Believing in Christ and Calling Upon the Name of the Lord

[AustinC]

There is no scripture that, when understood properly, affirms regeneration prior to faith. Rather, that faith and grace are that which saves us, this is shown in Ephesians 2:8-9, the grammar proving that the gift is not faith, but that the gift is salvation.

Salvation is a gracious gift. So is faith.
If we teach faith before grace, we make salvation a graceless man causing God to act means of salvation.
Any teaching that requires a human to act before God can save by grace is a teaching that is no gospel, but is humanistic man-centered works salvation.

Yet, there are people here who are teaching such a graceless salvation.

 

[unprofitable]

Acts 14:38- And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord, and as many as were ORDAINED to eternal life believed.

To be ordained is to be given a charge to perform an authorized act (in this case the ability to believe) commanded by a greater authority.
:.
Christ says in Matt 28:18, "...ALL POWER is given to me in heaven and earth."

He says in Luke 9:1, "Then he called the twelve together and gave them power and authority...The authorizing of those ordained to eternal life to carry out the charge. See Ezra 1:3

Davie says in Ps 71:3, "Be thou my strong habitation (calling upon the name of the Lord), whereunto I may continually resort, thou hast GIVEN COMMANDMENT (ordained) to SAVE me, for thou art my rock and my fortress."

We see in Philippians 1:29, "For unto you it is given (ORDAINED) in the behalf of Christ, not only TO BELIEVE ON HIM, but also to suffer for his sake.

Ephesians 3:11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
Ephesians 3:12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith OF HIM. Faith not mine but given me by HIM.

Rom 10:9, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus Christ, and shall believe in thine heart, that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Both Romans 10:9 and 10:10 mentions the heart. The heart is desperately wicked, who can know it. How then can we believe?

Ezekiel 36:26 says, "A new heart WILL I give you..." This is the believing (living) heart of Rom 10:8,9 that is calling on the name of the Lord, the heart given to us that we might believe.

Ephesians 1:13 says, "In whom ye also trusted, after ye heard the word of truth... Who is this that is hearing? Those already made alive by Christ, given a new heart and spirit, that they might hear and walk in his statutes.

Deu 29:4 says, "Yet the Lord HATH NOT given (NOT ORDAINED-Acts 14:38) you a heart (In contrast to Eze 36:26) to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear unto this day." Unable to believe.

How did those in Ephesians 1:13 trust with the old wicked heart like those in Deu 29:4? That heart is full of vain imagination and the work of the hands of men. They had to already have been given the new heart of Ezekiel 36:26 by which we are enabled to believe by the life of Christ in us

Let's look at Eze 36:26 and 27. The Lord says he will not only remove the old heart of unrighteousness but give us a new heart and a new spirit. This was necessary BEFORE our being enabled by him ("I WILL CAUSE YOU TO") (by being ordained by the power of the greater authority) " walk in my statues and ye shall keep my judgments and do them."

 

[Silverhair]

Please try not to be silly, I scarcely ever preach without telling my hearers to repent and trust in Christ. I could ask you with no greater silliness, why do you struggle so much with the idea that Christ had to come, to suffer and to die in order to save us? But of course I know perfectly well that you don't struggle with it at all.

It really is time to end this sterile ping-pong of gratuitous insults. To the extent that I have been involved with it, I hereby repent and will do so no more.

The 'Five Solas' of the Reformation are:
Christ alone.
Grace alone
Faith alone
According to the Scriptures alone
To the glory of God alone.

Christ comes first because unless He came to earth, lived a totally righteous life, suffered and died for our sins on the cross, rose from the dead, ascended and is coming again in glory, God has not been gracious, our faith is futile (1 Corinthians 15:17), the Scriptures are untrue and God has no glory.

Martin if you took my comments as insults I do apologize for that. That was not my intent I can assure you.

You say when you preach you usually tell your hearers to repent and trust in Christ. Are you doing that so that people that are hearing you who are not saved can do that so as to be saved? In other words are you holding out salvation to the lost or is it just what I have heard other Calvinists say that they tell the "elect" ones that they have to repent of their sins each day and trust in Christ because they are saved?

A point that I think I have to make is that when you spoke of Christ I did not see where one has to trust in the risen Christ to be saved and point two God's glory does not depend upon anything that we do.




My question is why would you as a Calvinist do that as your theology says God has already pick out all the saved ones. So telling them to repent and trust will really have no effect upon them will it? The lost are lost and the saved are saved from before time

 

[Silverhair]

Salvation is a gracious gift. So is faith.
If we teach faith before grace, we make salvation a graceless man causing God to act means of salvation.
Any teaching that requires a human to act before God can save by grace is a teaching that is no gospel, but is humanistic man-centered works salvation.

Yet, there are people here who are teaching such a graceless salvation.

Austin you are still denying scripture because of your faulty understanding of it. How many times must you be show scripture where man believes and God saves because of that belief.

Gal 2:16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ,
Act 16:30 And he brought them out and said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Act 16:31 So they said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household."
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.
Rom 4:5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

The gift of God that we receive because of our faith / trust in His risen Son is eternal life in the Son.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

So Austin are you going to deny or twist clear scripture again or will you just accept what it says.
Faith is not work as we are not saved by our faith, we are saved by God because of our faith. That is a something that you seem unable or unwilling to accept no matter how clear the scripture is that points this out to you.

 

[Guido]

No we are not.

My friend, God's word does not tell anyone, anywhere, how to be born again.
Please read the book of John again, start to finish, carefully.

Here's what I see:

In chapter 3, the Lord Jesus is telling Nicodemus what must happen for a person to see the kingdom of God...
He is even telling him other things that must occur ( belief on Him ) and that those that do believe, have ( John 3:36 ), not "will have", everlasting life;
But He also tells Nicodemus that the Spirit works where He will ( John 3:8 )...

That is the key.

Back in chapter 1, we find that those that have received Him are those who were born of God...what's more, they were not born of God by blood ( inheritance ), nor of their own will, and not of the will of others ( John 1:11-13 ). In other words, the reason they received Him, was that they were born of God.

In chapter 3, the Lord Jesus is not contradicting this.
He is stating why God gave His Son, and what will happen for those that believe.

Therefore, if you've believed on Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, it's because you already have that life, which is to know God and His Son ( John 17:3 ).
The question to answer ( for anyone here ) is this:

"Have I been born again from above?"

The evidence of that is the unreserved belief of His every word ( John 8:47, all of them, see Matthew 4:4, Luke 4:4 ) and the sincere desire to obey Him.
If this is true of you, then thank God for His great kindness and mercy towards you through Jesus Christ!



Also, to call upon the name of the Lord is to pray to Him, from the heart, and to thank Him for the things that we have received from Him ( like that afore-mentioned grace and mercy ), and to ask Him for the things that we need in this life.


May God bless you in your studies.

Austin you are still denying scripture because of your faulty understanding of it. How many times must you be show scripture where man believes and God saves because of that belief.

Gal 2:16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ,
Act 16:30 And he brought them out and said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Act 16:31 So they said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household."
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.
Rom 4:5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

The gift of God that we receive because of our faith / trust in His risen Son is eternal life in the Son.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

So Austin are you going to deny or twist clear scripture again or will you just accept what it says.
Faith is not work as we are not saved by our faith, we are saved by God because of our faith. That is a something that you seem unable or unwilling to accept no matter how clear the scripture is that points this out to you.

I'm confused. Are we sealed with the Holy Spirit at the time we believe, or after we believe? If we are sealed with Him after, it appears that this happens after we receive eternal life, because we receive eternal life at the very same moment we exercise faith in Christ.

 

[Guido]

Salvation is a gracious gift. So is faith.
If we teach faith before grace, we make salvation a graceless man causing God to act means of salvation.
Any teaching that requires a human to act before God can save by grace is a teaching that is no gospel, but is humanistic man-centered works salvation.

Yet, there are people here who are teaching such a graceless salvation.

Grace doesn't signify unmerited favor. It means favor, which in some contexts is merited, and in other contexts unmerited.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Martin if you took my comments as insults I do apologize for that. That was not my intent I can assure you.

Apology accepted.

You say when you preach you usually tell your hearers to repent and trust in Christ. Are you doing that so that people that are hearing you who are not saved can do that so as to be saved? In other words are you holding out salvation to the lost or is it just what I have heard other Calvinists say that they tell the "elect" ones that they have to repent of their sins each day and trust in Christ because they are saved?

I follow Calvin, Keach, Bunyan, Whitefield, Carey, Spurgeon, Lloyd-Jones and a host of other Calvinists (not to mention the Lord Jesus Himself) in calling on all men and women to repent and trust in Christ. I do not know who is elect and who isn't, so I call on all indiscriminately, and I can absolutely assure them that if the will repent and believe, they will be saved. As I said in another thread, the sinner's warrant to come to Christ is not that he thinks he is elect, but that he is a sinner and the Lord Jesus came into the world to save such.
God's elect will all be saved (e.g. John 6:39; 17:24), but they will not be saved until they repent and trust in Christ for redemption. And all Christians should repent of their sins every day.

A point that I think I have to make is that when you spoke of Christ I did not see where one has to trust in the risen Christ to be saved

1 Corinthians 15:14. 'And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty [NIV, 'useless'] and your faith is also empty.'

and point two God's glory does not depend upon anything that we do.

Indeed not, but where is God's glory if all mankind is in hell because Christ did not come to save us?

My question is why would you as a Calvinist do that as your theology says God has already pick out all the saved ones. So telling them to repent and trust will really have no effect upon them will it? The lost are lost and the saved are saved from before time

Because I do not know who the elect are, and nor do they. If, as Spurgeon says, someone would like to go and paint a yellow stripe down the backs of the elect, I will preach to them only, but until then, I will preach the Gospel to all, knowing that God has His people out there to be called and saved (Acts of the Apostles 18:9-10).

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Grace doesn't signify unmerited favor. It means favor, which in some contexts is merited, and in other contexts unmerited.

I disagree. If grace is merited, it ceases to be grace (Romans 4:4). Our good deeds before we are saved are like filthy rags before our holy God (Isaiah 64:6). Grace actually signifies favour in the face of active demerit (1 Timothy 1:15).

 

[Guido]

I disagree. If grace is merited, it ceases to be grace (Romans 4:4). Our good deeds before we are saved are like filthy rags before our holy God (Isaiah 64:6). Grace actually signifies favour in the face of active demerit (1 Timothy 1:15).

That's not the meaning of the word in the Greek. Works do not merit. Faith merits. Faith is a work of God, but not a work of the Law.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

That's not the meaning of the word in the Greek. Works do not merit. Faith merits. Faith is a work of God, but not a work of the Law.

If faith merits (which it doesn't), it is, ipso facto, not of grace. The Greek word charis has several meanings, including 'thanks' and 'pleasure;' the context decides which one is appropriate. But read the examples I gave in my last post, and also 1 Corinthians 15:9; Ephesians 3:8. If you will look again at Titus 3:3-7, it seems that 'grace' (v.7) is a blend of 'kindness,' 'love' and 'mercy' (vs. 4-5).

 

[kyredneck]

Faith is a work of God, but not a work of the Law.

???

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye tithe mint and anise and cummin, and have left undone the weightier matters of the law, justice, and mercy, and faith: but these ye ought to have done, and not to have left the other undone. Mt 23

 

[kyredneck]

Our good deeds before we are saved are like filthy rags before our holy God (Isaiah 64:6).

Wrong. The passage cited is referring to God's backslidden people, and, regenerate, 'unsaved' people often do good works:

Cornelius, before he heard the gospel and was 'saved':

34 And Peter opened his mouth and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35 but in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is acceptable to him. Acts 10

Nathanael, before he was 'saved':

47 Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile! Jn 1

God works within BEFORE ever getting 'saved':

20 for every one who is doing wicked things hateth the light, and doth not come unto the light, that his works may not be detected;
21 but he who is doing the truth doth come to the light, that his works may be manifested, that in God they are having been wrought.` Jn 3

Faith is NOT the source of our works. The Spirit is the source of our works AND our faith.

Works often precede faith, otherwise He never would have told His apostles:

11 And into whatsoever city or village ye shall enter, search out who in it is worthy; and there abide till ye go forth. Mt 10

 

[Silverhair]

I'm confused. Are we sealed with the Holy Spirit at the time we believe, or after we believe? If we are sealed with Him after, it appears that this happens after we receive eternal life, because we receive eternal life at the very same moment we exercise faith in Christ.

Your confusion comes from how people speak of being sealed by the Holy Spirit. We know that we are not sealed before we believe so saying "when" or "after" we believe is referring to the same moment. The moment that we believe God saves, your sealed. We just have to write it as a sequence. There is no time difference in those actions.

Did this help clear up the confusion?

 

[Guido]

Your confusion comes from how people speak of being sealed by the Holy Spirit. We know that we are not sealed before we believe so saying "when" or "after" we believe is referring to the same moment. The moment that we believe God saves, your sealed. We just have to write it as a sequence. There is no time difference in those actions.

Did this help clear up the confusion?

Yes. Thank you.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Wrong. The passage cited is referring to God's backslidden people, and, regenerate, 'unsaved' people often do good works:

All sorts of people do good works, including Muslims and atheists. Some of those may come to faith at some point, but it seems that most don't. Herod, when under conviction, 'did many things' but that did not stop him beheading JTB.
The fact is that, 'whatever is not from faith is sin' (Romans 14:23).

 

[Silverhair]

Apology accepted.

I follow Calvin, Keach, Bunyan, Whitefield, Carey, Spurgeon, Lloyd-Jones and a host of other Calvinists (not to mention the Lord Jesus Himself) in calling on all men and women to repent and trust in Christ. I do not know who is elect and who isn't, so I call on all indiscriminately, and I can absolutely assure them that if the will repent and believe, they will be saved. As I said in another thread, the sinner's warrant to come to Christ is not that he thinks he is elect, but that he is a sinner and the Lord Jesus came into the world to save such.
God's elect will all be saved (e.g. John 6:39; 17:24), but they will not be saved until they repent and trust in Christ for redemption. And all Christians should repent of their sins every day.

1 Corinthians 15:14. 'And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty [NIV, 'useless'] and your faith is also empty.'

Indeed not, but where is God's glory if all mankind is in hell because Christ did not come to save us?

Because I do not know who the elect are, and nor do they. If, as Spurgeon says, someone would like to go and paint a yellow stripe down the backs of the elect, I will preach to them only, but until then, I will preach the Gospel to all, knowing that God has His people out there to be called and saved (Acts of the Apostles 18:9-10).

"As I said in another thread, the sinner's warrant to come to Christ is not that he thinks he is elect, but that he is a sinner and the Lord Jesus came into the world to save such."

Martin it is in those quoted words that we see the difference between your view and mine. Calvinism has Christ come to save only the "elect" whereas I see Christ came so salvation was available to all. 1Timothy 2:3-6 God desires that all be saved and Christ came as a ransom for all for that reason. All those that will trust in Christ Jesus will be saved John 6:40 which is the will of God the Father. For that reason we are commanded to preach the gospel to all so that all may be saved. Mark 16:15 Jesus is the Elect One, and when we become in Him through faith, we are then elect also. Isaiah 42:1

The fundamental difference in our views is in how one understands predestination. For example look at Ephesians 1:1-5.
Does this passage or any passage say that God has chosen certain people to be believers or does predestination simply mean that God has a destination that He determined beforehand. In other words God has determined beforehand what will happen to believers, those who are in Christ. They are chosen to become holy and blameless before Him. They are predestined to adoption as sons through faith in the Son.
When you understand predestination is not about God predetermining who will and won't believe but instead God has predetermined what will happen to those who do believe, then you have a completely different understanding of Ephesians.

 

[Silverhair]

If faith merits (which it doesn't), it is, ipso facto, not of grace. The Greek word charis has several meanings, including 'thanks' and 'pleasure;' the context decides which one is appropriate. But read the examples I gave in my last post, and also 1 Corinthians 15:9; Ephesians 3:8. If you will look again at Titus 3:3-7, it seems that 'grace' (v.7) is a blend of 'kindness,' 'love' and 'mercy' (vs. 4-5).

Faith does not merit salvation but it is a requirement for salvation. If you do not believe then you will not be saved. Acts of the Apostles 16:30-31 is a clear example of this that is unless you think the Holy Spirit got it wrong.

There are a number of verses that indicate the same thing, God saves those that believe.
Romans 3:21-28 The words "the law" form an inclusio that frames the means of salvation, faith.
Rom 3:21 But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,
Rom 3:22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction;
Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus;
Rom 3:25 whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed;
Rom 3:26 for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Rom 3:27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith.
Rom 3:28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

see also Philippians 3:9 and Ephesians 2:8-9 and there are more that show the same thing.

 

[AustinC]

Grace doesn't signify unmerited favor. It means favor, which in some contexts is merited, and in other contexts unmerited.

Grace is always an unmerited favor as God gives his kindness to those who do not in any way, shape, or form deserve His grace. Therefore there is no set requirements that must be accomplished by a human before God will extend grace. Such a teaching would be a Roman Catholic teaching of works first which cause God to be effected to grant grace. Such teaching is contrary to the gospel in scripture.

Anyone who teaches a required action by man before God can act has just placed man above God. I openly reject such teachings as contrary to God's holy word.

 

[Silverhair]

Grace is always an unmerited favor as God gives his kindness to those who do not in any way, shape, or form deserve His grace. Therefore there is no set requirements that must be accomplished by a human before God will extend grace. Such a teaching would be a Roman Catholic teaching of works first which cause God to be effected to grant grace. Such teaching is contrary to the gospel in scripture.

Anyone who teaches a required action by man before God can act has just placed man above God. I openly reject such teachings as contrary to God's holy word.

Gudio read my post # 57.
Faith does not cause merit, faith is not a work and yet Austin persists in trotting out that old canard.
Rom 4:4 Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due.
Rom 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,

There is a contrast between works and faith.

God will save those that believe in His son, that is a requirement that He has made.
Rom 3:28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.
Rom 3:29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also,
Rom 3:30 since indeed God who will justify the circumcised {Jews} by faith and the uncircumcised {Gentiles} through faith is one.

justify
In theology, to pardon and clear form guilt; to absolve or acquit from guilt and merited punishment, and to accept as righteous on account of the merits of the Savior, or by the application of Christ's atonement to the offender. Webster

You have to decide if you want to trust Austin or scripture. His error has been pointed out to him a number of times but his mind is closed to correction.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

All those that will trust in Christ Jesus will be saved John 6:40 which is the will of God the Father.

thanks for your post. It's bed-time in Britain right now, but I will try to respond fully tomorrow. But in the meantime, please be assured that I absolutely agree with the extract from your post that I have quoted above.