Featured 'Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved'

InTheLight
IT's theology is worse than that. In Calvinism:

can you show where any of the links say God has predestined people to be incapable of believing?

God is angry with the wicked everyday

All men are responsible for their sin.

why is this an issue to you?

 

There are over 300 posts now. ITL pointed out your contradictions as far back as post #88.
You are so upset now that you have called me "a liar" five times in this one post alone.
You are a bit out of order don't you think?

This is what your theology teaches.
On the one hand you say a person must repent of all his sins. You have said that many times.
OTOH, you have said that it is God that grants repentance to man.
--Both statements cannot be true at the same time. I have shown you why, and how you take Acts 11:18 out of its context. That you don't listen or are not teachable, that I cannot help.

It is sad you have to resort to such ad hominems.
OTOH, you are asking the impossible from me. You have a wrong definition of repentance, a definition which is not found in the Bible. as I have said. Now you want me to show in the Bible where your unbiblical definition is not found??Laugh

More ad hominem; more demonstration of your inability to debate.
You have given your definition of repent. Check post #88. One must repent of all his sins. True or false?
Since you have made that statement many times, it is my opinion that the salvation message you preach, whether you believe it or not, is basically a works based salvation. If one must repent of his sins in order to be saved, then that is works. Salvation is by faith. Check Romans 5:1.

As usual, however, you attack the messenger instead of answering the message. That is not debate.

The repetition of such attacks is well noted. You are entitled to your opinion, but some opinions are not worth posting.

 

As usual there are many things wrong with your doctrine. Scripture proves that salvation is not from 'an act of the will' as in John 1:13; Eph. 1:19, James 1:18; 1 Peter 1:1ff; Romans 9:16. It is not only not an act of the human will, such error is absolutely refuted in Scripture.

You don't see it but your teaching is thoroughly Finneyist and he preached the same exact error of human will and determination. You've been deeply indoctrinated in his teachings and in synergistic thought.

Lastly Dave Hunt hasn't thoroughly refuted TULIP or any Scriptural teachings, nor have any others. You should be grateful that those who take up to contend for the faith once delivered have exposed those whose teachings you admire and follow as spurious.

 

Yourself perhaps? You have slammed me in other posts because I take issue with my church that hardly preaches repentance.

 

None of these verses refute what I believe. I have posted many scriptures for you, all of which have gone unanswered. Jesus continues to plead: "Whosoever will may come." All throughout his healing ministry it was "according to your faith. You have a hard time with that. You have never answered it. Hundreds of times the command is simply given without any qualification: "Believe." A person like yourself (Calvinist) must use eisigesis and read into the Scriptures that which is not there to do away with the free will of man. It is not my doctrine that is wrong.

I have always said that Finney is a heretic and have distanced my teaching from him. The very fact that you link my teaching with him demonstrates that you don't know what I believe.
As for name calling, if you want to associate names to one's teaching, Calvin got most of his teaching from Augustine and consequently so do you. You may rightly be called an Augustinian, a follower of Augustinian, that persecutor of Bible-believing Christians, one of the founders of the RCC, a baptizer of infants, a devoted Catholic, a believer in purgatory and most other RCC doctrine. This is the man that you follow. How much of his doctrines have you taken upon yourself?

It is not just Dave Hunt. He is but one example. I can give you many many more.
This entire theological system is in grave error.

 

No, so we agree. Finally. The problem is: Why am I misrepresented as not believing in the above?

No, I don't need to hear it again. You know we differ.
Please remember, the majority is not always right. There is such a thing called soul liberty. I do believe, that my interpretation is correct if taken in the entire context, that is all of chapter two and three. One cannot cherry pick their favorite verses to bolster their pet doctrines.

 

You have no idea what Finney taught, but just look at your teaching because it is exactly what he did teach. Go and find his teachings and post them here, post about his believing people saved themselves by 'an act of the will'. He believed and propagated that too. Isn't that what you're teaching all along? You said it, so of course it is.

You may be ignorant of him, (in fact you are) but you've picked up his theology big time.

No, it demonstrates that you're ignorant of his teachings, yet teach the same things, while holding contempt for him.

How do you come up with some of the most absurd statements and trains of thoughts ever heard? What is this nonsense 'You (I) don't know what you believe'? Seriously? What you believe is all over this board you tell us your beliefs daily. DHK, I've nailed you and your system. It is most definitely Finneyism and his act of the will error.

Then, after this, you have a serious issue with salvation being possible with men. You completely misunderstand Matthew 19 and/or misapply it. You botch the entire meaning of 'impossible' by conflating it with 'difficult'. Do you really think Jesus meant it is hard for a rich person to enter heaven, (be saved) but that he can do it, it's just difficult?

Then you claimed Jesus never said salvation is impossible with men. I showed you where it was in Scripture.

Anyhow, here is what you are doing, with questions:

You’re making the subject of the text 'saving ones self' in Matthew 19 or at least using it to prove a person can do it but that it is difficult. I know you're sitting there saying that you're not.

You are.

When you say concerning salvation 'It isn't impossible, but it is difficult' it is exactly what you are doing. Then you focus on the word 'difficult' and go off on mans ability to save himself yet again, speaking of how hard it is to do and 'Jesus said so' arguments. You know what the passage says, not what it means and you are making it about man saving himself, saying how hard it is.

So I ask, did you save yourself? Were you poor, or rich when you did it? I am not trying to be funny here, I am just assessing how difficult it must have been for you to do it, or, how easy, and how utterly foolish your proposal upon the meaning of the text is.

If you were poor then it must have been very easy to save yourself, because according to you Jesus meant it is merely difficult for the rich to do it, therefore logically it must be easy for the poor, a little tougher for the middle class and very difficult for the rich. If you were rich when you did it, tell us just how hard it was, or if poor, how easy it was. This is what you say the passage is about, how hard it is with rich men to be saved, because the passage says it is difficult for them.

This is why it is a proven fact you're teaching works salvation and you're doing it by not understanding the text, or you just don't know what you are doing altogether. I don't think you see what you're doing. If you did you'd know your teaching is Finney doctrine and you'd (hopefully!) put an end to it.

 

Repentance is a result of conviction. Conviction comes first, then repentance, then belief and Salvation. Though we must be willing to believe. Lots of people are convicted only some repent and believe.
MB

 

Will God save these people if they don't make themselves willing to believe nor do those other things?

 

Accusations only show the shaky ground you stand on my friend

You are making me have contempt for you

Hooray for Finney if he believed in freewill. At least he believed in the truth. You on the other hand do not believe the plain scripture. Calvinism never had a leg to stand on.When you can prove your own election then you will have something.

The rich have this difficulty because some love there belongings more than Christ. Just as the rich man, Christ told to sell all his belongings and give the money to the poor and come and follow Him.
Of course you believe men are regenerated in order to believe. Has it ever crossed your mind that God can enable anyone He wants to see the truth with out saving them? The richman was drawn because he came to Christ and asked he just couldn't give up his belongings to have eternal life. You can be sure he was convicted yet he thought it would be better to have his belongings than to give them up
Calvinist never study with out the influence of their great theologians.

Accusations. Still nervous that you'll be shown the truth you won't be able to deny.

Still can't get us to be quite can you?

No one I'm aware of has ever said they saved them selves. Calvinist love to use this tactic to try and confuse who ever they disagree with. Have you ever read the verse about the willing mind being accepted.
2Co 8:12 For if there be first a willing mind, it is accepted according to that a man hath, and not according to that he hath not.
Funny you most likely disagree with Paul, being a Calvinist and all.

Nothing in your post is about the topic. It's all about the person you disagree with. How right you are and how wrong they are. It's a shame you are so blind. You must not have any peace.
MB

 

People are saved because they believe and they accept God's free gift. Salvation is free gift that has to be accepted in order for it to work. In order to accept one has to be willing to receive it. That does not mean man is saving him self. This is one of your defenses. Don't try it on me. You have no leg to stand on when it comes to being regenerated in order to believe and repent this is Calvinist doctrine that is not in scripture. It's only in your mind..
MB

 

Founded accusations. I was aware you are also a Finneyist by your former post.

Not so, that contempt is all on you. What does 1 John say about having contempt for a brother?

Actually it is about the topic we're discussing in Matthew 19, something you haven't addressed.

Secondly, no, it is about the persons position, things he believes and says. Are those things him?

Agreed!

But how wrong they are? It's one person, DHK.

I thought you said it was about the person (DHK) and not what the person is wrong about (subject matter)? You're all over the place here and now you're saying it is about the subject.

But isn't that what you're doing here, going against my person, accusing, all about me, or is it you don't know how to discuss the actual passage of contention so you focus on a person and attack the person instead? All this is so apparent and you call me blind?

Care to address the passage, my beliefs on it, and not how you feel about me?

There you go again, showing us how to address the topic and not the person.

 

OK, that's nice and I've heard it all before.

Now answer the question:

Will God save these people if they don't make themselves willing to believe nor do those other things?

 

If you are not willing you will not be saved. No where in scripture is anyone ever saved against there own will.

Even Paul was willing when he asked.
Act 9:6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.
In that statement Paul submitted and was willing.
MB

 

I see, they must be willing, and according to you person's must make themselves willing and also do those other things as well. I get it.

 

Let's put it this way :Between Finney and Spurgeon you are a lot closer theologically to the former.

Where did you dig up this gem of a falsehood --Dave Hunt or David Cloud?

 

While you're at it show us what Finney taught and how you've distanced yourself from that teaching.

 

...lol, like Paul was given a choice....

 

Oh, salvation won't work unless man makes it work. God sounds so weak here. Are you sure it's Him?

And a person, according to you, has to make himself willing, too. Sounds like hard work, maybe it's easy work, but work it is!

lol...OK!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, I like to use Scriptural principles in that way.

Why not? Make yourself willing and maybe you'll believe correct doctrine.

Sorry, but...ROFL!!!!