Baptist attitude toward Muslims

[donnA]

Why is it that "Americans" "wanted" to kill "blacks" 150 years ago?
And that is a true statement, just as true as the statements that you are making above.

CURRENTLY, muslims want us dead., want all unbeleivers in islam dead.

 

[donnA]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pV4nemgNNK4

http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/42709

http://www.brookesnews.com/062301memri.html

http://www.islamreview.com/articles/islamicintolerance.shtml

How far is the Muslim to go, that religion will be all for Allah? "The recompense of those who make war against Allah and His Messenger and spread corruption in the land is that they are to be killed or crucified, or have their hand and a foot cut off on opposite sides, or be expelled from the land. For them is shame in this world and a great punishment in the Everlasting Life." (Surah 5:33) Time and again, the Qur'an commands "...fight in the way of Allah."


The Example of Muhammad
The Qur'an entreats Muslims to worship Allah, and Him alone. Muhammad has become to the people of Islam an example to follow after in the service of Allah. "Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah. Those who are with him are harsh against the unbelievers but merciful to one another." (Surah 48:29) Muhammad declared of himself: "I have been ordered to fight against the people until they testify that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that Muhammad is Allah's Apostle, and offer the prayers perfectly and give the obligatory charity..." (Hadiths Vol.1, 2:24)
And so it is, that a study of Muhammad's life reveals a man of war. He was a man of the sword, and incited those who would follow him to be likewise. Today, those who truly desire to live as Muslims will themselves be as Muhammad was. They will declare religion to be of Allah, and fight all who stand in opposition.

May the reader consider carefully the nature of Islam. Though it speaks of peace, tolerance and equality, the Qur'an's self proclaimed right of abrogation reduces these claims to empty words. The overall picture of the Qur'an is one of violence to non-Muslims. The comments of Islamic leaders motivate followers to war against non-Muslims. Muhammad, the Apostle of Allah, was himself a violent man, killing those who opposed his religion. Though not all Muslims may conduct themselves in like manner, without doubt, Islam teaches its followers to be violent.

http://www.lookinguntojesus.net/20030126.htm

For Allah, warfare is good (Koran 2:216) and jihad (fighting in the way of Allah) should continue until only Islam is dominant (Koran 2:193, 3:85, 8:39, 9:33, 35:37 and 61:9). Allah wants his followers to slaughter his enemies (Koran 8:67), allows Muslims to loot (Koran 8:1, 8:41, 8:69, and 59:7), to commit suicide (Koran 2:154, 2:207, 3:140-144, 3:157, 9:111 and 47:4), and to acquire slaves (Koran 4:3, 4:23-24 and 8:67). Muhammad himself was allowed to engage in unlimited sex with female slaves and captives (Koran 4:3, 23:6, 33:50-52 and 70:30). Is this a religion of tolerance?
In addition, Allah orders Muslims not to take Jews, Christians and other unbelievers as friends (Koran 3:28, 5:51 and 9:23), and will not forgive Christians (Koran 4:48 and 4:116). Muhammad taught to put the infidels to death wherever they were found (Koran 2:191, 2:244, 4:89, 5:36, 9:5, and 9:29), urged Muslims to fight the unbelievers who are close (Koran 9:123), mentioned that fighting is obligatory (Koran 2:216), and mandated the conquering of those relatives who opposed Muslims because loyalty to Islam overrode all other human bonds (Koran 9:23-24, and 58:22).
Muhammad is also quoted in the Koran as urging fighting until Islam is the only religion (Koran 2:193, 8:39, and 61:9), seeking the death of apostates (Koran 9:73-74), accepting slavery (Koran 4:3, 4:24, 5:87-89, 23:6, 24:32-33, 33:50-52 and 70:30), supporting the slaughter of captives (Koran 8:67), the raping of women captives (Koran 4:24), beheading the infidels (Koran 47:4), and approving looting in wars (Koran 24:29, and 48:20-21). Is this the religion of diversity?

http://www.aim.org/special-report/m...hreat-excerpt-of-aim-report-september-b-2005/

It comes right out of the koran. Any muslim (or anyone else for that matter) who says differently is either a liar, or is ignorant of his own religion.

 

[Brother Bob]

I do not know of anyone on here who is against a muslim converting to Christianity. What we are against is their command to kill us, and they carry out that command also. Here we go over there under false pretense and have to keep Jesus Christ a secret, and over here in the good ole USA, they want showers placed around the States to wash their feet, and shut down the work place and provide "prayer rugs" for all of them, so many times a day, and we no doubt will take tax payers dollars and do it for them, but not with my blessings, we won't. If our government gives in to these demands, it will make me feel more relunctant to send in my taxes. It says to render unto Ceasar what is Ceasar's, but I do not think it is Ceasar's right to take money from us to support their religion.

BBob,

 

[donnA]

I don't object to anyone converting to Christianity. What I object to is saying they aren't dangerous, and don't hate us and want us dead, when all the evidence, even their own words and deeds say otherwise.

 

[blackbird]

I don't object to anyone converting to Christianity. What I object to is saying they aren't dangerous, and don't hate us and want us dead, when all the evidence, even their own words and deeds say otherwise.

And I use to believe it was only the USA that was the "Bad Satan"---but now that I think about it---they'd just a'soon blow things up in Paris as they would in New York City as they would in London as they would in Tel Aviv!!!

This is why I could never be President of the United States---because I would have to learn how to juggle both Christianity in one hand and Islam in the other and look straight into the camera onto the world and proclaim that both pray to the same God---'fraid not!!!

 

[DHK]

CURRENTLY, muslims want us dead., want all unbeleivers in islam dead.

If you make this statement (it is called a sweeping generalization--a logical fallacy), it is just as true as me making this statement:

150 years ago, ALL Americans wanted ALL blacks dead.

That's the truth Donna isn't it. That is just as true as the statement you said about Muslims. Why are you stereotyping?

 

[DHK]

I think you should produce where I made a statement as you say.
I said, to go from house to house (in Iraq) teaching Jesus Christ is suicide, the same as throwing yourself in front of an 18 wheeler, for they both are suicide.

And what you have said is a false statement. If you have never been there how can you make a statement out of ignorance. There is a certain amount of house to house evangelism that is possible to do. And there is a certain amount of house to house evangelism in America that is not possible to do, if you think about it. Again don't be so hypocritical. If you have never been there, don't speak out of ignorance.

Or, to shout that "Allah is not God", our God is the true God over in the streets of Iraq, would be the same as throwing yourself in front of an 18 wheeler, for they both are suicide.

Don't make foolish statements. Go into a mosque in America and do the same thing. You will end up with the same result. And that is not your exact quote. You have changed it.

All these statements are factual. If you do not believe it. Pick out which one you will do and do it and see how long you live.

All those statements are not factual. They are false statements borne out of ignorance and bias. They are statements you ought to be ashamed of.

You twist words to say what you want to hear, you never do listen to the other party but make up what they say, so you can make a long speech, which make no sense at all.

I am listening Bob. I am listening to innuendo, hatred, a refusal to love your neighbor as yourself, a refusal to carry out the Great Commission, a refusal to obey the Bible, and conclusions based on ignorance.

Let me post what I said in regards to a news article about missionaries in Iraq.

"We want to be respectful to the local religion," said the Rev. Sekyu Chang, 45, of Light Global Mission Church in Vienna, who helped set up the charity thrift store. "There is nothing outwardly Christian about the shop, but most of the workers are Christian. They are going to share their personal faith when there are occasions."
With a population estimated to be more than 95 percent Muslim and outbreaks of violence in the name of Islam occurring on an almost daily basis, Iraq is not a place where Christian missionaries can openly evangelize on street corners, hold community prayer meetings or hand out stacks of Bibles. Many say they entered the country as businessmen or aid workers, roles that let them establish relationships with Iraqis about something other than religion.

Consider the source Bob before you put a lot of credence into this report. Did it come from a Christian (true Christian) source? No, it was from a secular newspaper who, no doubt has a bias against Christian missionaries in the first place. It is not a reliable source. Why not quote from a missionary prayer letter instead. Why not go to the real source of what the conditions are from a missionary's perspective? Why are you using biased sources?

BBob: Here is how they are being missionaries. I don't mean to be mean, but they are hiding their beliefs to hand out help or sell it. They cannot make it known they are missionaries, you know why? Fear of their lives and I do not blame them. God give us enough sense to not throw ourselves in front of a 18 wheeler. More power to them and may God Bless,

Your second last statement is an insult against all missionaries. It advocates that Spirit-led missionaries are just as well off committing suicide then making the trip to the nation that God has called them to. You make unwarranted statements of which you have no knowledge, and your statements are based on ignorance. Does God purposely lead people into suicide? Is this your view? I pity you Bob. And yet you have full knowledge that there are missionaries over there. How contradictory you are.

 

[Brother Bob]

Your second last statement is an insult against all missionaries. It advocates that Spirit-led missionaries are just as well off committing suicide then making the trip to the nation that God has called them to. You make unwarranted statements of which you have no knowledge, and your statements are based on ignorance. Does God purposely lead people into suicide? Is this your view? I pity you Bob. And yet you have full knowledge that there are missionaries over there. How contradictory you are.
__________________
DHK

May be an insult to you but the truth anyway. Think about it when you and your wife are picking the safe places to go and wear their apparell, so you will not be noticed. You are being hypocritical yourself. Over there to declare Jesus Christ, but dressing like the enemy and trying to be amongst them unnoticed. To be truthful, that is not declaring Jesus Christ, that is trying to be among them and appear as one of them, not a Christian. These are you own words.

Also, you saying the whites all wanted the blacks dead in the past is a hypocritical statement and a ignornant one. If the whites had of wanted the blacks dead, they would of killed them all. It would of not been too hard to do. Also, whites were not using the bible to be against blacks as the Muslims are using the Koran to kill Americans. You don't know what you are talking about. The whites were wrong using blacks as slaves but in most cases were fond of them as people and many help them in times of trouble. You make a false accusation that the whites wanted all the blacks dead. It is not true, it is false. Do you have any written material where the whites declared a death sentence to all blacks, no you do not. You are making it up.

BBob,

BBob,

 

[DHK]

May be an insult to you but the truth anyway. Think about it when you and your wife are picking the safe places to go and wear their apparell, so you will not be noticed. You are being hypocritical yourself. Over there to declare Jesus Christ, but dressing like the enemy and trying to be amongst them unnoticed. To be truthful, that is not declaring Jesus Christ, that is trying to be among them and appear as one of them, not a Christian. These are you own words.
BBob,

Bob are the places in the U.S. that you would not go? Would you go willingly to the ghettos of Chicago and New York City? Are they safe for you? Is all of America "safe"?
Again you are hypocritical in your statements, as you choose even in America the places you think you must avoid.
Don't speak out of your ignorance and assumptions.

 

[DHK]

Also, you saying the whites all wanted the blacks dead in the past is a hypocritical statement and a ignornant one. If the whites had of wanted the blacks dead, they would of killed them all.

And if ALL Muslims wanted all the Americans dead all one billion of them would have united together and would have wiped them out by now.
You are illogical in your statements.

It would of not been too hard to do.

Maybe not. The fact is "ALL Americans did not want ALL blacks dead; just as ALL Muslims do not want ALL Americans dead. So stop your stereotyping. If the latter were true it would have been accomplished by now.

Also, whites were not using the bible to be against blacks as the Muslims are using the Koran to kill Americans. You don't know what you are talking about. The whites were wrong using blacks as slaves but in most cases were fond of them as people and many help them in times of trouble. You make a false accusation that the whites wanted all the blacks dead. It is not true, it is false.

I never made a false accusation. If you say I did you didn't read my post. I made a comparison. What has been posted on this thread is comparable to saying that All Americans wanted All blacks dead. I didn't say that as a fact. I said it as a comparison to bring you to your senses.

Do you have any written material where the whites declared a death sentence to all blacks, no you do not. You are making it up.

Read my posts Bob instead of falsely accusing me of things that I did not say.

 

[Brother Bob]

And if ALL Muslims wanted all the Americans dead all one billion of them would have united together and would have wiped them out by now.
You are illogical in your statements.

You got to be kidding. Have you forgot we could "nuke" them all to kingdom come.

Maybe not. The fact is "ALL Americans did not want ALL blacks dead; just as ALL Muslims do not want ALL Americans dead. So stop your stereotyping. If the latter were true it would have been accomplished by now.

This is a foolish. You brought the blacks and whites into this discussion, not me. Goes to show you don't know what you are talking about.

Quote:
Also, whites were not using the bible to be against blacks as the Muslims are using the Koran to kill Americans. You don't know what you are talking about. The whites were wrong using blacks as slaves but in most cases were fond of them as people and many help them in times of trouble. You make a false accusation that the whites wanted all the blacks dead. It is not true, it is false.
I never made a false accusation. If you say I did you didn't read my post. I made a comparison. What has been posted on this thread is comparable to saying that All Americans wanted All blacks dead. I didn't say that as a fact. I said it as a comparison to bring you to your senses.

Well then, I guess its alright if you were just making a comparison. Sheesh!! Your comparison is false.

Here is your post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by donnA
CURRENTLY, muslims want us dead., want all unbeleivers in islam dead.

If you make this statement (it is called a sweeping generalization--a logical fallacy), it is just as true as me making this statement:

150 years ago, ALL Americans wanted ALL blacks dead.

That's the truth Donna isn't it. That is just as true as the statement you said about Muslims. Why are you stereotyping?
__________________
DHK

Here is what you are saying now:

I never made a false accusation. If you say I did you didn't read my post. I made a comparison. What has been posted on this thread is comparable to saying that All Americans wanted All blacks dead. I didn't say that as a fact. I said it as a comparison to bring you to your senses

You made a false statement then, and you make another one now.

Old saying is always tell the facts and you don't have to make another false statement to try and make up for the last. I am dressing it up a little. IMO

BBob,

 

[DHK]

You got to be kidding. Have you forgot we could "nuke" them all to kingdom come.

And they could do the same to you. Pakistan is the second largest Islamic nation in the world, the fifth largest nation in the world, has a population of 160 million, and is a nuclear power. They have the capability also of "nuking the good old USA to "all kingdom come" as you say.

This is a foolish. You brought the blacks and whites into this discussion, not me. Goes to show you don't know what you are talking about.

I do. You don't know logic when you see it. You can't see through your own bias.

Well then, I guess its alright if you were just making a comparison. Sheesh!! Your comparison is false.

The comparison is very apt. But then you don't know the facts in Islamic nations, so how would you know anything about the comparison.

You made a false statement then, and you make another one now.

I never made a false statement. You failed to see the comparison. You didn't read carefully. I can't help that.

Old saying is always tell the facts and you don't have to make another false statement to try and make up for the last. I am dressing it up a little. IMO

You make up stories and tell false accusations. You don't read carefully what I say. I have stated the facts and you have misconstrued them. You look through red-colored glasses, and only read what you want to read. Your bias prevents you from reading the truth.

 

[Brother Bob]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
You got to be kidding. Have you forgot we could "nuke" them all to kingdom come.

And they could do the same to you. Pakistan is the second largest Islamic nation in the world, the fifth largest nation in the world, has a population of 160 million, and is a nuclear power. They have the capability also of "nuking the good old USA to "all kingdom come" as you say.

Sounds like you would enjoy seeing it. If you think they could match the good Ole USA in nukes, you are naive.

DHK; previously
150 years ago, ALL Americans wanted ALL blacks dead.

And DHK now:

I didn't say that as a fact. I said it as a comparison to bring you to your senses

Trouble with putting down in writing, sometimes it comes back to bite you.

BBob,