Bennett Fires Back Against Racism Charges

[Filmproducer]

Dragoon,

Let me ask you this? Why would my statement be racist? Because I IMPLIED, did not actaully say, that 78% of whites are criminals? And, of course this is not catigoriacally true, right?

Why then would Bennet's statement not be racist? He IMPLIED, did not actually say, that all black babies grow up to be criminals.

What is the difference between my statement and Bennet's? Please enlighten me.

For the record, I have not accused Bennet or anyone on this board of saying that the majority of African Americans are criminals. What I have said that Bennet implied this in his statemetn, and that the numbers do not support such a claim. There is a difference.

 

[Filmproducer]

I wonder how he feels about knowing that so much of the country has labeled him a racist and yet he has no such thoughts in his heart.

I have to reply to this, because, how can any of really know what is in Bennett's heart? How can we know what is in anyone's heart but our own? With that being said, I am not calling him a racist. I said his comment was racist in nature because it perpetuates a categorically untrue stereotype. There is a difference. As a talk show host and a member of the media his comments need to be held to a higher standeard, because they can be taken out of context. I believe I have already said that we all are selective listeners.

 

[Marcia]

Originally posted by Dragoon68:

But it's more accurate, as I've already posted at least twice. Whites do commit more crime -- not proportionately, but overrall. It's just a simple point I was making in response to Bennett. [/qb][/QUOTE]It could be a racist statement because it doesn't take into account the socioeconomic conditions and singles out whites as a group. It perpetuates a sterotype that more whites - in raw numbers - committ more crime than blacks - in raw numbers. It offends whites. [/QB][/QUOTE]

There isn't a stereotype that whites commit more crime!!!

 

[Filmproducer]

No, "socioeconomic" reasons are not the cause of the crime. There are other communities in this world with far more poverty than the worst poverty in our nation and they do not exhibit the same crime problems. No, I do not deny the demographics of economic status in our society. Likewise, I do not deny the demographics of crime in our society. Do you?

The reason for the crime is the lack of values in the persons that commit the crimes. They either don't know or don't follow God's laws in their daily walk on this earth. They are completely responsible for their actions. No one else is responsible for their criminal conduct. This much is the same regardless of the race.

Let me restate, so that I am clearer. Can you deny that a majority of these offenses occurred in low income urban areas? So once again it is not an African American problem AS MUCH AS it is a socioeconomic one. For the record, I am not making excuses for crime, and I believe that the crime needs to punished, nor am I calling for leniency. I agree that people are responsible for their own actions.

Likewise, I do not deny the demographics of crime in our society. Do you?

How am I denying the demographics of crime? I stated that African Americans have a higher incidence of crime, that they are over-represented in the prison population, etc.?

These numbers are from the population of persons incarcerated and not the general population. This data is relevant to the study of inmates but not to crime in society outside the prison. Law abiding citizens and residents are in prison.

Notice that the stats that I gave were not from the total prison population. I gave the jail stats and even defined jail. It does not include convictions for violent crimes, only those who have been charged or convicted and awaiting sentencing.

The numbers of violent crime are based upon the occurrence of crime and not the prosecution of crime. It has nothing to do with prosecution. Murder - the most violent of crimes - hardly ever goes unreported so it's neither hidden nor fabricated.


Let's look at some data for 2003 taken from the FBI Uniform Crime Report- Offenses Reported, 2003. Because even you agree that it cannot be "hidden or fabricated". How many murders do you think there were in 2003? There were 16,503, or approximately 5.7/100,000 US inhabitants. This number has nothing to do with prosecution either.
Let's look at murder offenders...

*total white offenders- 5,132
*total black offenders- 5,729
*total other offenders- 308
*total unknown offenders- 4,874

murder victims....

*total white victims- 6,193
*total black victims- 6,887
*total other victims- 408
*total unknown victims- 200

Once again, I do not understand your view of the African American population. I have not disagreed with your numbers, but I have your conclusions. Please review these numbers and tell me how the RACIAL COMPONENT of Bennett's comment is true?

 

[Bunyon]

"As a talk show host and a member of the media his comments need to be held to a higher standeard,........"

Well then why don't the democrates and the NAACP and you get involved with black talk show host who are claiming that their is a program of genocide against blacks. The cia is always out to get blacks, pushing drugs into their communities causing their crime. We saw alot of that with the NO situation. Some black leader or talkshow host is always talking about some govenment plot to hurt or take away from blacks by super dark conspiritorial means. One black host on one of the networks edited a book with many black essayest in it. One talked about, you guessed it, genocide against blacks. If the Demos and the others can't say any thing about these outlandish claims that go on in black literature and talk radio, they have NO business worrying about a single questionable statement made by Bennet. What about that does not make sense?

 

[Filmproducer]

Originally posted by Bunyon:
"As a talk show host and a member of the media his comments need to be held to a higher standeard,........"

Well then why don't the democrates and the NAACP and you get involved with black talk show host who are claiming that their is a program of genocide against blacks. The cia is always out to get blacks, pushing drugs into their communities causing their crime. We saw alot of that with the NO situation. Some black leader or talkshow host is always talking about some govenment plot to hurt or take away from blacks by super dark conspiritorial means. One black host on one of the networks edited a book with many black essayest in it. One talked about, you guessed it, genocide against blacks. If the Demos and the others can't say any thing about these outlandish claims that go on in black literature and talk radio, they have NO business worrying about a single questionable statement made by Bennet. What about that does not make sense?

Wait a second, let me clarify. I believe ALL MEDIA needs to be held to a higher standard. That includes Republicans and Democrats, conservatives and liberals, the Green Party, The Libertarians, etc. As far NO is concerned I never heard Jackson claim black genocide? I heard him say slow response was because of blacks, and then clarified it to poor. Now he shouldn't have blurted out that it was racial in the first place, so how am I not holding him to a higher standard. Also I believe he was torn apart because of this comment on many news programs. However, this does not mean that he MAY HAVE HAD, emphasis on may, a point concerning the slow response and the poor. That is a legitimate matter to be debate. As far as Kanye West is concerned, he was also raked over the coals, besides I do not consider him a CREDIBLE media source as he is a rapper and entertainer. I'm not sure what other reporters or programs you are referring to, so please be more specific. Also, how do you know that essays were not about black genocide? That is not to say that black genocide exists in this country, but it does exist. Were the essays referring to genocide in Rwanda or the Sudan? I know many prominent African American authors have written on this subject.

 

[Filmproducer]

The cia is always out to get blacks, pushing drugs into their communities causing their crime.

Have you ever heard "conspiracy theory"? That is exactly what this is, as there is no actual proof to the claim. I know for a fact that the MAJORITY of people believe it to be such. Gallop, or it may have been Reuters, did a poll with a similar question in the early 90's and the majority of people believed it to be conspiracy theory. (This includes black people). I'll try and look the study up and post a link, if it is possible. I don't remeber the exact year of the study or the exact company who did the poll in the first place.

 

[Bunyon]

FP,

My friend, I can read, that is how I now it was not talking about genocide in rowanda. I'll go get the book agian perhaps and give you exact details. If you have ever listened to black talk radio you know what I am talking about. You know, Bennet never held any real hight post, and now he is just a radio talk host. Even if his statement was a senister as you think, it is not worth all of this. But the statemant was questionable at best, what we see is the political attack macine in action here. This same machine is the macine that chews up blacks an spits them out. I hope you will see this someday. We are a couple of night owls aren't we? Good night, sweat dreams!

 

[ASLANSPAL]

'm not going to call former secretary of Education Bill Bennett a racist for what he said about how the nation's crime rate could be reduced by aborting black babies — but if others want to do so, I understand.

During a recent broadcast of his radio show, Bennett reacted to the suggestion by the authors of the book Freakonomics that an increase in abortions has helped reduce this country's crime rate with a race-tinged barb. While saying that he didn't know whether that morbid thesis was correct, Bennett added: "But I do know that it's true that if you wanted to reduce crime, you could, if that were your sole purpose, you could abort every black baby in this country and your crime rate would go down."

And then he quickly followed up with this not-so-artful dodge: "That would be an impossible, ridiculous and morally reprehensible thing to do, but your crime rate would go down."

Afro-American voice in this

 

[Dragoon68]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
... Let's look at some data for 2003 taken from the FBI Uniform Crime Report- Offenses Reported, 2003. Because even you agree that it cannot be "hidden or fabricated". How many murders do you think there were in 2003? There were 16,503, or approximately 5.7/100,000 US inhabitants. This number has nothing to do with prosecution either.
Let's look at murder offenders...

*total white offenders- 5,132
*total black offenders- 5,729
*total other offenders- 308
*total unknown offenders- 4,874

murder victims....

*total white victims- 6,193
*total black victims- 6,887
*total other victims- 408
*total unknown victims- 200

...

Wow! This looks a whole lot like the data I presented way back in this long thread!

It shows that blacks contribute proportionally six to seven times more murders than whites.

But, of course, to some that means nothing and is explained away.

 

[Dragoon68]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
... Let me restate, so that I am clearer. Can you deny that a majority of these offenses occurred in low income urban areas? So once again it is not an African American problem AS MUCH AS it is a socioeconomic one. For the record, I am not making excuses for crime, and I believe that the crime needs to punished, nor am I calling for leniency. I agree that people are responsible for their own actions. ...

More numbers of crime will likely occur where there are more people to do it. I'm not certain about the comparative incidence rates since I've not looked at that data for a long time. It's possible that a small town with one murder per year might have a higher incidence rate than a larger town. Larger samples tend to smooth out data and make it more meaningful.

I'm glad we agree about where the responsibility for crime rests.

 

[Dragoon68]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
... Notice that the stats that I gave were not from the total prison population. I gave the jail stats and even defined jail. It does not include convictions for violent crimes, only those who have been charged or convicted and awaiting sentencing. ...

What I notice is the statistics for the entire population outside the prisons which is what most people are most concerned about when moving around in this big country.

 

[hillclimber]

My ONLY problen with Mr. Bennet's statement is that it helps fuel the racial divide the Democrats need for political dominance of the black voter.

 

[Dragoon68]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
... Once again, I do not understand your view of the African American population. I have not disagreed with your numbers, but I have your conclusions. Please review these numbers and tell me how the RACIAL COMPONENT of Bennett's comment is true?

I haven't stated a view of the "African American" population.

I have different views of all persons depending upon venue. Individuals are different than groups. I don't make the assumption that all persons of any group have identical characteristics even if statistically certain observations can be made.

Bennett's comments are literally true. I can't explain to someone what they don't want to understand and can't accept because it doesn't fit the misconception they have of the facts.

 

[Dragoon68]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
... What is the difference between my statement and Bennet's? Please enlighten me. ...

You, by a simple mistake by misquoted some statistics concerning whites that, if taken literally, could have been deemed racist. Since it involved "whites" it attracted little attention. It's okay to be critical of "whites" in today's society. It was an innocent mistake. Your reputation hasn't been harmed by being mischaracterized.

Bennett, in order to emphasize the evil of abortion, made a factual statement to illustrate that reasons such as reduction of poverty or reduction of crime did not justify abortion. However, since he used "blacks" in his analogy it attracted much attention. It's not okay to be critical of "blacks" in today's society. Bennett didn't make a mistake in what he said but his comments are being mischaracterized as racist. This has harmed his reputation.

 

[Dragoon68]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
... it perpetuates a categorically untrue stereotype. ...

Facts are facts even when we don't like them. There is a proportionally greater - six to seven times greater - problem with violent crime in the black population of America than there is in other races. Some stereotypes are formed upon myths but some are formed upon experiences and realities.

It can be unfair when a person is stereotyped as something they, as an individual, are not because the group - any kind of group - to which they belong, on average, may have the characteristic assumed by the stereotype. Fortunately, most untrue stereotypes are quickly disolved in personal - one on one - relationships.

 

[Mike McK]

Mr. William J. Bennett
Mornings in America September 30, 2005

Dear Mr. Bennett:

We are concerned about your comments linking the reduction of crime to the abortion of black babies.

Though you immediately acknowledged that this argument was "morally reprehensible," we are troubled by the casual manner in which you aired such divisive, offensive and potentially hatred-inducing racial stereotypes on the radio.

Now is the time for thoughtful dialogue and soul-searching on the part of white and black leaders, not the reckless airing of bigoted stereotypes.

We look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

Anti-Defamation League

Ironic that this would come from a Jewish organization, when Jews were the victims of the very thing Bennett was condemning.

Don't tell me the Jews have forgotten the Holocaust, already.

 

[Mike McK]

Originally posted by Filmproducer:
Let me restate, so that I am clearer. Can you deny that a majority of these offenses occurred in low income urban areas

Has it ever occured to you that the reason they are poor is because of the same character flaws that lead to the high incidences of crime in these areas?

 

[carpro]

Originally posted by hillclimber:
My ONLY problen with Mr. Bennet's statement is that it helps fuel the racial divide the Democrats need for political dominance of the black voter.

It was a stupid thing to say...but it was still a true statement.

There are some truths in our politically correct society that just have to be left unsaid.

 

[just-want-peace]

PC =R.I.P. for America!!!