Bible Study = "going to Church" aka Corporate Worship

[T Alan]

Interested to hear some opinions regarding the statement made in the title of this thread.

I say, there is no difference if the Bible Study aka Sunday School incorporates: Prayer, Song, Teaching. I say it constitutes corporate worship and gathering as in Scripture.


Please point out why gathering in study of the Scripture isn't suitable as "going to Church".

 

[padredurand]

Interested to hear some opinions regarding the statement made in the title of this thread.

I say, there is no difference if the Bible Study aka Sunday School incorporates: Prayer, Song, Teaching. I say it constitutes corporate worship and gathering as in Scripture.


Please point out why gathering in study of the Scripture isn't suitable as "going to Church".

Traditions, traditions. Without our traditions, our lives would be as shaky as... as... as a fiddler on the roof! ~ Tevye

 

[Deacon]

Traditions, traditions. Without our traditions, our lives would be as shaky as... as... as a fiddler on the roof! ~ Tevye

Heh, I just returned from seeing a production of that at Lancaster Bible College. A wonderful performance!

The church I attend has various small groups meeting throughout the week. It is in these small groups where specific needs are addressed and ministry within the body occurs.

They run like mini-churches or what some might call home-churches.

We even share fellowship with other groups once in a while.

Some have singing, some don't, each group is different.

I attend two different ones regularly, Wednesday evening (mixed couples) and Saturday mornings (grumpy old men) :smilewinkgrin:

Sunday mornings we have a simple bible study group.
It is distinctly different from the others; a teaching session, rather than a corporate worship group.

Rob

 

[Zenas]

Interested to hear some opinions regarding the statement made in the title of this thread.

I say, there is no difference if the Bible Study aka Sunday School incorporates: Prayer, Song, Teaching. I say it constitutes corporate worship and gathering as in Scripture.


Please point out why gathering in study of the Scripture isn't suitable as "going to Church".

What about the Lord's Supper? Don't you regard that as important?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

What about the Lord's Supper? Don't you regard that as important?

How about washing feet?

 

[The Biblicist]

Interested to hear some opinions regarding the statement made in the title of this thread.

I say, there is no difference if the Bible Study aka Sunday School incorporates: Prayer, Song, Teaching. I say it constitutes corporate worship and gathering as in Scripture.


Please point out why gathering in study of the Scripture isn't suitable as "going to Church".

The "house of God" in scriptural use of the term ALWAYS refers to a qualified place of public worship.

1. Qualified by a divine building pattern - Mt. 28:19-20; Acts 2:41-42
2. Qualified by a public ordained ministry - 1 Tim. 3:1-13
3. Qualified by public gospel ordinances - 1 Pet. 2:5
4. Qualified by a specific "faith once delivered" - 1 Tim. 3:16-4:1

The public "house of God" is something "built" and "fitly framed together" rather than happen stance meeting of any two or three professers. Matthew 18:20 in context refers to an organized institutional body of baptized believers that administer the keys of the kingdom in regard to discipline.

The "house of God" in 1 Timothy 3:15 is contextually characterized by organizational order with officers and unified in faith in practice so that it can be characterized as "the pillar and ground of THE TRUTH."

 

[Greektim]

Interested to hear some opinions regarding the statement made in the title of this thread.

I say, there is no difference if the Bible Study aka Sunday School incorporates: Prayer, Song, Teaching. I say it constitutes corporate worship and gathering as in Scripture.


Please point out why gathering in study of the Scripture isn't suitable as "going to Church".

Is it being led and under the guidance of elders? Because God has not called a Bible study teacher or discussion facilitator to watch over souls.

It is not church.

 

[The Biblicist]

Is it being led and under the guidance of elders? Because God has not called a Bible study teacher or discussion facilitator to watch over souls.

It is not church.

Jesus never said "tell it to the elders" but "tell it to the church". Elders do not constitute a church but are "set in" the church. They answer to the authority of the church (Acts 11:1-17; ) and are "sent" out by the church (Acts 13:1-4; 15:2) and are subject to the disciplinary authority of the church equally as any other member (2 Thes. 3:6; 1 Cor. 5:11-13).

The apostles and prophets were foundational offices (Eph. 2:20; 1 Cor. 12:28) rather than continuing offices in the institutional church. They had special authority for the production of the New Testament canon of scriptures wherein their permanent authority continues - 1 Jn. 1:1-3 with 1 Jn. 4:5-6.

 

[Revmitchell]

Jesus never said "tell it to the elders" but "tell it to the church". Elders do not constitute a church but are "set in" the church. They answer to the authority of the church (Acts 11:1-17; ) and are "sent" out by the church (Acts 13:1-4; 15:2) and are subject to the disciplinary authority of the church equally as any other member (2 Thes. 3:6; 1 Cor. 5:11-13).

The apostles and prophets were foundational offices (Eph. 2:20; 1 Cor. 12:28) rather than continuing offices in the institutional church. They had special authority for the production of the New Testament canon of scriptures wherein their permanent authority continues - 1 Jn. 1:1-3 with 1 Jn. 4:5-6.

Why is it you believe that this is related to what Greektim posted?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Is it being led and under the guidance of elders? Because God has not called a Bible study teacher or discussion facilitator to watch over souls.

It is not church.

Oh....so its a "calling " is it.:laugh:

 

[The Biblicist]

Why is it you believe that this is related to what Greektim posted?

I misread his post to say "It is" instead of "Is it.." as a question. So my apologies to GreekTim for refuting something he did not say.

However, it is a proper response to those who believe in elder rule form of government instead of an elder lead congregational form of government and that was my intent.

 

[Revmitchell]

I misread his post to say "It is" instead of "Is it.." as a question. So my apologies to GreekTim for refuting something he did not say.

However, it is a proper response to those who believe in elder rule form of government instead of an elder lead congregational form of government and that was my intent.

Gotchya :thumbs:

 

[Van]

Is it being led and under the guidance of elders? Because God has not called a Bible study teacher or discussion facilitator to watch over souls.

It is not church.

To rephrase according to my understanding of Greektim's view, a Sunday School or small group bible study is not a church because the leader has not been "called."

Before I accepted an invitation to lead a small group in bible study, I prayed, asking for guidance, i.e. should I teach to the best of my ability, given my many flaws? The answer I received, perhaps from the HS or from my self delusion, was to teach, and not let Satan discourage me with sins that God had forgiven.

I was and am keenly aware that if I lead people away from Christ and His righteousness, I will be held accountable.

To believe laypeople are not "called" seems questionable.

 

[The Biblicist]

To rephrase according to my understanding of Greektim's view, a Sunday School or small group bible study is not a church because the leader has not been "called."

Before I accepted an invitation to lead a small group in bible study, I prayed, asking for guidance, i.e. should I teach to the best of my ability, given my many flaws? The answer I received, perhaps from the HS or from my self delusion, was to teach, and not let Satan discourage me with sins that God had forgiven.

I was and am keenly aware that if I lead people away from Christ and His righteousness, I will be held accountable.

To believe laypeople are not "called" seems questionable.

All saints are "called" in the sense of a special vocation and are gifted for their special vocational calling, but not all are "called" or gifted to be leaders and teachers. The Holy Spirit calls such but it is through the church that the Holy Spirit qualifies, validates and ordains to that particular calling (Acts 13:1-4).

For example Matthew 18:16 consisted of more than two or three Christians but was not a "church" as verse 17 instructs them to "tell the church" rather than replace the church.

The institutional church was established for the exercise of such gifts as illustrated in the last aspect of the Great Commission (Mt. 28:20) as illustrated by Acts 2:42.

Otherwise, this random unqualified happenstance meetings by any two or three Christians have no authorized oversight or disciplinary authority - Mt. 18:15-18; 1 Cor. 5; 2 Thes. 3:6-14.

 

[T Alan]

How about washing feet?

My Church currently only does it once a year same as LORD's Table. No problem here both could surely be done at the "Bible Study"

What about the Lord's Supper? Don't you regard that as important?

I regard it as a command of the LORD. It could be done at the Bible Study. (I am speaking of a Sunday School or by another name "Bible Study" which is conducted by the Elder prior to the LORD's Day service)

The "house of God" in scriptural use of the term ALWAYS refers to a qualified place of public worship.

1. Qualified by a divine building pattern - Mt. 28:19-20; Acts 2:41-42
2. Qualified by a public ordained ministry - 1 Tim. 3:1-13
3. Qualified by public gospel ordinances - 1 Pet. 2:5
4. Qualified by a specific "faith once delivered" - 1 Tim. 3:16-4:1

The public "house of God" is something "built" and "fitly framed together" rather than happen stance meeting of any two or three professers. Matthew 18:20 in context refers to an organized institutional body of baptized believers that administer the keys of the kingdom in regard to discipline.

The "house of God" in 1 Timothy 3:15 is contextually characterized by organizational order with officers and unified in faith in practice so that it can be characterized as "the pillar and ground of THE TRUTH."

Is it being led and under the guidance of elders? Because God has not called a Bible study teacher or discussion facilitator to watch over souls.

It is not church.

As I responded above, the context of my assertion was "Bible Study" aka Sunday School at the Church building led by the Elder. I personally can't see it different from the "11oclock service" except it's less people (often the sincere seekers) and less songs.

 

[T Alan]

I am about to the conclusion that "Scripturally" speaking. "Bible Study" or Sunday School that is led by the Elder (Pastor,Preacher) that incorporates prayers and song of Praise, adoration and glory to Him is actually a "worship service" and is the same as the "11oclock" service.

 

[T Alan]

Not much difference as I see it, than "some" Churches that do additional services ie.. contemporary, traditional .

 

[Aaron]

Is it being led and under the guidance of elders? Because God has not called a Bible study teacher or discussion facilitator to watch over souls.

It is not church.

What HE said.

 

[nodak]

The Lord Jesus Christ is head of HIS church.

He promises to be there whenever two or three gather in His name.

The Bible indeed speaks of churches that met in homes or houses. So we do not need a special building. The authority of the local church resides, I believe strongly, in that church, not in priest or pastor.

So any group of believers can indeed meet anywhere, order their services any way they choose as they seek to obey scriptures, and can indeed baptize, wash feet, or have the Lord's Supper.

I'm not Roman Catholic or Landmark Baptist in that I don't see where unless someone has an "approved" ordination one cannot administer the ordinances.

Now, all that said, I doubt the local Catholic church or Landmark Baptist church would recognize those ordinances as valid. That is their right IF I am a member of their church. Otherwise, it is none of their business.

 

[Aaron]

The Lord Jesus Christ is head of HIS church.

He promises to be there whenever two or three gather in His name.

The Bible indeed speaks of churches that met in homes or houses. So we do not need a special building. The authority of the local church resides, I believe strongly, in that church, not in priest or pastor.

So any group of believers can indeed meet anywhere, order their services any way they choose as they seek to obey scriptures, and can indeed baptize, wash feet, or have the Lord's Supper.

I'm not Roman Catholic or Landmark Baptist in that I don't see where unless someone has an "approved" ordination one cannot administer the ordinances.

Now, all that said, I doubt the local Catholic church or Landmark Baptist church would recognize those ordinances as valid. That is their right IF I am a member of their church. Otherwise, it is none of their business.

Which is to say that the office of elder is not legitimate.