Originally posted by Kiffen:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />ittut said
John sounds just like Paul doesn't he. They both praise God and not man
You are correct that John and Paul both praise God and not man. John’s writings however are of a different theme than Paul. Paul heavily emphasizes Justification by Faith in Christ in his writings while John heavily emphasizes Jesus is the Son of God and God manifested in the flesh. That is not to say they were in disagreement but God used them differently.
Amen for this is a reasonable approach. But I believe it is somewhat deeper, as scripture reveals. I offer my position in Christ here, and I do not doubt you also believe in the power of the Name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
God did use these two Apostles differently. His earthly Apostles were to go to the house of Israel with their message of John the Baptist of “repent and be baptized for the remission of their sins”, believing on the name of Jesus Christ. Things dramatically changed after the destruction of Jerusalem, and the Temple. Had Israel accepted Messiah then
the Gentile would be preached to by those that God gave authority to. So until Damascus Road, and Peter sent by God to Cornelius, the gospel was to the Jew to come
by faith, as all from the beginning had done, as shown in Hebrew 11, and all doing their works.
Paul’s message heavily emphasizes the Gentile is saved by the Grace of God
through faith, with no work included. This is not known (spoken but not understood) until after Damascus Road. Such things were hidden – I Corinthians 2:6-8. Such things as this only became known as God revealed to Paul, and then to the earthly Apostles, explanation of such things explained to them by Paul (II Peter 3:14-18).
Who first tells us about the Gospel of Grace; faith, hope and charity? Paul or John?
Such things as this were hidden in God from the beginning. Today the Jew can come just as we (me) Gentiles. We should note John, along with Peter and the other Apostles, including James were not allowed (while Jerusalem and the Temple still stood) to preach to the heathen. They shook hands with Paul and Barnabas on this matter – Galatians 2 relates to Acts 15.
There were two gospels being preached to the Gentile (the other from “troublers” of the Judean church), and Paul wanted them to stop that other gospel that was only for the Jew. A Gentile can never come as a Jew into the Temple, but a Jew can come today just as we Gentiles into the Holy of Holies, for we were crucified with Him, coming through His blood. He is coming for us that are in His body, catching us up to Him to be with Him forever. Then the motion towards the “kingdom to come” begins again, for God has promised this to Israel, and the Gentile proselytes, can tag along. Those that make it will wish to curry favor with the Jew for God is with THEM – Zechariah 8:23.
John wrote all of his books about 30 years after Paul, and this is the reason I said John in his writings sounds like Paul. At Pentecost and years afterwards the gospel preached by the Apostles in Jerusalem was that of the “great commission” for this was the only gospel available to them. Praise God for the “unsearchable riches in Christ” (Romans 11:28-33). The Gospel of Christ Jesus from heaven as revealed to Paul is the gospel of the Cross, the only Gospel today that can save, “believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and we will be saved, and our house". Now our repentance is in Him; our circumcision and baptism done without hands. Justified in the name of Jesus Christ, and sanctified by the Holy Ghost, sealed in. We are Once Saved Always Saved.
ittut said
They both praise God and not man. What day does the earthly Apostle John give you to worship, and what day does the heavenly Apostle Paul give you to worship?
Neither one gives me any day to worship for I worship God alone.
Amen! God the Father, The Only Begotten Son of the Father - God the Word/Son, and God the Holy Spirit did not give utterance to John, Paul, or any other Apostle the authority for man to institute Christmas or Easter. Whom do we follow? Man or God? Are the darts and arrows thrown at those that believe His Word, really intended for us? Can we not ask, who it is that is behind adding worldly worship that is not of God? Are the Christian churches today any different than Israel going to be with other god’s on their Holy Days?
ittut said
"And when the people saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in the speech of Lycaonia, The gods are come down to us in the likeness of men. 12. And they called Barnabas, Jupiter; and Paul, Mercurius, because he was the chief speaker. 13. Then the priest of Jupiter, which was before their city, brought oxen and garlands unto the gates, and would have done sacrifice with the people. 14. Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,
15. And saying, Sirs, why do ye these things? We also are men of like passions with you, and preach unto you that ye should turn from these vanities unto the living God, which made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all things that are therein”, Acts 14:11-15.
uhhh….
what does that scripture have to do with the subject?
Man has a great tendency to gravitate toward others that are not God. Ever thought about where the “Christmas tree” idea began? Jeremiah 10:2 tells us and warns against such things.
”Thus saith the Lord, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.
3. For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
4. They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not”, Jeremiah 10:2-4.
ittut said
Count me out of Holy Days for some man, Apostle or not. We turn to God and not man. Christian faith, ituttut
a Few Questions
1. Do you celebrate the 4th of July? If so why do you remember the founding Fathers of the USA and their accomplishments but not remember the Saints and their accomplishments? Even here in the SBC in December we remember Lottie Moon and her example she set for us,
2. Do you celebrate Veterans day. Memorial Day? If so why do you remember the Military veterans and their accomplishments but not remember the Saints and their accomplishments?
3. Should the Vietnam memorial and WW2 memorial be destroyed since using your logic they are idols that worship man?
4. Is Secretary’s Day idolatry? Since that is honoring woman and not God using your logic.
5. Do you oppose 911 ceremonies? since using your logic that is worshipping man. </font>[/QUOTE]Holy Cow! Are we now supposed to catalogue these earthly remembrances as Holy Days? If so could we add Mothers Day, Fathers Day, Gramps and Grandma Day. Please count me out of these Holy Days.
Special Days if you don’t understand has nothing to do with worshipping man but remembering their examples be it the Memorial Day (Remembering the price paid for our Country's freedom) or St. Stephen’s Day (Remembering the price for following Christ can be martyrdom).
All these days and dates are known for they are of man. Please tell me from the Word of God the exact month, and day that Christ was born. We really do need to understand these things. Christian faith, ituttut