Are the Greek/Russian orthodox Valid Christian Churches?

[Matt Black]

Did Tin Foil Hats 'R' Us have a sale or something?

 

[Dr. Walter]

Well then doc, there should be an enormous amount of historical evidence in the form of their writings if they were around, yet nothing exists. Of course you know very well that the evidence isn't there to support such historical revisionists pap - that's why you are forced into a conspiratorial position. How sad...

WM

Consider this, there is a tremendous amount of evidence from the history preserved by Rome that they numbered in the hundreds of thousands as there is record of over a hundred thousand Paulicians being killed under Roman Law. Yet, even Roman history preserved extremely little of their writings! Why is that? Because Rome burnt their writings and because of that they hid their writings and so even Roman scribes furnish little of what they admit to be a great numbers of those they persecuted.

What Rome perserved is the best evidence against Rome.

 

[Dr. Walter]

Still fighting worn-out 16th century battles, are we?

No, you are a little late in your chronology. Still fighting "the way of Cain" and Rome is simply the most sophisticated representative of that way.

 

[Dr. Walter]

Did Tin Foil Hats 'R' Us have a sale or something?

You mean "dunce" hats? That is not spelled with an "R" but with a "D".

 

[Matt Black]

If the cap fits you, wear it...

 

[Dr. Walter]

There is no amount of REVISIONIST efforts that can cover up the bloody record of Rome. She was bloody in her secular involvement with apostolic Christianity and she was far more bloody in her ecclesiatical invovlement with apostolic Christianity. She stands along side and in the same descriptive camp as paganized Judiasm as a killer of people simply because of their beliefs (Jn. 16:1-5). Murder for religious reasons is the hall mark of false religion literally and figurative under the terms "Great Whore"

 

[WestminsterMan]

There is no amount of REVISIONIST efforts that can cover up the bloody record of Rome.

Snip...

Well doc, if it weren't for bloody evil ROME, we would all be speaking Farsi today. Why not take a look at the Battle of Leponto - you know - the
naval battle where Rome, by defeating the
Ottoman Empire fleet, set radical Islam back a
thousand years. Oh wait...if you do that, then you
would have to concede that the RC saved Western Civilization. Well then... never mind.

WM

 

[Dr. Walter]

If the cap fits you, wear it...

uhhh, didn't you bring up the "hats" idea instead of me?

Did Tin Foil Hats 'R' Us have a sale or something?

uhhh, didn't that post read "us"

Did Tin Foil Hats 'R' Us have a sale or something?

So these are your hats not mine.

However, on a more serious note, when the subject of Rome and its fellow denominations arise you and those of your ilk don't respond with Biblical evidence just insults. Why? Because you have no Biblical evidence to support your false idea that these are "Christian" in the New Testament sense of the term. Hence, like democrats today, you have no substance so you start throwing mud.

 

[WestminsterMan]

However, on a more serious note, when the subject of Rome and its fellow denominations arise you and those of your ilk don't respond with Biblical evidence just insults. Why? Because you have no Biblical evidence to support your false idea that these are "Christian" in the New Testament sense of the term. Hence, like
democrats today, you have no substance so you
start throwing mud.

The entire New Testament is a Catholic book. When you quote it, you are quoting from a set of books put together by that Church. I've told you this before... If you accept the canon of the New Testament, then you are tacitly accepting the authority of the people who put that list of books together. Yes - I know that you don't accept that the 1st and 2nd century councils (including the council of Rome) put that canon together but, like many of your other vagaries, you don't accept recorded history either. Thus you live in a world unsupported by truth... sort of like the way you believe that your own personal interpretation of Holy Scripture is infallible.

WM

 

[Matt Black]

I think you'll find that you were first in with the insults when you demeaned our Catholic and Orthodox brothers and sisters in Christ. Of course, you will say that they are not Proper Christians(TM), that they are some kind of spiritual untermenschen compared to your own oh-so-superior brand of neo-Aryan Christianity.

[reply to Dr Walter (in case anyone was in doubt about that)]

 

[Crabtownboy]

The entire New Testament is a Catholic book. When you quote it, you are quoting from a set of books put together by that Church. I've told you this before... If you accept the canon of the New Testament, then you are tacitly accepting the authority of the people who put that list of books together. Yes - I know that you don't accept that the 1st and 2nd century councils (including the council of Rome) put that canon together but, like many of your other vagaries, you don't accept recorded history either. Thus you live in a world unsupported by truth... sort of like the way you believe that your own personal interpretation of Holy Scripture is infallible.

WM

I have often wondered how people who are so anti-Rome can put so much faith in the canon they, the Catholics put together. It is a puzzle in that they have great faith in those Priests, Monksv ... those papists, etc. who voted on each book.

 

[billwald]

How about the bloody history of the USA? "We"killed off 90% of the Indian People and, until recently, kept the rest in gulags.

 

[Crabtownboy]

How about the bloody history of the USA? "We"killed off 90% of the Indian People and, until recently, kept the rest in gulags.

Yep, we did. The Trail of Tears is just one of the very sad stories of what the US did to the Native Americans. The taking away of Indian children from the parents and sending them to special schools is another sad event.

And, did you know that Istanbul and Richmond, VA are cities built on 7 hills?

 

[Jerome]

So is Lynchburg Va.:

Straight from Jerry Falwell's Liberty University website:

Lynchburg is built on seven hills, creating spectacular vistas and a unique municipal layout.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

LOL. If the RCC put the N.T. together, why have they been arguing against the inspiration of 2nd Peter for 1600 years ?

 

[Anastasia]

LOL. If the RCC put the N.T. together, why have they been arguing against the inspiration of 2nd Peter for 1600 years ?

How/where have they been arguing against it?

The New Testament had pretty much come together by 150AD but there continued to be discussion about a few books until about 400 AD. It was not officially canonized until the Council of Trent in the 1500′s. [ There were to be more precise.] three basic criteria for inclusion. [Source: http://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/how-was-the-bible-compiled/]

The Protestant Reformation began on 31 October 1517, in Wittenberg, Saxony, where Martin Luther nailed his Ninety-Five Theses on the Power and Efficacy of Indulgences to the door of the Castle Church, in Wittenberg. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestant_Reformation]

Considering the Episcopalian church started in the mid-late 1500's, I suspect it was not the Protestants that first put together the Bible.

Maybe it if was not the Catholic church that put it together, then it was the Orthodox.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Walter, it is apparent that you have an over abundance of hatred for Catholics that spills over in your communication to others. If I were you brother, I would take a hard look at the reasons behind all the hatred to flesh it out. I will sincerely pray that your intellect can grapple with it & address it in Christian love & humility.

 

[Matt Black]

There is no amount of REVISIONIST efforts that can cover up the bloody record of Rome. She was bloody in her secular involvement with apostolic Christianity and she was far more bloody in her ecclesiatical invovlement with apostolic Christianity. She stands along side and in the same descriptive camp as paganized Judiasm as a killer of people simply because of their beliefs (Jn. 16:1-5). Murder for religious reasons is the hall mark of false religion literally and figurative under the terms "Great Whore"

I don't think Rome has exactly a monopoly on religiously-motivated killing. Who pressed Margaret Clitheroe to death? Or executed Edmund Campion? And many other Catholics? And that's just in England. I could mention Michael Servetus in Geneva. Or the Salem witch-trials in 1692. Need I go on?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I don't think Rome has exactly a monopoly on religiously-motivated killing. Who pressed Margaret Clitheroe to death? Or executed Edmund Campion? And many other Catholics? And that's just in England. I could mention Michael Servetus in Geneva. Or the Salem witch-trials in 1692. Need I go on?

I think you need to be just a little careful about this. To the best of my knowledge the only person ever burned for heresy by English Protestants was Joan of Kent who was some sort of Anabaptist. NO Roman Catholic ever was. Several, like Clitheroe and Campion were condemned for treason, but none was burned for heresy.

The condemnation for treason was not always just, but after two attempts on the Life of Elizabeth I were made by Jesuits at the instigation of the Pope, she tended to get a bit jumpy. Until then, Roman Catholics were tolerated by Elizabeth.

Steve

 

[Matt Black]

Point taken to an extent; however if you read the accounts of Campion's martyrdom, he personally told the Queen that he recognised her as lawful sovereign; it was for refusing to renounce his Catholicism for which he was condemned.

And none of that gets Calvin or the Salem lot off the hook...