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Christ the risen Saviour, not potential Saviour! 4

Martin Marprelate

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
BF you asked "Are you saying Jesus the Saviour is the Saviour of them who die in their sins ? Yes or No"

The answer is YES, not because I say it but because the the word of God does.

Christ came as the savior of the whole world BF. The fact that many will not trust in Him does not change the fact.

1Jn 2:2 He Himself is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

You can either believe the bible BF or you can continue to follow your false view but only one is true.
You are making the assumption that 'world' in the Bible always means 'all the people in the world.'
Have a read of these: A.W. PINK AND THE DEFINITION OF "KOSMOS" The Scriptures and the World by Arthur W. Pink

Also, in 1 John 2:2, the words 'the sins of' are not found in any ancient manuscript. They are in italics in the KJV.
 

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Thats works. Again Trusting is an action the person does. You contribute salvation to your actions, not Christs actions.

So your telling me that you disagree with the clear word of God.

How stubborn can one person be? You are so committed to your false religion that you will deny the word of God.
 

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
You are making the assumption that 'world' in the Bible always means 'all the people in the world.'
Have a read of these: A.W. PINK AND THE DEFINITION OF "KOSMOS" The Scriptures and the World by Arthur W. Pink

Also, in 1 John 2:2, the words 'the sins of' are not found in any ancient manuscript. They are in italics in the KJV.

Martin you are making the assumption as to what I think. I look at the context which is something that calvinist it would seem do not do.

1Jn 2:2 He Himself is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for ********* the whole world.

So does taking the words 'the sins of' out of the sentence make it say something different Martin?

He Himself is the atoning sacrifice for our sins
and not only for ours
but also for the whole world.

As for A W Pink it really does not matter what he thinks the word world means it does matter what the word world means in the context of the bible.


Part # 1
The Complete WordStudy Dictionary

World G2889



κόσμος

kósmos; gen. kósmou, masc. noun probably from koméō (n.f.), to take care of. World, with its primary meaning being order, regular disposition and arrangement.

(I) A decoration, ornament (1Pe_3:3; Sept.: Exo_33:4-6; Jer_4:30).

(II) Order of the universe, the world.

(A) The universe, heavens and earth (Mat_13:35; Mat_24:21; Luk_11:50; Joh_17:5, Joh_17:24; Act_17:24; Rom_1:20; Heb_4:3). Metonym for the inhabitants of the universe (1Co_4:9). Figuratively and symbolically, a world of something, as an aggregate such as in Jas_3:6, "a world of iniquity" (cf. Sept.: Pro_17:6).

(B) The earth, this lower world as the abode of man. (1) The then-known world and particularly the people who lived in it (Mar_16:15; Joh_16:21, Joh_16:28; Joh_21:25; 1Ti_3:16; 1Pe_5:9; 2Pe_3:6). To come or be sent into the world means to be born, as in Joh_1:9. To go forth into the world means to appear before men as in Joh_3:17, Joh_3:19; Joh_6:14; 1Ti_1:15; Heb_10:5; 1Jn_4:1, 1Jn_4:9; 2Jn_1:7. Hyperbolically (Mat_4:8, "all the kingdoms of the world"; see Rom_1:8). (2) Metonymically, the world meaning the inhabitants of the earth, men, mankind (Mat_5:14; Mat_13:38; Joh_1:29; Joh_3:16; Rom_3:6, Rom_3:19; 1Co_4:13; 2Co_5:19; Heb_11:7; 2Pe_2:5; 1Jn_2:2). Hyperbolically, the world for the multitude, everybody (Joh_7:4 "show thyself to the world" means manifest thyself, do not remain in secret; Joh_12:19); metaphorically, that is openly (Joh_14:22; Joh_18:20; 2Co_1:12). It also stands for the heathen world, the same as tá éthnē (G1484), "the nations" (a.t. [Rom_11:12, Rom_11:15 {cf. Luk_12:30}]).

(C) The present world, the present order of things, as opposed to the kingdom of Christ; and hence, always with the idea of transience, worthlessness, and evil both physical and moral, the seat of cares, temptations, irregular desires. It is thus nearly equivalent to ho aiṓn hoútos (aiṓn [G165], age; hoútos [G3778], this), this age. (1) Generally with hoútos (G3778), this (Joh_12:25, "in this world," during this life; Joh_18:36, "of this world," meaning this earth; 1Co_5:10; Eph_2:2; 1Jn_4:17). Specifically the wealth and enjoyments of this world, this life's goods (Mat_16:26; Mar_8:36; Luk_9:25; 1Co_3:22; 1Co_7:31, 1Co_7:33-34; Gal_6:14; Jas_4:4; 1Jn_2:17). (2) Metonymically for the men of this world as opposed to those who seek the kingdom of God, e.g., with hoútos, this (1Co_1:20; 1Co_3:19); as subject to Satan, the ruler of this world (Joh_12:31; Joh_14:30; Joh_16:11); without hoútos (Joh_7:7; Joh_14:17; Joh_16:8; Joh_17:6, Joh_17:9; 1Co_1:21; 2Co_7:10; Php_2:15; Jas_1:27).
 

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
You are making the assumption that 'world' in the Bible always means 'all the people in the world.'
Have a read of these: A.W. PINK AND THE DEFINITION OF "KOSMOS" The Scriptures and the World by Arthur W. Pink

Also, in 1 John 2:2, the words 'the sins of' are not found in any ancient manuscript. They are in italics in the KJV.

Part # 2




The Complete WordStudy Dictionary

World G2889

(III) Idiomatic expressions with kósmos:

(A) A rhetorical expression for the great majority of people in a particular place (Joh_12:19).

(B) Almost equivalent to the modern phrase "the public" (Joh_7:4 [cf. Joh_18:20]).

(C) Means of sustenance for the body is called bíos (G979), i.e., means of livelihood. Bíon toú kósmou (1Jn_3:17), the material things provided in the world.

(D) "The tongue . . . a world of iniquity" (Jas_3:6), the sum total.

(E) The world before the flood (Heb_11:7; 2Pe_2:5; 2Pe_3:6). The population of the world then and its accumulations of wealth and the products of its labor are no doubt chiefly in view; yet the comparison in 2Pe_3:6-7 with "the heavens and the earth, which are now," suggests a sweeping away at that time of the whole order of nature.

(IV) Kósmos used with ethical meaning:

(A) As material and transitory, the world presents a contrast with that which is spiritual and eternal. So Paul regards it in Gal_4:3; Gal_6:14; Col_2:8, Col_2:20. His general teaching is that the Law and its ordinances belong to an external sphere, the things that are seen (2Co_4:18) which lose their value through Christ's death, in comparison with the things spiritual. So it should be with all Christians. Here he is not considering the world to be evil as indeed the Law is not evil, but only of temporary value (see 1Co_7:31, 1Co_7:34 [cf. Luk_12:30]).

(B) Devotion to the things of the world produces a certain attitude of mind which under the sense of laws is manifested in "the sorrow of the world" which is not "godly sorrow" (2Co_7:10). The things of this world are thus spoken of as altogether incomplete (1Co_1:27-28; 1Co_4:13; Jas_2:5). The world has its own wisdom which does not have concern for God (Joh_1:10; 1Co_1:20-21; 1Co_3:19) and which cannot receive the Spirit of truth (Joh_14:17). There is a spirit of this world (1Co_2:12). Those who have this spirit are described as being "of the world" or "of this world" (Joh_8:23; 1Jn_4:4-5). In contrast, Christ's disciples are described as being "not of the world" (Joh_15:19; Joh_17:14 [cf. 1Co_5:10]). The state of the world arising from the influence of this worldly spirit is one of dire moral corruption (Eph_2:2; Jas_1:27; Jas_4:4; 2Pe_1:4; 2Pe_2:20; 1Jn_2:15-17).

(C) The word "world" denotes the mass of people who are hostile or at least indifferent to the truth and the followers of Christ (Joh_7:7; Joh_16:20, Joh_16:33; 1Jn_3:1, 1Jn_3:13; 1Jn_4:4-5).

(D) The world is dominated by the evil one (Joh_12:31; 1Jn_4:4-5).

(E) The world is the object of judgment and saving mercy (Joh_1:29; Joh_3:16-19; Joh_4:42; Joh_6:33, Joh_6:51; Joh_8:12, Joh_8:26; Joh_9:5; Joh_12:46-47; Rom_3:19; Rom_11:12, Rom_11:15; 1Co_6:2; 2Co_5:19). Men are the objects of judgment individually but they will also be objects of a collective judgment or a collective restoration (cf. Rom_8:19 f.).

(F) The Holy Spirit has a special office in regard to the world, distinct from that which He exercises toward believers (Joh_16:8-11).

(G) Through faith, the Christian can overcome the world, i.e., no doubt, the worldly spirit in himself and the opposition of worldly men and the world's ruler (1Jn_4:4; 1Jn_5:4-5).

(V) Kósmos, at times, bears a distinction to aiṓn (G165), age, a period of time, but a much longer one than we usually think of, probably indeed the whole period during which the present order of nature has continued and shall continue. Aiṓn is used in many places with much the same connotation as "world." It is often rendered by this word in our translations though aiṓn should often be distinguished from kósmos, even where the two seem to express the same idea as in 1Co_1:20 and Eph_2:2-3. This aiṓn is contrasted to that which is to come (Mat_12:32; Mar_10:30; Luk_18:30; Heb_6:5). We read of its cares (Mat_13:22; Mar_4:19); its sons (Luk_16:8; Luk_20:34-35); its rulers, i.e., the kings and great ones of the earth (1Co_2:6, 1Co_2:8); its wisdom (1Co_1:20; 1Co_2:6; 1Co_3:18-19); its fashion, to which the Christian must not be conformed (Rom_12:2). It is evil (Gal_1:4) and under the dominion of the evil one (2Co_4:4). This use of aiṓn with an ethical meaning is not difficult to understand, easier indeed than the corresponding and more common one of kósmos. It is otherwise with the expression in Heb_1:2, "He made the worlds [aiṓnas, ages]." Here, hoi aiṓnes, the ages, seems to mean the sum of the periods of time including all that is manifested in and through them.

Deriv.: kosméō (G2885), to order, put in order, decorate, adorn; kosmikós (G2886), worldly, earthly; kósmios (G2887), well- ordered, well-mannered, decorous; kosmokrátor (G2888), a world ruler.

Syn.: aiṓn (G165), age; oikouménē (G3625), the inhabited earth, civilization; gḗ (G1093), earth as arable land, but also the earth as a whole, the world in contrast to the heavens.
 
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