Can a Christian sin?

[Marcia]

The idea that something is sin only if it breaks the law is just the beginning of understanding what sin is.

The law reflects the character of God, which is absolutely perfect and righteous. Therefore, anything that does not match or live up to God's perfection and righteousness consequently is sin. The Law is merely an outward expression of God's character.

 

[Brother Bob]

It's the tense of the word that indicates that the action is continuous.

You are wrong, you are using just the word of sin, instead of "cannot sin".

3756
ou
ou
oo, also (before a vowel)
ouk ook, and (before an aspirate) ouch ookh a primary word; the absolute negative (compare 3361) adverb; no or not:--+ long, nay, neither, never, no (X man), none, (can-)not, + nothing, + special, un(-worthy), when, + without, + yet but. See also ou mh - ou me 3364, mhkoV - mekos 3372.

 

[Brother Bob]

I am not a Bible scholar but we had to write up a paper on this sentence in seminary and supposedly the verb form comes out to "practicing sin," implying that it refers to someone habitually sinning without repenting.

I think it's hard to say who is doing this and who is not. I've known believers who got involved in something they knew was wrong and continued it for years but then repented and came back to the Lord. According to them, they were saved during the time they were sinning but God was convicting them. They just ignored it and tried to go on, but eventually it got to them.

But when I see someone who professes Christ and is involved in constant sin as a lifestyle (for example, living with someone outside of marriage, being very worldly, not reading the Bible, etc.) and they go on and on this way for a long time and seemingly do not feel they are doing anything wrong, then one has to wonder about their salvation.

I think really that only the Lord knows the truth in these cases. It's not up to us. What we are called to do is rebuke and exhort someone who professes Christ and is committing sin with no repentance.

I John 1.8 also says this:


I deal with a lot of new believers and professing believers in my ministry (as well as unbelievers) and one of the things I notice the most that separates believers from those professing Christ in name only is that the believers are receptive to God's word and accept being wrong. The unbelievers (or those Chirstian in name only) resist this and argue with it.

There is a better answer than that Marcia;

That which is born of God cannot sin, because its the inward man that is born of God and is indwelt with the Holy Ghost and cannot sin.

Now the flesh, or outward man has not been changed as of yet, and will not be until the resurrection.

I preach the inward man to be a perfect man, and the outward man being in subject to the inward man and waiting on its change.

Rom 8:21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.

So if we sin, its the flesh, and not the Spirit.

Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not.

Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:


BBob,

 

[DHK]

Where do you know that she did sin????

Also, answer,

I don't know, and neither do you.
The Bible is silent on the issue.
You debate like the RCC. They argue infants are baptized because all of the jailor's household was baptized and that certainly must have included infants. But the Bible is silent. You can't make an argument from silence. But that is what you are trying to do.

 

[Brother Bob]

I don't know, and neither do you.
The Bible is silent on the issue.
You debate like the RCC. They argue infants are baptized because all of the jailor's household was baptized and that certainly must have included infants. But the Bible is silent. You can't make an argument from silence. But that is what you are trying to do.

I debated exactly like you and if I am like the RCC, so are you.

I can't find "habitual" in the bible for "sin", either in the Greek, or English?

BBob,

 

[DHK]

I debated exactly like you and if I am like the RCC, so are you.

I can't find "habitual" in the bible for "sin", either in the Greek, or English?

BBob,

I wasn't referring to Marcia's posts.

I was simply referring to the statement "go and sin no more."
The story, and the context. No more is said of the adulterous woman.
No one knows what she did after that.
You have no way of knowing if she sinned after that.
Your entire argument rests on complete silence.
She might have gone back into sin. You don't know that.

Jesus healed ten lepers.
Only one came back to give thanks. What does that tell us about the other nine?
You don't know what happened to this woman, do you?

 

[Brother Bob]

I wasn't referring to Marcia's posts.

I was simply referring to the statement "go and sin no more."
The story, and the context. No more is said of the adulterous woman.
No one knows what she did after that.
You have no way of knowing if she sinned after that.
Your entire argument rests on complete silence.
She might have gone back into sin. You don't know that.

Jesus healed ten lepers.
Only one came back to give thanks. What does that tell us about the other nine?
You don't know what happened to this woman, do you?

You have used the habitual sin theology in the past, many times, I say, many times.

Not once anywhere on any of the threads on this entire forum, have I ever stated what the woman did after that Jesus said "go and sin no more". I just posted it, to show what Jesus wanted us Christians to do, of which I believe with my whole heart, soul, mind and strength.


BBob,

 

[steaver]

People according to Jesus are going to Hell over it, but you don't call it sin. GREAAAAAAt!!!

BBob,

Slow down brother and read my entire post. You stopped at line one and formed an inaccurate opinion.

Here it is again.....

Originally Posted by steaver
If it is not breaking the law, then it is not sin.

All unrighteousness is sin and sin is the transgression of the law. I must know what law is being violated by not visiting the sick before I can call it sin.

So what law do you see being violated? If none, then according to scripture it is not sin.

I see the law of not loving God with all of your heart, soul and mind being violated if we do not do what Jesus told us to do.

Therefore I conclude that not visiting the sick is breaking the law and thus it is sin.

Now, what I have been looking for from you is a scripture that discribes a sin and says that this sin is not unto death. Do you have any??

I highlighted the part you did not get to, the conclusion.

:thumbs:

 

[steaver]

BBob,

Why is it ok for you to go to the Greek and declare that the KJV "defraud" is in error, that it should read "deprive", but then totally ignore the Greek to define the complete understanding of the translation "cannot sin"???

:godisgood:

 

[Brother Bob]

BBob,

Why is it ok for you to go to the Greek and declare that the KJV "defraud" is in error, that it should read "deprive", but then totally ignore the Greek to define the complete understanding of the translation "cannot sin"???

:godisgood:

Show me!!!

 

[Brother Bob]

Slow down brother and read my entire post. You stopped at line one and formed an inaccurate opinion.

Here it is again.....



I highlighted the part you did not get to, the conclusion.

:thumbs:

What about Adam's sin, there was not written Law on Tablets? Still sin prevailed.

What about before the Law was given to Moses? Still sin prevailed.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

DHK: Not once anywhere on any of the threads on this entire forum, have I ever stated what the woman did after that Jesus said "go and sin no more". I just posted it, to show what Jesus wanted us Christians to do, of which I believe with my whole heart, soul, mind and strength.

HP: Why would you have to tell us what the women did after meeting Christ and having heard Him say, "Go and sin no more" DHK? We know from your many posts that you believe that to go and sin no more is an utter impossibility. Therefore by default you must believe she went out and sinned, most likely from what I have read of your views, on a daily basis.

DHK, be reasonable here. How can Jesus ‘want’ us to do what you say is an utter impossible, i.e., to 'go and sin no more?' Is Christ ignorant of our nature that you insist cannot help but sin and that continually? You have told us that all are still liars to mention just one sin, and that evidently without exception according to you. How can God desire us to do that, which again as I understand you, is a natural impossibility according to what I have read? What a wasted, hollow, impossible, command Christ must have given.

 

[steaver]

Show me!!!

Show you what?

 

[Brother Bob]

Show you what?

habitual sin in Greek.

BBob,

 

[steaver]

Marcia answered you pretty good.

The idea that something is sin only if it breaks the law is just the beginning of understanding what sin is.

The law reflects the character of God, which is absolutely perfect and righteous. Therefore, anything that does not match or live up to God's perfection and righteousness consequently is sin. The Law is merely an outward expression of God's character.

What about Adam's sin, there was not written Law on Tablets? Still sin prevailed.

What about before the Law was given to Moses? Still sin prevailed.

Not sure I get your point. I agree with everything said in this quote. The law is the law whether you are aware of it or not. God didn't come up with it as humans went on from generation to generation. In the beggining was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.

This has no bearing on our conversation.

 

[steaver]

habitual sin in Greek.

BBob,

I believe DHK already posted how the Greek denotes a "continuing sin without repentence". One does not go on sinning unto condemnation. They do grow in Christ and in the end will stop all sin.

 

[steaver]

BBob: Transgression of the Law, will bring forth death.

Not visiting the sick, will bring forth chastisement. It is not breaking the Law, as far as I understand, but yet is sin.

Mat 25:44Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

Mat 25:45Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me.

Mat 25:46And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

You said not visiting the sick is a sin NOT unto death. Jesus said they will go to everlasting punishment. How do you reconcile?

 

[Brother Bob]

I believe DHK already posted how the Greek denotes a "continuing sin without repentence". One does not go on sinning unto condemnation. They do grow in Christ and in the end will stop all sin.

So, Christ pays for your sin, and they are cast into a lake of forgetfulness, but you keep sinning..........
I have seen nothing that I agree with that DHK posted on the "habitual sin".

If you have something, I would like to see it.

What sins are you guilty of now Steaver???

Romans 6:

1: What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2: God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3: Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4: Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5: For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6: Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7: For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8: Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9: Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10: For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11: Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12: Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13: Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14: For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15: What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16: Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17: But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18: Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
19: I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
20: For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
21: What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
22: But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
23: For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

A True Christian. All that say they commit all sin known unto mankind and say they are Christians, need to study this passage, from one end to the other, over and over.


BBob,

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Brother Bob: So, Christ pays for your sin, and they are cast into a lake of forgetfulness, but you keep sinning..........
I have seen nothing that I agree with that DHK posted on the "habitual sin".

HP: Brother Bob, the following has nothing to do with anything you have said, but rather is in response to DHK and Steavers many comments on the issue.

Sin is at it’s heart a violation of a known commandment of God. If all sins are paid for at the cross, all sin would have to have been thrown into the sea of forgetfulness at the cross. If that was the case, sin would in reality be a misnomer, for how can one transgress a law that even God cannot see when it is broken seeing He has forgotten about it before it even happened??? According to Scripture, can it be said that God forgave a sin that He still remembers?

Can God forget something before it happens?? According to Scripture, can it be said that God forgave a sin that He still remembers??

Now those are some thoughts to consider.:thumbs:

 

[Marcia]

That which is born of God cannot sin, because its the inward man that is born of God and is indwelt with the Holy Ghost and cannot sin.

Now the flesh, or outward man has not been changed as of yet, and will not be until the resurrection.

I preach the inward man to be a perfect man, and the outward man being in subject to the inward man and waiting on its change.

Rom 8:21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.

So if we sin, its the flesh, and not the Spirit.

Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not.

Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:


BBob,

What in your view comprises the inward man vs. the outward man?

If you are saying that we are spiritually saved but our fallen nature is still subject to sinning, I agree. I don't think there is a part of me that is perfect, however.

I think we have been freed from the bondage of sin but since we are not totally sanctified, we still fall into sin.