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Christ the risen Saviour, not potential Saviour !

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Marooncat79

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Silverhair said:
Are you not the ones that say you were picked out prior to creation? What made you any different from all those other sinners?

But the real question is how do you know that you were actually picked? You can hope you were but you really have no way of knowing do you. You can't say it is because you believe as even "faith" had to be given to you so it is not your faith is it?

So your whole hope for salvation is based on what?
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What makes us different?

Nothing but Gods grace. He decided to hVe mercy upon my poor wicked soul. Seriously
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Marooncat79 said:
There is no arrogance. Its actually very humiliating. We wind up undrrstanding what we deserved vs what God did for us
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God must have seen something in you that would make Him pick you over all those other sinners. What is humbling about saying God pick me?

Your just saying that God picked you B4 creation shows arrogance as you think you qualified to be picked, something made you standout. What was it?
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Marooncat79 said:
What makes us different?

Nothing but Gods grace. He decided to hVe mercy upon my poor wicked soul. Seriously
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But why did He have mercy on your poor wicked soul since you did not even exist B4 creation?

But the real question that you did not deal with is "how do you know that you were actually picked?"

Calvinist theory says even the faith you have had to be given to you. And as Calvin rightly said it could just be what he termed as "Evanescent" faith. According to Calvin, God gave such people a delusion that made them think they were saved, and even feel like they were saved, only to eventually remove this fleeting grace and reveal that they were just deluded hypocrites that God had never regenerated and whose faith, while it seemed very real to them, was not real faith at all.

So again I ask, how do you know you are saved?
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
Since Christ came to save sinners Joh 3:17 "For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
Note the the word "might"
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The word might denote purpose, intention, certain to happen. Like here Jn 12:38

That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?

The world in Jn 3:17 is certain to be saved, as He saves all His Sheep/Elect
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
So BF same question for you, "How do you know you were picked out B4 creation"?
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I have been given the Gift of Faith to believe in Jesus, Thats why Faith is given that we may know we have been given eternal life Jn 17:2-3

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1 Jn 5: 13,20

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
The word might denote purpose, intention, certain to happen. Like here Jn 12:38

That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?

The world in Jn 3:17 is certain to be saved, as He saves all His Sheep/Elect
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So once again you are
1] ignoring context John 3:14-17
and
2] reading your religious theory into the text {Sheep/Elect}

As long as you keep doing this BF you will continue to make grievous errors when handling the word of God.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
I have been given the Gift of Faith to believe in Jesus, Thats why Faith is given that we may know we have been given eternal life Jn 17:2-3

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1 Jn 5: 13,20

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
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You say you were given faith to believe. So again you have to hope what you think you have is actually true and not just wishful thinking on your part.

Those verses you quoted apply to all of us that have freely trusted in Christ for our salvation but have no meaning for the calvinist that hopes they were picked out B4 creation.
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Silverhair said:
That applies to us that have freely trusted in Him for our salvation Eph 2:8, but what do you base you hope on?
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It applies to us who were elect chosen in Christ before the foundation, a election of grace Eph 1:4-6

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
It applies to us who were elect chosen in Christ before the foundation, a election of grace Eph 1:4-6

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
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There you go again BF you are ignoring context. Eph 1:3-14 is one sentence in Greek and must be understood as such. Verse 4 does not tell us who but rather how one is saved. When we are in Christ and that only happen as we see in vs 13 by believing/faith in Him. God foreknows all those that will freely trust in Him but has not picked out select ones to do so as your religion requires.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
But you said the Person and work of Christ saved no one !
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To quote you BF "But you said the Person and work of Christ saved no one !"

That is not what I have ever said and you know it.

This is just another example of where you misquote or twist words

Please do not lie about what I have said BF. That is not very Christian of you.

What I have said many times is that the death of Christ saved no one but it covered the sins of all and His resurrection made salvation possible for all.
 
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