Featured Baptism in the Holy Spirit

DHK
And every believer receives the Holy Spirit at salvation without tongues.

GE:
Everyone who received the indwelling Holy Spirit had received salvation—without tongues the condition or guarantee for their salvation ever.

 

Acts 1:4-5 "...but wait for the promise of the Father, which saith he, for John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be BAPTIZED with the HOLY SPIRIT not many days hence."

Acts 1:8 "But ye shall receive power after that the Holy Ghost is come UPON you: and ye shall be witnesse unto me both in Jerusalem, and Judea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth"

Acts 2:33 "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promist of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now SEE and HEAR"

Acts 10:47 "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?"

 

I have never said you have to speak in tongues to be saved! There are many works of the Holy Spirit as everyone has mentioned several! One is indwelling at the moment of salvation! One is Upon for power when you are baptized in the Holy Spirit!
Some people it happens all at once..indwelt and upon like in Acts 10!
Some it happens separate as in the case of disciples and Acts 8 and 19.

 

Just as I said, you are either dishonest, your comprehension is zero, or you are willfully and stubbornly ignorant. I'll give you another chance. Tell us the instances that we have talked about numerous times and the explanations in context that we have given you numerous times, and explain why you disagree with these and that this is only our interpretation. Tell us why you are right and 1900 years of teaching by the rest of Christianity is wrong.

The fact is that after and ever since the Gospel was first preached to non-Jews, everyone is baptized by the HS at conversion. There is no baptism separate from and later than conversion that one must seek. And the evidence of conversion/HS baptism is the fruit of the Spirit, not "tongues".

Still waiting for you to explain how those very few instances (and there were not five of them, either) of the gift of the HS being delayed is the pattern to be followed from the NT until now, for every Christian.

 

I shared the Word! Do you not understand the Word? What part of the Word did you not understatnd? My answer was in Acts 2,8,10,19 and John 22!

 

I understand the Word, but you did not answer my question. Are you incapable of it? Answer the question or keep quiet!

How many instances are there in the entire NT of the giving of the HS being delayed?

 

Since Awaken refuses to answer or cannot answer, I'll supply the answer and the explanation, which I have given to Awaken before, and I'll expect the same results. Nevertheless, these are the facts:

The Holy Spirit was delayed being given in Samaria, in Acts 8, because this was the FIRST TIME the Gospel had been received by non-Jews, and also since these were Samaritans, whom the Jews hated, the HS was delayed in being given until Peter and John could be there to witness firsthand that the Gospel was indeed for these Samaritans.

In Acts 10, the HS was delayed in being given to Cornelius and those with him until Peter went and saw firsthand that the Gospel was for the Gentiles.

There was only ONE TIME when the Gospel was for the FIRST TIME presented to and received by the Samaritans, and there was only ONE TIME when the Gospel was for the FIRST TIME presented to and received by Gentiles.

In Acts 19, the HS was delayed in being given because these were NOT Christian disciples but only disciples of John who had only received John's baptism. When Paul preached Jesus to them, they accepted Jesus, were water baptized, and received the HS baptism.

These three instances are all unique, one-time events. There was only one first time that the Gospel was first received by the Samaritans, and only one first time that it was received by the Gentiles. Both of these times God required witnesses to the fact so that the Jews would believe the Gospel was for these people and not solely for the Jews, thus the delay in the giving of the HS baptism until the apostles could be there to witness it firsthand. As for the other instance, these were not even Christian disciples; they needed to believe in Jesus first before they could be given the baptism in the Holy Spirit.

So, these were unique, one-time events that could not be repeated since there was only one time that the Gospel was FIRST received by Samaritans and Gentiles. And yet what do the Charismatics do? They take these one time-events and try to make them normative for all Christians! The only way they can do this is to completely ignore the context and the plain meaning of these events. That is what Awaken does, and what they all do, to try to make scripture fit their so-called experience and their experience fit scripture which it does not.

Now that's not even touching on tongues but only the three instances where the gift of the HS was delayed.

As for tongues, this is mentioned only three times in the Book of Acts. The three references to tongues there indicate clearly that it was given purely as a witness to the proclamation of the Gospel. On Pentecost Day, it was one of the signs to convince Israel that Jesus is Savior and Lord. In the home of Cornelius, it helped to show Peter that the Gospel is for the Gentile as well as the Jews. At Ephesus in Acts 19, it served to persuade the disciples of John the Baptist that the Christian era had replaced the Johannine era.

There you have it. These are the scriptural facts. This is what all Christians have known and taught for 1900 years, until Parham and Seymour invented the Pentecostal movement based on occult practices.

Scripture does not support Pentecostalism, as I have clearly shown. Pentecostals have to mangle scripture and ignore context to claim that their doctrines have a scriptural basis which they do not. Further, scripture knows nothing of a private prayer language the way Charismatics teach it.

The conclusion: Charismatic/Pentecostal doctrine is false doctrine.

Every believer since these unique, first-time/one-time/only-time events receives the baptism of the HS at conversion. There is NO HS baptism separate from and subsequent to conversion which not all Christians have or which they must seek. Christian believers do NOT have to seek it because ALL believers receive the HS baptism when they come to faith in Jesus Christ and are converted. And tongues is not the evidence of this HS baptism which all Christians receive. No, the fruit of the Spirit is the evidence of being baptized in the Spirit.

All this HS baptism with evidence of tongues is a tribally conditioned and learned behavior. I have seen how it is acquired. There is nothing genuine about it. It is non-scriptural, anti-scriptural, false, and fake, the product of false teachers and gullible, willfully deceived minds.

 

Can you give to us a single verse that commands us to seek the Baptism in/of the Holy Spirt since being saved?

And that tongues would be THE sign of having received that?

 

Yes they do. They also receive the baptism at salvation which is essentially the same thing. You really didn't answer my post with that single statement. Here it is again:

And every believer receives the Holy Spirit at salvation without tongues.
Tongues are not given to every believer and never were.
Nowadays they are not given to any believer. If they were you would be able to tell me the languages that God has given you to speak in. But you can't because it is not God that has given you the Biblical gift of languages. You have been deceived into thinking you have a gift from God, when you don't. It is a fraudulent gift, that is unlike any gift that the NT believers ever had. The NT believers did not speak gibberish like you do.

 

I have been out for a few days! But you never cease to take a chance at belittling me.... so you continue to prove my point!

You can not prove that by scripture! That is only your interpretation!

I did not see a delay in Acts 10 They believed and received at the same time!

Your point?

The disciples were baptized by John too! Do you see where they were re baptized after John, NO! But we do see that the disciples received salvation in John 20 and then received the Baptism in Acts 2!

This does not disprove that it still happens today! That someone can receive the indwelling HS at salvation and later receive the baptism in the HS!

I was just thinking the same thing about you! How you HAVE to believe the way you do to fit it into your theory! No where does it say what you have described in scripture!

Every example showed speaking in tongues except Acts 8...but even there Simon saw something manifested! Paul also was saved on the road to Damascus and later hands were laid on him! Paul did speak in tongues, so why would he receive any different than any of the other examples?

This is why there is sooo many that disbelieve the truth in scripture because of the wrong teaching! We have been taught not to believe in the baptism in the Holy Spirit as scriptures are plain it is for power and not indwelling/salvation. So if you and others want to continue in unbelief concerning this...then you will never walk in what Jesus said you can!

You on the other hand have to ignore the plain scriptures to come up with your theory! Speaking to God is prayer...there is no way around those scriptures!

Your opinion is noted! We will all have to answer for what we share/teach! Your unbelief in pure scripture is not a good teaching!

The fruit is evidence of the indwelling HS! But every example given in Acts shows that tongues/prophecy etc. was manifested when they were baptized in the Holy Spirit! So again your theory does not match up with scripture! You are confusing the Spirit upon and the Spirit within! Even Jesus had the Spirit upon later in life...and He definitely had the Spirit within at birth! If Jesus had two separate experiences...who are you to say it does not happen today???

Sorry you have to flush the real down the toilet with the fake! I have said many times....JUST BECAUSE THERE IS FAKE OUT THERE IT DOES NOT DISPROVE THE REAL! There are fake preacher, teacher even fake christ! But the real still exist!
You can not learn to speak in tongues! If the Holy Spirit does not give the utterance it is not of God! Period!

 

I have shared this over and over on many threads! So why should I have to reapeat it?
#1 God does not command us! He offers us salvation/indwelling and the Holy Spirit! He died and left earth so we could have both!

He does tell us to ask for the Holy Spirit...

"Which of you fathers, if your son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead? Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? If you then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!" (Luke 11:11-13)

 

We can see that even in the life of Jesus...

"When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying, heaven was opened and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove." (Luke 3:21-22)

"You know what has happened throughout Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached-- how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him." (Acts 10:37-38)

"Now Jesus himself was about thirty years old when he began his ministry." (Luke 3:23)

"Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, where for forty days he was tempted by the devil." (Luke 4:1-2)

"When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time. Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about him spread through the whole countryside." (Luke 4:13-14)

First we are told that Jesus was baptized in water and then He received the Holy Spirit (not as a guarantee of His salvation, but for spiritual empowerment).

Yes, the indwelling Holy Spirit is evident by the fruit not nine gifts listed in 1 Cor. 12.

In every passage where people spoke in tongues in the book of Acts, notice that every new believer spoke in tongues.

 

So Jesus needed to be baptized by the Holy Spirit? Filled by the Spirit? Are you implying he wasn't saved, or that Christ Almighty, the second person of the triune Godhead, fully God and fully man, did not have the Spirit of God??
That is heresy; if not blasphemy!

More heresy.
On the day of Pentecost the 3,000 never spoke in tongues.
In 1Cor.12 it is evident that not everyone spoke in tongues.

1 Corinthians 12:29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?

These are rhetorical questions and they all have the same answer. The obvious answer is: "NO". They did not all speak in tongues, just as all were not apostles. Only some of them spoke in tongues and only some of them were apostles, and only some of them were teachers, and only some of them were prophets, etc. Tongues and interpretation were listed last, as the most inferior of all the gifts.

 

NO! I am implying just the opposite! He did not need salvation! But he was baptized in the Holy Spirit!
Scriptures is plain that he was annointed with power for ministry!

heresy is a strong word! It does not say they did not either! But it does say they continued in the apostles doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and IN PRAYER!

Not all are called into the ministry of tongues and interpretation in the assembly! Those listed in vs. 27-30 are ministry gifts!

 

Christ was not "baptized in the Holy Spirit."
What a silly statement to make--as if God Almighty was deficient in someway of the Spirit of God. Christ is God, always was God, always will be God. He didn't need any such baptism. He is God.
What happened is that the Holy Spirit in symbolic form descended upon him (only symbolically) to show to others or to signify to others that this was the beginning of his ministry. That is all. There was no baptism.
What you teach is heresy.

Continuing in doctrine and in prayer is not speaking in tongues. There are dire consequences for those that add to the Word of God. Your views on this subject are quite heretical.

You were the one that made the statement that all new believers spoke with tongues. I just proved you wrong. Now you are backtracking. Tongues is not a ministry. It was a gift of certain members of the local church in the first century. It had a purpose to fulfill in that century and has now ceased.
What you practice, gibberish, is not tongues. It is practiced by the pagans.
What the early church had were real languages. You don't deny that, but you don't speak a real language either. If you did, you would know what it is, and would be able to tell us. But you don't.

 

So you are saying that Jesus was not anointed By God with the Holy Spirit and power?
What does Acts 1:8 say that happen to the disciples when the Holy Spirit came UPON them?

I did not add anything to the Word, I simply said they continued in PRAYER!

I said all that were baptized in the Holy Spirit spoke in tongues. Acts 2, 10, 19 and I believe 8. Most do not but I do not see why they would not since 2, 10, 19 did! Simon SAW something manifest!

 

Your post is filled with lies and inaccuracies.

What I have given you is NOT my interpretation. It is unadulterated scriptural truth based on taking the scripture in context, not as you do in taking an occult-based experience and mangling the scriptures to try and pretend that it says what you say it does. The explanation of the scriptures that I have given is based on what they actually say, taken in their correct context, and not what your occult-inspired experiences wish they would say. The entire church has correctly understood the meaning of these scriptures for 1900 years. The teachers whom you get your twisted doctrine from were inspired by the occult.

The truth is that there is no HS baptism apart from conversion. The three NT instances were unique, one-time events for the reasons I explained. There is no private prayer language; nowhere in scripture can such be found. Anyone who has the GIFT of tongues can use this in private, but you do not have it, and there is very little if any evidence that anyone today has it. The mission field proves that beyond doubt. Tongues is not the initial evidence of HS baptism; that is a cult-inspired, anti-biblical doctrine.

I have given you the truth of scripture. You ignore it, deny it, twist it to try to make your occult practices line up with it. Satan has deceived you into thinking you are following God. You are not. You may wake up one day before you are done irreparable harm; I hope and pray so. But your willful blindness and pigheaded stubbornness don't give me reason to believe you will wake up. So, continue to deny the absolute truth you have been told, keep swallowing the lie that the church for 1900 years was in unbelief and that I and others are also in unbelief, keep believing that you and others like you have been enlightened with this great spiritual enlightenment that lay hid for 1900 years. Yes, keep butting your rock-hard head against that brick wall and see where it gets you. All it's going to get you is a softened brain and a destroyed soul. But that is often the result of Charismatic arrogance and stupidity. I've seen it many times.

 

:thumbsup: OK....I will keep believing what scriptures say over your interpretation! I have a peace about it! I hope one day you will too!

 

The God that you are portraying is weak, anemic, feeble, and less than God.
He was only a man, and not fully God according to you. He needed to be "filled with the Holy Spirit," according to a previous post, inferring that he was not fully God, that he was lacking in deity.
Christ is God. Never forget that!

 

You are the one who has an interpretation, an erroneous, occult-based one that is only 113 years old. It did not exist before then. I have given you what the scriptures teach in context, and the church has understood that fact since the first century NT church.

Your occult teaching divides Christians into two classes: those who are in unbelief and thus spiritually inferior, who have not been baptized with the HS, who do not have the power of the Spirit or the manifestation of the HS in their lives, contrasted with those who have achieved a higher spiritual plane by seeking and experiencing a supposed HS baptism apart from conversion and being given tongues and a private prayer language. This is absolutely not taught in scripture; it is a doctrine of demons.