 1/2 her junior and all her senior year of high school in a body cast, only allowed to sit up for a few hours at a time. She missed all those beautiful things kids do in high school.

The cousin's Aunt had similar experiences. Then she relapsed about 10 years ago. She died five years ago from the affects of childhood polio.

My sister still has massive health problems that doctors say go back to that childhood disease.

The rest of us got the vaccine.

Despite what my sister went through - she was one of the lucky ones. She lived. Most didn't.

Please don't write off the polio vaccine as "one of grandma's wives tales."

 

[Paul33]

Texassky,

My family lived through the same experiences.

But that doesn't mean that I'm going to close my eyes to the true nature of vaccines. If vaccines were proven effective and "actually" reduced polio you might have a case for immunizations.

But there is too much opposing research to make that case.

If vacccines actually work, what M.D. in his right mind would write a book exposing immunizations?

The truth about immunizations has been buried under an avalanche of propaganda. But there are always brave individuals who will expose the myth and present the truth at great personal risk.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by av1611jim:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Paul33:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Charles Meadows:
Vaccines are injected directly into the bloodstream.

No - they're generally given as intramuscular injections.

Yes, Yes. And then it goes into the bloodstream of the person without passing through the kidneys and liver first. </font>[/QUOTE]I would dispute this. (I am not a doctor) My understanding is that our blood is filtered by our kidneys and liver in "nano-seconds" or a metter of a few heartbeats. It appears Paul is saying that the vaccine never enters the kidneys or liver. I think you are wrong here Paul.

In HIS service;
Jim </font>[/QUOTE]Our circulatory system is a very branched system. When something gets injected intramuscularly, it slowly diffuses into the blood stream as opposed to an intravenous injection which directly enters the blood stream.

It is possible that in the thousands/millions of paths that a molecule in the blood stream could take as it goes through the body, that it would go to the liver or kidneys within the first heartbeat of its entering the bloodstream. However this is far from being the only or most probable possiblility.

The average resting heart rate is a little more than one beat per second, which is 1 billion nanoseconds if you want to get technical.

 

[TexasSky]

But that doesn't mean that I'm going to close my eyes to the true nature of vaccines. If vaccines were proven effective and "actually" reduced polio you might have a case for immunizations.

-------------------

I'm sorry, but the fact that Polio has almost been eradicated is proof that the immunization worked.

 

[dianetavegia]

CDC Backs New Kids' Meningitis Shot





By LINDSEY TANNER
Associated Press

CHICAGO (AP) -- Meningitis can strike out of the blue and kill within hours. Leslie Meigs knows because she almost died of it six years ago, when she 8. That's why she wants kids to get the new shot. Federal officials and doctors agree wholeheartedly.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the American Academy of Pediatrics on Thursday recommended that more than 8 million U.S. children - 11- to 12-year-olds, students entering high school and college freshmen headed for dorm life - get the vaccination.

Although meningococcal meningitis affects only about 3,000 people nationwide each year, it kills a fifth of adolescents who get it.

"This is a very bad disease," said the academy's Dr. Carol J. Baker, an infectious disease specialist at Baylor College of Medicine in Texas. "It's very rapidly progressive in adolescence. You can have an adolescent in a shopping mall at 2 in the afternoon, in the emergency room at 6 in the evening, and death by midnight."

http://www.11alive.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=63723

 

[robycop3]

We must weigh the harm against the BENEFITS. How many people are now alive and well due to being immunized against certain diseases? We have no way to be sure except that deaths from such diseases as polio have dropped dramatically. To say anything that SAVES LIVES is sinful is Jehovahfalsewitnessthink.

 

[Paul33]

Originally posted by Paul33:
From James, Immunization, 26-27.

"During the 1962 Congressional Hearings on HR 10541, Dr. Bernard Greenberg, head of the Department of Biostatistics of the University of North Carolina School of Public Health, testified that not only did polio increase substantially (50 percent from 1957 to 1958 and 80 percent from 1958 to 1959) after the introduction of mass and frequently compulsory immunization programs, but statistics were manipulated and statements made by the Public Health Service to give the opposite impression."

"For instance, in 1957 a spokesman for the North Carolina Health Department made glowing claims for the efficacy of the Salk vaccine, showing how polio steadily decreased from 1953 to 1957. His figures were challenged by Dr. Fred Klenner who pointed out that it wasn't until 1955 that a single person in the state received a polio vaccine injection. Even then injections were administered on a very limited basis because of the number of polio cases resulting from the vaccine. It wasn't until 1956 'that polio vaccinations assumed inspiring proportions.' The 61 percent drop in polio cases in 1954 was credited to the Salk vaccine when it wasn't even in the state! By 1957 polio was on the increase."

The "fact" of polio being eliminated by vaccines is in dispute.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by Paul33:
The "fact" of polio being eliminated by vaccines is in dispute.

It may be in dispute by some. But the evidence is difficult to ignore.
CDC : Poliomyelitis fact sheet

Page 4 of this pdf has a chart outlining the rate of polio in conjunction with the introduction of both the inactive vaccine and the live one from the 1950s onward.

 

[Paul33]

Originally posted by Gold Dragon:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Paul33:
The "fact" of polio being eliminated by vaccines is in dispute.

It may be in dispute by some. But the evidence is difficult to ignore.
CDC : Poliomyelitis fact sheet

Page 4 of this pdf has a chart outlining the rate of polio in conjunction with the introduction of both the inactive vaccine and the live one from the 1950s onward. </font>[/QUOTE]What the CDC isn't telling you is that the definition for polio was redefined after the introduction of the polio vaccine. By reclassifying and changing the descriptions of the symptoms of polio there was an automatic decrease in "polio." Not because the disease decreased but because the classification changed.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by Paul33:
What the CDC isn't telling you is that the definition for polio was redefined after the introduction of the polio vaccine. By reclassifying and changing the descriptions of the symptoms of polio there was an automatic decrease in "polio." Not because the disease decreased but because the classification changed.

Cite please. Thanks.

And even if it was the reclassification that accounts for the drop, where are all these reclassified polio victims?

 

[Paul33]

See Walen James, Immunizations.

 

[Jim1999]

An epidemic of "polio's" dimensions would be notable by the world under any name. I tend to believe the physicians, having lived through the time period and seeing the devastation.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by Paul33:
See Walen James, Immunizations.

Paul33, you seem like a reasonable guy, sometimes . Why do you buy in this stuff? This is textbook conspiracy theory material.

Vaccinations

 

[Paul33]

Originally posted by Jim1999:
An epidemic of "polio's" dimensions would be notable by the world under any name. I tend to believe the physicians, having lived through the time period and seeing the devastation.

Cheers,

Jim

Was polio already on the decline before immunizations were started? The evidence says it was.

Were their other factors that contributed to the decline of polio? The evidence says there was.

Did the vaccines contribute to the decline? The evidence says it didn't.