Can Believers Go One Day Without Sinning?

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

You are beside yourself DHK. There is not the least shred of truth in what you are accusing me of. Whats new there??

Again, Billwald, excellent point. :thumbs:

 

[DHK]

You are beside yourself DHK. There is not the least shred of truth in what you are accusing me of. Whats new there??

Here is what you said:

DHK, you need to set Biblicist straight. You said on another thread that if God expects us to do something, such as repent, we must have the abilities to do so. Are we to believe that God is expecting an impossiblity from us in the love of our wives that He commands?

That is not what I said. It is a deliberate misrepresentation of what I said, and taken out of its context. I posted a lengthy post explaining what I said. You never even quoted here what I said. In fact you lied. You put a paraphrase of my words in a context that I never used that. That is a lie. There is no way around them. I will await now, your apology.

 

[Moriah]

You are beside yourself DHK. There is not the least shred of truth in what you are accusing me of. Whats new there??

I hear yah, HP. It might mean something to you to know that I see how he falsely accuses you, and he does it to me too.

 

[DHK]

I hear yah, HP. It might mean something to you to know that I see how he falsely accuses you, and he does it to me too.

Unless you have facts to back this statement up, it also is another false accusation and a serious sin. Do you sin like this every day, Moriah? Before you post such sinful posts get your facts straight so that you may post truth instead of that which is false or lies.

 

[Moriah]

You have no concept of reality but you live inside your own mental world of make believe. Marriage is instituted by God and human marriage is patterned after Christ and the church. You are to love your wife even as Christ loved the church and gave himself for her. You may be a "good" husband but not a "perfect" one. The marriage vow at minimum incoporates the second of the two great commands and that is to love your neighbor as yourself. You have not done that, you are not doing that, and you will never do that until you are glorified. I have been married to one woman for 38 years and we have had and do have a great marriage and my wife will affirm that. She will affirm that I have been and am a great husband. But she would laugh if I claimed I have been or am a "perfect" husband! You are to love her as Christ loved the Church and no man has ever done that because that does require being AS GOOD AS Christ.

Biblicist,
I can hardly read anything that you write anymore. You are so much in error. You ramble on with all kinds of insults and falseness. You falsely judge me and accuse me. Your beliefs are wrong about the Lord; no wonder your beliefs are wrong about me also. You have no idea what you are talking about, nor do you have any idea who you are talking to when you personally attack me. You have called me a liar and a heretic, and other undesirable names. You have no idea about my testimony, for God showed me His Power, Glory, and Love for me. You would do yourself well not to attack others in such a way.

 

[Moriah]

Unless you have facts to back this statement up, it also is another false accusation and a serious sin. Do you sin like this every day, Moriah? Before you post such sinful posts get your facts straight so that you may post truth instead of that which is false or lies.

I would not ever risk my relationship with the Lord by making up things about you or anyone. There is something seriously wrong with your thinking and maybe even your heart, for you to say such untruths about others is saddening.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Thanks Moriah. One only hopes that there are some sensible honest listeners that can read through the false accusations of some. You are such a one. :thumbs:

 

[DHK]

I would not ever risk my relationship with the Lord by making up things about you or anyone. There is something seriously wrong with your thinking and maybe even your heart, for you to say such untruths about others is saddening.

Unless you can back up what you have said in your previous post you have lied. You have taken the side of HP, where he deliberately misrepresented me, and I posted the facts to demonstrate that. And you blindly sided with him. So your personal attack, and thus lies have already affected your relationship with the Lord. Unless you can back up your post with facts such a post needs to be recanted or you need to issue an apology. Until that happens I can't see how you can have a right relationship with the Lord. Sin separates people from God, even believers.

 

[DHK]

Thanks Moriah. One only hopes that there are some sensible honest listeners that can read through the false accusations of some. You are such a one. :thumbs:

If you don't have facts HP you are just a false accuser, and that is sin. It simply a personal attack.

 

[DHK]

Biblicist,
I can hardly read anything that you write anymore. You are so much in error. You ramble on with all kinds of insults and falseness. You falsely judge me and accuse me. Your beliefs are wrong about the Lord; no wonder your beliefs are wrong about me also. You have no idea what you are talking about, nor do you have any idea who you are talking to when you personally attack me. You have called me a liar and a heretic, and other undesirable names. You have no idea about my testimony, for God showed me His Power, Glory, and Love for me. You would do yourself well not to attack others in such a way.

Let me sum up what Biblicist was saying as concisely as I can and without offensiveness. I mentioned before the typical vow that a married couple makes:

It goes something like this:

"...to love and to cherish
'til death do us part."

It is a vow to love and to cherish right to the end of death. If we vow to love, then we vow to love completely, perfectly. Do we ever stop loving? Yes! Every time we get upset, angry, are disagreeable, hurt each other's feelings, etc. Our love is not perfect for each other. The only person's love that is perfect is Christ's love.

Your claim to perfect love, or the fact that you have never broken any such vow, is a claim to sinlessness. But the only one that is sinless is Jesus Christ. So take it one step further. Is a claim to sinlessness a claim to deity? Maybe not, but it may seem like it to some people, for we believe that we are all sinners and none of us will ever reach that state until we get to heaven, and we certainly aren't there yet. The only one that was sinless on this side of heaven was Christ. Not even Moses attained sinlessness. Nor did any of the Apostles. Thus why would any of us think that you have reached that position in this life, and yet it seems that is what you are claiming.

 

[Moriah]

Let me sum up what Biblicist was saying as concisely as I can and without offensiveness. I mentioned before the typical vow that a married couple makes:

It goes something like this:

"...to love and to cherish
'til death do us part."

It is a vow to love and to cherish right to the end of death. If we vow to love, then we vow to love completely, perfectly. Do we ever stop loving? Yes! Every time we get upset, angry, are disagreeable, hurt each other's feelings, etc. Our love is not perfect for each other. The only person's love that is perfect is Christ's love.

Your claim to perfect love, or the fact that you have never broken any such vow, is a claim to sinlessness. But the only one that is sinless is Jesus Christ. So take it one step further. Is a claim to sinlessness a claim to deity? Maybe not, but it may seem like it to some people, for we believe that we are all sinners and none of us will ever reach that state until we get to heaven, and we certainly aren't there yet. The only one that was sinless on this side of heaven was Christ. Not even Moses attained sinlessness. Nor did any of the Apostles. Thus why would any of us think that you have reached that position in this life, and yet it seems that is what you are claiming.

What do you not get? Neither Biblicist nor you can sum it up. You both are false accusers bent on defending sin.

 

[Amy.G]

What do you not get? Neither Biblicist nor you can sum it up. You both are false accusers bent on defending sin.

No. They are defending the truth. And the truth is that our righteousness is as filthy rags. Do you deny this? It is the word of God which you say you love. Our only righteousness is Christ's which has been imputed to us. It is not our own.
You are desperately trying to defend you own righteousness as if you actually had any. You do not!

I do not defend sin. I abhor it, but I also know that I am not good as ONLY God is good. You are self righteous just as the Pharisees were. They were blind to their own sin and so are you.

 

[DHK]

What do you not get? Neither Biblicist nor you can sum it up. You both are false accusers bent on defending sin.

I summed it up pretty good, Moriah.
I also said that if you continued to claim that if you had perfect love, never broke your vows, per se, that you would be claiming sinlessness. The only person this side of heaven that has done that is Jesus.

Moriah, are you as sinless as Jesus is?
Are you making a claim to deity?

No, I am not making a defense for sin; I am defending humanity.
You are arguing for deity. That is blasphemous.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Enough is enough and the unchristian uncalled for remarks and accusations by DHK need to stop. Although it seems almost pointless to flag posts, I would encourage the readers to flag posts regardless if it is a moderator or not when personal attacks and slanderous remarks are made. There is no reason whatsoever to accuse Moriah or anyone else posting of blasphemy. It makes a mockery out of Christian charity and paints a blight upon this board as well.

 

[DHK]

Enough is enough and the unchristian uncalled for remarks and accusations by DHK need to stop. Although it seems almost pointless to flag posts, I would encourage the readers to flag posts regardless if it is a moderator or not when personal attacks and slanderous remarks are made. There is no reason whatsoever to accuse Moriah or anyone else posting of blasphemy. It makes a mockery out of Christian charity and paints a blight upon this board as well.

Yes. Enough is enough.
Here is your accusation:

DHK, you need to set Biblicist straight. You said on another thread that if God expects us to do something, such as repent, we must have the abilities to do so. Are we to believe that God is expecting an impossiblity from us in the love of our wives that He commands?

Your accusation is false. Your subsequent conclusion is also false. The innuendo, false accusations and personal attacks by you need to stop. You have yet to apologize for this. When is that going to happen HP?
Why do say things and attribute them to me, when I have never said them. Those are lies. Do you know who the father of lies is?

 

[The Biblicist]

I presented Bibliccal evidence! The husband is to love his wife EVEN AS Christ loved the church! The only love Jesus knows anything about is described in the two great commandments of love. You and Moriah are claiming that you can be precisely what God commands you to be and He commands you to be perfect EVEN AS He is perfect (Mt. 5:46). So you are both claiming that what can be said of Jesus below can also be said of YOU. There are only two possible options, either you are (1) sinless or (2) sinful and He has not commanded you to be sinful and so you are claming the followng can be EQUALLY said of you EVEN AS it is said of Christ:


"I ALWAYS do that which pleases the Father"

"Joh 8:46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?"

Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Heb 7:26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;

1Jo 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

You and Moriah have one of two options! You are either EVEN AS Christ as pertaining to sin - sinless OR you are sinful - there is no middle ground. So, which is it?

Again, neither HP or you have dared to address this post! I will tell you why. Because there are only two possible options (1) you are sinless; or (2) you are sinful.

Those who claim they are sinless are Rejected by Christ as Christ never came to save the righteous and only sinners need Christ or need a Savior. They are also blasphemers because they are claiming to be EQUAL to God when Jesus says "there is none righteous but ONE and that IS GOD."

The real truth is that the spiritual man is the man that is more sensitive of his sinfulness and more readily admits his sinfulness the closer He walks with God.

The carnal man thinks he is holy and spiritual when he is blind, arrogant and ignorant of the a,b,c,'s of salvation.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

To remind the listener of DHK's remark that I made reference to, here it is again. The reader can judge for himself if I am in any way guilty of the accusations DHK has made against me personally.

DHK: " If God expects all men everywhere to repent it is evident that they must have the ability to seek God in order to repent.

HP: Here is the statement I made concerning it. It was made in a post concerning a remark of Biblicist so I will post both Biblicists remark and my own concerning it.Quote:

Biblicist: You have no concept of reality ....You may be a "good" husband but not a "perfect" one. You have not done that, you are not doing that, and you will never do that until you are glorified......

Now my response to the remark of Biblicist to DHK:

HP: DHK, you need to set Biblicist straight. You said on another thread that if God expects us to do something, such as repent, we must have the abilities to do so. Are we to believe that God is expecting an impossibility from us in the love of our wives that He commands?

Let the reader judge for themselves if I have lied, falsely accused, or attacked DHK personally by these remarks as he has accused me of.

 

[DHK]

To remind the listener of DHK's remark that I made reference to, here it is again. The reader can judge for himself if I am in any way guilty of the accusations DHK has made against me personally.

HP: Here is the statement I made concerning it. It was made in a post concerning a remark of Biblicist so I will post both Biblicists remark and my own concerning it.Quote:

Now my response to the remark of Biblicist to DHK:

Let the reader judge for themselves if I have lied, falsely accused, or attacked DHK personally by these remarks as he has accused me of.

Taking things out of their context is as good as making them say something that they don't say. Let's try again shall we.

This statement:
DHK: " If God expects all men everywhere to repent it is evident that they must have the ability to seek God in order to repent.

It was made in the context of arguing against Calvinism. Remember, I am not against Calvinism. The point I was making was man has the ability, the will, the choice, to repent.
--You are taking my words out of their context.

Now this statement:
DHK, you need to set Biblicist straight. You said on another thread that if God expects us to do something, such as repent, we must have the abilities to do so. Are we to believe that God is expecting an impossibility from us in the love of our wives that He commands?
This was made in the context of marriage, not salvation, not Calvinism, but marriage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You can't see the difference there HP. How long will you take things out of their contexts, mesh them together, and make the say something I never said.

HP believes:
Psalm 14:1 AND THE LORD SAID....

....THERE IS NO GOD

This is you MO HP. That is what Psalm 14:1 says. But look who said it.
You work the same way with the things I post.

 

[Moriah]

Enough is enough and the unchristian uncalled for remarks and accusations by DHK need to stop. Although it seems almost pointless to flag posts, I would encourage the readers to flag posts regardless if it is a moderator or not when personal attacks and slanderous remarks are made. There is no reason whatsoever to accuse Moriah or anyone else posting of blasphemy. It makes a mockery out of Christian charity and paints a blight upon this board as well.

I give you much thanks, HP.

 

[David Lamb]

David, how would you separate a thought to evil or sin, and sin itself?

Depends what you mean by "a thought to evil or sin".

1. Thinking about the subject of sin? (Harmatology, I believe, is what theologians call it).

2. Being tempted?

3. Thinking sinful thoughts, such as the example I gave from the bible, that of looking with lust at a woman?​

The Word of God includes passages dealing with the subject of sin, so unless anyone is advocating that we should read such passages without thinking about them, (1.) cannot be sinful in itself. (Examples of such passages are Romans 7, and 1 Corinthians 15.55-56).

Being tempted cannot be sinful, because the Lord Jesus Christ was tempted, yet He did not sin.

But if by "a thought to do evil or sin" you mean (3.), I would not try to "separate it from sin itself", because according to Jesus, such a thought is sin.

I hope it goes without saying that I am talking about God's view of sin here, not breaking the human laws of our various countries.