Biden Mask Request

[Reformed1689]

Do you think that Jesus would wear a mask in our current situation? I’m quite sure that He would.

I don't presume to comment on hypotheticals about what Jesus would or would not do and neither should you.

 

[JonC]

Multiple reports from the CDC says that is not the case.

Do you have a link? I would be interested to read it.

I take it this applies to the flu as well (viruses are no longer spread via droplets) or is COVID less contagious than the flu?

 

[Scott Downey]

Flattening the curve is not reasonably possible.
Epidemics always run their course.
There are studies that showed people who isolated at home and had no covid exposure got covid.
It is in the air, survives on surfaces, it can infect your thru your eyes very easily, it is pervasive.
If everyone always wore a mask, eventually everyone would still get infected with covid.

 

[JonC]

Flattening the curve is not reasonably possible.
Epidemics always run their course.
There are studies that showed people who isolated at home and had no covid exposure got covid.
It is in the air, survives on surfaces, it can infect your thru your eyes very easily, it is pervasive.
If everyone always wore a mask, eventually everyone would still get infected with covid.

Isn't flattening the curve just trying to keep a bunch of people from getting sick at one time?

 

[Reformed1689]

Do you have a link? I would be interested to read it.

I take it this applies to the flu as well (viruses are no longer spread via droplets) or is COVID less contagious than the flu?

Here is at least one: Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures

Here is the pertinent quote from the article:

We did not find evidence that surgical-type face masks are effective in reducing laboratory-confirmed influenza transmission, either when worn by infected persons (source control) or by persons in the general community to reduce their susceptibility (Figure 2).

 

[JonC]

Here is at least one: Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures

Here is the pertinent quote from the article:

Interesting. Thank you.

I wonder why (and if this now applies to the flu).

Also....what ever happened to "for this for 15 days to flatten the curve"?

I'm not the best at math, but by my count it has been at least 17 days.

 

[Reformed1689]

Interesting. Thank you.

I wonder why (and if this now applies to the flu).

Also....what ever happened to "for this for 15 days to flatten the curve"?

I'm not the best at math, but by my count it has been at least 17 days.

It's simple. None of this has to do with actual science or health. It is a political weapon.

 

[JonC]

It's simple. None of this has to do with actual science or health. It is a political weapon.

But masks were used for respiratory viruses prior to COVID (the box the doctor gave my son to wear when he may have had the flu was last year).

I will keep this in mind -

In Germany they did not use alcohol swabs when giving shots. They said there was no reason except American expectations to use the swabs.

 

[Reformed1689]

But masks were used for respiratory viruses prior to COVID (the box the doctor gave my son to wear when he may have had the flu was last year).

Yeah, honestly it seems like a feel good measure. People feel more safe but that doesn't make it so.

 

[JonC]

Yeah, honestly it seems like a feel good measure. People feel more safe but that doesn't make it so.

The article was about the flu (so that answered one of my questions).

They did not find loose fitting surgical masks effective.

But when discussing cloth masks (in the article, homemade masks) ir does say:

"In theory, transmission should be reduced the most if both infected members and other contacts wear masks, but compliance in uninfected close contacts could be a problem."

I don't really care too much. I wear a mask when the business asks that I wear a mask. I normally don't when it is not required.

 

[JonC]

Yeah, honestly it seems like a feel good measure. People feel more safe but that doesn't make it so.

The article was about the flu (so that answered one of my questions).

They did not find loose fitting surgical masks effective.

But when discussing cloth masks (in the article, homemade masks) it does say:

"In theory, transmission should be reduced the most if both infected members and other contacts wear masks, but compliance in uninfected close contacts could be a problem."

I don't really care too much. I wear a mask when the business asks that I wear a mask. I normally don't when it is not required.

 

[Reformed1689]

The article was about the flu (so that answered one of my questions).

They did not find loose fitting surgical masks effective.

But when discussing cloth masks (in the article, homemade masks) it does say:

"In theory, transmission should be reduced the most if both infected members and other contacts wear masks, but compliance in uninfected close contacts could be a problem."

I don't really care too much. I wear a mask when the business asks that I wear a mask. I normally don't when it is not required.

Right, in theory. But they don't find that it actually does.

 

[JonC]

Right, in theory. But they don't find that it actually does.

Surface washing and hand washing does no good either.

Interesting article.

 

[Reformed1689]

Surface washing and hand washing does no good either.

Interesting article.

You know I missed that part but that is interesting. There was an obscure report earlier this year that COVID does not get passed by surfaces and it was quickly buried. This would go along with that it seems like.

 

[JonC]

You know I missed that part but that is interesting. There was an obscure report earlier this year that COVID does not get passed by surfaces and it was quickly buried. This would go along with that it seems like.

The problem with saying masks, washing hands, and cleaning surfaces does not help is it gives us a sense we are not in control.

 

[Scott Downey]

The problem with saying masks, washing hands, and cleaning surfaces does not help is it gives us a sense we are not in control.

good, lets be honest about it. why believe a lie?
Lot's destroy small businesses by believing in the lie and shutting down the economy again.

 

[Benjamin]

Biden is merely trying to use COVD-19 against Trump and make himself look like the responsible one. The truth is that Biden wouldn't even be in Trump's league regarding the speed that he got the private/public sector moving and cut through the bureaucracy to get a vaccination so quickly. That Biden and supporters are trying to take take credit and even hoping to control the vaccine distribution to make themselves look good is nothing short of disgusting.

Any reasonable person that isn't trying to pull politics into it already knows the importance of masks and we don't need big brother government telling us what we must do.

Its all a game with Biden and its all big show all for not, because Biden is begging the question that he is going to be leading this country. The more Biden looks like he is already in charge the MORE chaos he can create through the babies that end up getting their candy taken away. Note: those of the GOP are very unhappy about being cheated and stolen from but don't see any rioting and burning....................................YET!

 

[JonC]

good, lets be honest about it. why believe a lie?
Lot's destroy small businesses by believing in the lie and shutting down the economy again.

Actually, it is not a lie. It is theoretical and the reports did not provide concrete evidence either way.

The lie part was asking the nation to shut down for 2 weeks in order to prevent stress in the hospitals.

Or, it became a lie after a couple of weeks.

 

[robustheologian]

This mask mandate is a great idea!! It's one of the most effective things we can do against the virus right now. And the best thing about the mandate is non-compliers can face fines or arrest...and those non-compliers tend to be Trump supporters.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Here is at least one: Nonpharmaceutical Measures for Pandemic Influenza in Nonhealthcare Settings—Personal Protective and Environmental Measures

Here is the pertinent quote from the article:

You need to do more than just find a quote, you actually need to read the article and use your brain.

As it was noted by JonC, the Hong Kong study from February 2020 did not find that handwashing made a difference either, which completely undermines most germ theory that has been highly reliable in the past. So this study, which is an outlier, needs to be examined very carefullly.

A few things I noticed:
(1) They admitted in a few places that the sample size for a number of these groups was small.
(2) I noticed that they found that masks and handwashing was of no help in the US in a college residence hall, but turned out to help a lot in Egypt, where they actually had to provide a clean water system and train people how to wash their hands. It seems to me that someone who finally has clean water and recent training on handwashing will likely be more diligent than most American college students who barely wash their hands, sometimes only wetting them. Moreover, there is likely a cultural difference between students in Egypt and students in the United States -- students from Arab countries are much more familiar with pandemics and out-of-control disease moving through a population. I have some close friends who have served quietly in Muslim countries in Africa and the Middle East who are now serving in my area. They work with Muslim refugees who have been settled here. They have found that Muslim refugees from the Middle East are quite fearful of the pandemic and rarely venture outside their homes because of the fear of catching the virus. Our church has been delivering groceries and household supplies to a number of the families, and they are nearly willing to do without food to stay safe from disease. So there may be a cultural matter skewing the results.
(3) We have no information about the way the control groups and the tested groups move through society. As we know, mask-wearing protects OTHERS from any disease that you may carry, but it does little to protect the wearer from diseases that others might carry. If we are looking at college students wearing masks in one residence hall, yet carrying on their lives as usual in public and private settings where others are not wearing masks, we could expect that there would be very little difference between the rate of infection between the control group and the test group.

So that study raises more questions than provides answers. It seems to be an outlier in the midst of many things we already know about germ theory, and the many other studies that show masks are effective. Cherry-picking one poorly supported study from all of the contrary studies is foolish and completely misunderstands how science works.
HOWEVER, the CDC advises wearing masks, and provides both guidance on how to do it, and cites a number of studies that confirm that there is a benefit to wearing masks. So wear a mask!

More information on masks, with studies cited.