Baptist attitude toward Muslims

[DHK]

If you are inferring that those missionaries in Iraq are standing up and praising the name of Christ to the masses in Iraq, I do not believe you.

Tell me Bob, How many of the masses do you stand up and praise the name of Christ to in America? five hundred? one thousand? five thousand? one million>

You are a hypocrite, in that you don't do in America what you demand a missionary to do in an Islamic nation.

 

[donnA]

If muslims aren't as bad we all say they are, not dangerous, don't hate christians and want to kill us. Then why do the missionaries have to go in secrecy?

 

[Brother Bob]

Tell me Bob, How many of the masses do you stand up and praise the name of Christ to in America? five hundred? one thousand? five thousand? one million>

You are a hypocrite, in that you don't do in America what you demand a missionary to do in an Islamic nation.

Yea, but this country is around 80 percent Christian or more and declare the name of the Lord constantly. So, I guess I am not a hypocrit, as you so easily throw around the slur. I don't know how many it takes to make the masses to you, but I think its pretty well covered here in America, thank you.

You are a hypocrite

You go around bearing false testimony.

BBob,

 

[Brother Bob]

Bob, you are being very arrogant. You are acting as if you are omniscient, but only God has that attribute. Just because YOU haven't heard of those things happening doesn't it mean they haven't occurred!

I feel sorry for you.
Missionaries go there for a reason. The reason is Biblical.

Acts 26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

1 Peter 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

You are free to quote all those scriptures here DHK:, for it is about the True God and not Allah.

The sad part is that you can quote them here, but over there you have to keep your mouth shut and pass out flour. You know its the truth but sadly will not acknowledge it. It does not matter, we already know what the situation is over there. What you do, you do in secret. Jesus preached on the mountain tops, synagogues, homes, down by the seashore, etc.

BBob,

 

[DHK]

If muslims aren't as bad we all say they are, not dangerous, don't hate christians and want to kill us. Then why do the missionaries have to go in secrecy?

Who says they go in secrecy?
Many of those governments welcome missionaries, usually on the same basis that our government welcomes immigrants--that they have something to offer the nation: skills--such as teaching, a medical degree, a trade, or some other profession. If you were the head of the government wouldn't you desire the same thing?

 

[DHK]

You are free to quote all those scriptures here DHK:, for it is about the True God and not Allah.

The sad part is that you can quote them here, but over there you have to keep your mouth shut and pass out flour.

BBob,

I suppose you have the right to call me a liar Bob, but it is not the ethical thing to do.

 

[Brother Bob]

I suppose you have the right to call me a liar Bob, but it is not the ethical thing to do.

Just following up on you calling me a hypocrit and showing that I am not and you made a false statement. You did not have to say that I was a hypocrit, when this is a Christian nation.

Tell me, those bags of flour and grain you pass out, does it say "Canadian made" or "USA" on the bags???

Its Ironic that you say: "I have a right to call you a liar, but its unethical", when I am responding to you calling me a hypocrit and showing you made a false statement; in calling me a hypocrit. You should not of done it.

BBob,

 

[DHK]

Just following up on you calling me a hypocrit and showing that I am not and you made a false statement. You did not have to say that I was a hypocrit, when this is a Christian nation.

America is not a Christian, never was a Christian nation, and never will be a Christian nation. There never has been a Christian nation. Ever since the origin of Christianity, true Christianity has always been in the minority, never in the majority. America is a humanistic secular nation. The religion of ever secular educational institution across Americal is humanism. America by no stretch of the imagination is a Christian nation.

I said you are a hypocrite because you do not do what you demand missionaries to do in an Islamic nations. So get that straight. You stated: Do they stand up in front of the MASSES of the people and shout praises to the people?
I asked of you the same question:
Do you stand up in front of the MASSES of Americans and preach before them? America has more than 300 million people doesn't it? How many of those masses have you stood before and preached the gospel, Bob? You are a hypocrite, in that you demand of others what you do not demand of yourself.

Tell me, those bags of flour and grain you pass out, does it say "Canadian made" or "USA" on the bags???

You would be surprised. For years the Canadian prairies has been known as the bread basket of the world. Yes, many of the say "Canadian made."

Its Ironic that you say: "I have a right to call you a liar, but its unethical", when I am responding to you calling me a hypocrit and showing you made a false statement; in calling me a hypocrit. You should not of done it.

You call me a liar, denying that what I have seen is not true. That is very arrogant.
You are a hypocrite, in that you don't demand of yourself what you demand of others in Islamic lands.

 

[Brother Bob]

I said you are a hypocrite because you do not do what you demand missionaries to do in an Islamic nations. So get that straight. You stated: Do they stand up in front of the MASSES of the people and shout praises to the people?
I asked of you the same question:
Do you stand up in front of the MASSES of Americans and preach before them? America has more than 300 million people doesn't it? How many of those masses have you stood before and preached the gospel, Bob? You are a hypocrite, in that you demand of others what you do not demand of yourself.

Again, I say you are making false statements calling me a hypocrit. I have been preaching the Gospel for 35 years. I reached quite a lot of people in all them years. I think I have done what the Lord wanted for He has lengthened out my life by several years, when doctors gave me up for dead a long time ago. So I have a witness that the Lord is with me. Call me a hypocrit all you want, but every time you do, you make a "false" statement.

You call me a liar, denying that what I have seen is not true. That is very arrogant.
You are a hypocrite, in that you don't demand of yourself what you demand of others in Islamic lands.
__________________
DHK

Again, you make false statements. I said it was not known. I did not say it was not true, just no one has ever heard of it to amount to many.

As a missionary, what are you accomplishing here calling me a hypocrit, you think its the Lord's work no doubt. The Muslims think its the Lord's work when they behead an American also, shouting "Praise Allah".

Let me say that around 80 percent of US say they are Christians. Who am I to deny them. You are trying to get one Muslim to say they are Christians and here in US there are Millions. Something Kinda messed up with this statement don't you think? You say they are not Christians, but there are many Muslims that are. hmmmm................

BBob,

 

[righteousdude2]

Our Missionary Wears a Burka

Who says they go in secrecy?
Many of those governments welcome missionaries, usually on the same basis that our government welcomes immigrants--that they have something to offer the nation: skills--such as teaching, a medical degree, a trade, or some other profession. If you were the head of the government wouldn't you desire the same thing?

Our church missionary wears a burka, and is extremely careful in all she does while out in the public [Malaysia] so as to not offend. She also does this to protect herself from being killed by some fanatic.

She has adopted all the customs of the Muslims she lives among, and it is partly because she has to fear for her life.

This is not what I could do, or expect my wife to do [the burka]. I respect our missionary, and continue to pray for her safety. However, her returns [people being saved], are minuscule because of all the compromising she has to do to be non offensive to the Muslims.

In America, the Muslims don't do anything to show respect for our customs, and that may be due to the fact that they don't have to live in fear for their life.

Now I ask you: which country is more receptive of others living among them?

 

[righteousdude2]

Double Standard HERE?

I suppose you have the right to call me a liar Bob, but it is not the ethical thing to do.

Does that make your calling Bob a hypocrite in an earlier post also unethical? :thumbs:

 

[DHK]

Our church missionary wears a burka, and is extremely careful in all she does while out in the public [Malaysia] so as to not offend. She also does this to protect her from being killed by some fanatic.

She has adopted all the customs of the Muslims she lives among, and it is partly because she has to fear for her life.

This is not what I could do, or expect my wife to do [the burka]. I respect our missionary, and continue to pray for her safety. However, her returns [people being saved], are minuscule because of all the compromising she has to do to be non offensive to the Muslims.

In America, the Muslims don't do anything to show respect for our customs, and that may be due to the fact that they don't have to live in fear for their life.

Now I ask you: which country is more receptive of others living among them?

Islamic nations for the most part are dicatorships, and America is a democracy with freedoms which everyone of us should praise and thank the Lord for. There is no question about that. Does that mean we should condemn that all to hell, not try to evangelize them, do nothing in our power to reach them for Christ?? God forbid!

I never once suggested that they were in a better condition than us. I said that it is not impossible to work as a missionary there. Bob's statement is: To go as a missionary to Iraq (or Islamic nation) is equivalent to throwing yourself under an 18 wheeler.
That is an extreme and ridiculous statement to make. Being called by the Lord to be a misssionary to an Islamic nation is not equivalent to suicide as Bob suggests. As you point out one may have to adapt to some of the customs and cultures. Is that too big a sacrifice to win some. Is that not what Paul taught:

1 Corinthians 9:22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

When my wife traveled with my she did not have to wear the burqa, but she did wear the appropriate dress of the people. I don't see why the person your speaking of would have to wear a burqa. Do all the Iraqi Christians wear burqas. No. There is an Iraqi minority living there who have the freedom not to dress like a Muslim. Others have that freedom too. They may be wise in dressing like the locals, but that doesn't mean wearing a specific Muslim dress.

We are careful where we go. There are places to avoid. Why go to a particular place in a city that you know demonstrations are going to take place? The Bible teaches to be wise as serpents and harmless as doves.

 

[righteousdude2]

Agreed

Islamic nations for the most part are dicatorships, and America is a democracy with freedoms which everyone of us should praise and thank the Lord for. There is no question about that. Does that mean we should condemn that all to hell, not try to evangelize them, do nothing in our power to reach them for Christ?? God forbid!

I never once suggested that they were in a better condition than us. I said that it is not impossible to work as a missionary there. Bob's statement is: To go as a missionary to Iraq (or Islamic nation) is equivalent to throwing yourself under an 18 wheeler.
That is an extreme and ridiculous statement to make. Being called by the Lord to be a missionary to an Islamic nation is not equivalent to suicide as Bob suggests. As you point out one may have to adapt to some of the customs and cultures. Is that too big a sacrifice to win some. Is that not what Paul taught:

1 Corinthians 9:22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

When my wife traveled with my she did not have to wear the burqa, but she did wear the appropriate dress of the people. I don't see why the person your speaking of would have to wear a burqa. Do all the Iraqi Christians wear burqas. No. There is an Iraqi minority living there who have the freedom not to dress like a Muslim. Others have that freedom too. They may be wise in dressing like the locals, but that doesn't mean wearing a specific Muslim dress.

We are careful where we go. There are places to avoid. Why go to a particular place in a city that you know demonstrations are going to take place? The Bible teaches to be wise as serpents and harmless as doves.

She is acting out of respect to the area she serves. Apparently she was told her manner of dress had to reflect that respect of Islam. I don't agree with her bowing down to the local laws/custom's, but, than again, I don't know how real the threat is that she has shared with the church.

But, you make some very good points, and it is apparent that you and your wife served God first, something I don't think our young lady is doing. I think she is too careful, and therefore not being a strong witness to Jesus. For example, she wears her burqa even when she's on furlough.

However, it is not for me to really judge her. And I am supportive prayerfully and financially of her work.

 

[Brother Bob]

I never once suggested that they were in a better condition than us. I said that it is not impossible to work as a missionary there. Bob's statement is: To go as a missionary to Iraq (or Islamic nation) is equivalent to throwing yourself under an 18 wheeler.
That is an extreme and ridiculous statement to make. Being called by the Lord to be a misssionary to an Islamic nation is not equivalent to suicide as Bob suggests. As you point out one may have to adapt to some of the customs and cultures. Is that too big a sacrifice to win some. Is that not what Paul taught:

I think you should produce where I made a statement as you say.
I said, to go from house to house (in Iraq) teaching Jesus Christ is suicide, the same as throwing yourself in front of an 18 wheeler, for they both are suicide.

Or, to shout that "Allah is not God", our God is the true God over in the streets of Iraq, would be the same as throwing yourself in front of an 18 wheeler, for they both are suicide.

All these statements are factual. If you do not believe it. Pick out which one you will do and do it and see how long you live.

You twist words to say what you want to hear, you never do listen to the other party but make up what they say, so you can make a long speech, which make no sense at all.

Let me post what I said in regards to a news article about missionaries in Iraq.

"We want to be respectful to the local religion," said the Rev. Sekyu Chang, 45, of Light Global Mission Church in Vienna, who helped set up the charity thrift store. "There is nothing outwardly Christian about the shop, but most of the workers are Christian. They are going to share their personal faith when there are occasions."
With a population estimated to be more than 95 percent Muslim and outbreaks of violence in the name of Islam occurring on an almost daily basis, Iraq is not a place where Christian missionaries can openly evangelize on street corners, hold community prayer meetings or hand out stacks of Bibles. Many say they entered the country as businessmen or aid workers, roles that let them establish relationships with Iraqis about something other than religion.

DHK:
We are careful where we go. There are places to avoid. Why go to a particular place in a city that you know demonstrations are going to take place?

BBob: Here is how they are being missionaries. I don't mean to be mean, but they are hiding their beliefs to hand out help or sell it. They cannot make it known they are missionaries, you know why? Fear of their lives and I do not blame them. God give us enough sense to not throw ourselves in front of a 18 wheeler. More power to them and may God Bless,



BBob,

 

[blackbird]

My good friend and his wife and children are in the US on furlow as SBC missionaries to the country of Senagal in Africa

99% Muslim

They were exiled from Ivory Coast because of the Civil war there----not because they were Christians--but because they were US Citizens

They are free to share their faith--and do--on the streets of the capital

They have "House Workers"---who are Muslim--and share their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ with them

About the only "peeve" that they had to grow accustomed to---was the Muslim prayer time---bells and sirens sound at the appropriate time---day and nite

Aren't you glad that we as Believers in the Lord Jesus Christ don't need "reminders" to pray

What a pitiful religion is the muslim---lets pray for them--right now where you are---lift your voice up in prayer for a movement of God to bring salvation to muslim people and for them to turn from the dead works unto a Living God!!!!

 

[donnA]

Who says they go in secrecy?
Many of those governments welcome missionaries, usually on the same basis that our government welcomes immigrants--that they have something to offer the nation: skills--such as teaching, a medical degree, a trade, or some other profession. If you were the head of the government wouldn't you desire the same thing?

you guys have been saying that in this thread, they go in as something else(teacher, etc.), say they are there for one thing, then do missionary work, which they hide the fact they are missionaries.

 

[youngmom4]

My old church sent a whole family to Indonesia as missionaries at one point. I do not know if they are still there because it has been almost four years since I moved, but I do know that when they went, they had to go in with some kind of trade. They could not enter the country as missionaries. That country is so harsh to Christians that any letters or emails they send back to the states have to use code names. However, I know this family, and I promise you they are not hiding their faith. They are there serving the Lord, and they had seen a number of conversions while I was still a member of that church. They are doing what they have to in order to survive, but they are most certainly doing their missionary work, as well.

I can see both sides to the argument taking place on this thread, but here is my question: Does it really matter how they get into the country or how they survive while they are there if even one soul is brought to Christ as a result? What happened to the parable of the lost sheep and the parable of the lost coin? We should rejoice over every soul added to the kingdom, regardless of who took the Word to them, where, or how, or why. :godisgood:

 

[donnA]

It's been claimed that muslim's don't want to kill chritians, on this thread. So my question is, if they don''t want to kill christians, why is it christians must go in as soemthing other then missionaries? Why are dangerous places for christians being talked about ehre, if in fact muslims don't want to kill christians?
A muslim that doesn't want christians killed isn't a very good muslim, since the koran commands them to kill unbelievers who will not convert.

 

[DHK]

you guys have been saying that in this thread, they go in as something else(teacher, etc.), say they are there for one thing, then do missionary work, which they hide the fact they are missionaries.

Both China and Russia are wide open mission fields provided one is willing to go to teach English as a second language to those people. Is there a difference?

 

[DHK]

It's been claimed that muslim's don't want to kill chritians, on this thread. So my question is, if they don''t want to kill christians, why is it christians must go in as soemthing other then missionaries? Why are dangerous places for christians being talked about ehre, if in fact muslims don't want to kill christians?
A muslim that doesn't want christians killed isn't a very good muslim, since the koran commands them to kill unbelievers who will not convert.

Why is it that "Americans" "wanted" to kill "blacks" 150 years ago?
And that is a true statement, just as true as the statements that you are making above.