Church music...

[Joshua Rhodes]

Have y'all noticed...

... that much of the modern church music has been

a) Dummed down for our younger and "unchallenged" generations AND

b) that singing the words is sometimes a theological nightmare?!

While I wouldn't go this far, I will say that there's alot of schlock to sift through out there. The primary reason for this is that we've had years of time to "sift" the bad hymns out. (Bad theology, bad music is what I mean.) Because new songs are written, recorded, published and produced at such a frantic rate these days, more discernment is needed to "sift" through the "bad" songs. Not all of the modern church music is "dumbed-down" or theologically nightmarish. Come to think of it, there are some songs in our hymnal that are theologically nightmarish. (sfiC said it best... some of our Christmas carols are awful!!)

Last week the song "I am a friend of God, I am a friend of God," ad nauseum. No, I am a child of God. Jesus said "i no longer call you servant but friend" but that was before the resurrectoin. When we weren't BRETHREN to Him! Friend, for believers, is a "step down" to being under the schoolmaster again!

While I appreciate your reasoning of this, there are several examples in the New Testament of Jesus calling His disciples, friends. While the "theme" verse of Friend of God is James 2:23 ("And the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness," and he was called God's friend.) I think there are other examples of this as well.

Or this -- "Come into our midst, Oh Lord" (Again, over and over and over). He's already HERE if there are 2 or more believers. Are they insinuating that there are not??

I was always taught to mean what you say when you sing but when we get on one of these songs, I spend more time "editing" what I say than worshipping.

How about y'all?

skypair

Have you spoken to your music minister/worship pastor about your opinions? Or did you just come here to vent?

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

Then I must have written my song "In A Moment" pre-1800:laugh:

Where can we hear this sfiC?

 

[Gold Dragon]

I agree about the constant repeating of songs... A few Sundays ago we sang a song that repeated "blessed be the name" 32 times in 4 verses... oops, sorry that was the hymn "Blesed be the name" .... my bad :tonofbricks:

Regarding simple repetitive lyrics, Psalm 136 has the simple phrase "For His lovingkindness is everlasting" repeated 26 times in 26 verses. Those wiley CCMers must have slipped that one into the bible without us noticing.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Where can we hear this sfiC?

Since Dr Bob says songs since the 1800's are probably no good, try looking in the 1523 Geneva Hymnbook... j/k.:wavey:

Here are the lyrics. I also have sheet music, but it won't post on the board.

In A Moment

God gave us a promise, it's written in His Word
When the angel blows the trumpet the saints will leave the earth
We shall meet our Savior as we rise up in the air
He'll take us to His home above where His glory we shall share.

In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye
The graves will burst open and the dead in Christ will fly
Then those that are alive in Him will be caught up in the sky
We'll be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye.

Jesus said, 'In this world, you'll suffer many things'
But no matter what the trial, keep trusting in His name
One day He's coming for us, what a joy that will be
When He shall clothe our mortal lives with immortality!
Ronald W Robey

Copyright ©1991 Ronald W Robey ​

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

Here are the lyrics. I also have sheet music, but it won't post on the board.

Looks good, sfiC. I'd like to hear it sometime. Here's one of mine... my attempt at a hymn. Don't laugh!

What Grace is This?
Joshua Rhodes and Kenny Johnston
© 2003 Twiceborn Ministries

What grace is this that pardons sin, cleanses iniquity, saving all men?
What grace is this that finds a home inside a heart once made of stone?
O grace of God, so full and rich, His praise is ever on my lips!
Grace reaches out and calls me home, blood of the Lamb for sin atones.

What mercy hangs upon a tree enduring nails and thorns for me?
What mercy wills to take my place; to pay the price for my disgrace?
Eternal life in endless day replaces death of sin's dark wage,
Mercy restraining judgment's hand, revealing grace in which I stand.

What love is this that bids me come into an everlasting home?
What love is warm, what love invites this sinner to those glorious heights?
In heaven's halls I'll join the throng of saints and angels 'round His throne!
Because of grace, mercy and love, my home has been prepared above!

Forevermore in paradise, I'll worship 'round the throne of Christ,
Because of grace, mercy and love, I have a heavenly home above!

 

[standingfirminChrist]

lyrics are good. ya got music to it?

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

I do. Haven't recorded it yet, so there's no way to play it for you, unless you want to call and I'll play it over the phone! I could write it out and send you a copy of the sheet music if you'd like to hear it played by someone there.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

am in room on paltalk now. will get up with ya later on that song. would love to hear it

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

Thank you, sir. Likewise.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Here is another I wrote some time back:

Speak To The Rock

In the desert, God's people were so thirsty and dry
They were angry with Moses, "Did you bring us here to die?"
So God spoke to Moses, told him, 'Gather the flock
And I'll give them water when you speak to the rock'

There came a woman of Samaria to draw water from the well
Jesus told her that day many things about herself
He said, 'I'll give you living water and you'll never thirst again'
Then she witnessed to the city, "Christ revealed my every sin"

Speak to the Rock, and let the water flow
Speak to the Rock, it will satisfy your soul
If your spirit needs refreshing, don't you murmur nor complain
Just speak to the Rock and you'll never thirst again.
Speak to the Rock and you'll never be the same.
Ronald W Robey

Copyright ©1993 Ronald W Robey ​

 

[standingfirminChrist]

one more:

His Blood Spoke My Name

In the land of Egypt, God's children were oppressed
Pharaoh's heart was hardened; so they would get no rest
The blood upon the portal kept Israel safe from fright
While Pharaoh's house was wailing; for death had come that night

On a lonely hillside, a man from Galilee
Rejected by His people, was hung upon a tree
The Son of God would give His life to bear our guilt and shame
It was there upon that rugged cross that His blood spoke my name.

His blood spoke my name there on that rugged tree
His blood spoke my name, saying, "Child, I'll set you free
The Son of God would give His life to bear our guilt and shame
It was there upon that rugged cross that His blood spoke my name.

Ronald Ward Robey

Copyright ©1998 RonaldRobey ​

 

[skypair]

Dedicated to Skypair, who is NOT a grinch......

Thanks, rbell! It wasn't as if I were going to have a heart attack on this issue -- nothing that important. Maybe I'm just too old, eh?

skypair

 

[skypair]

Have you spoken to your music minister/worship pastor about your opinions? Or did you just come here to vent?

I have. Actually, this is a "holdover" from my last church -- Bellevue -- more than here. Our program does have some of these but they are rather innocuos (sp?) so far as numbers of them is concerned.

We have a great music program from what I can tell since joining 3 weeks ago. I just wanted feedback from others and, maybe, a caution to music ministers here.

skypair

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

Thanks for clearing that up, skypair. I hope my congregation knows that I listen to their concerns, register them, and do everything I can to make sure that their concerns are vetted within the leading of the Holy Spirit as best I can.

 

[skypair]

Thanks for clearing that up, skypair. I hope my congregation knows that I listen to their concerns, register them, and do everything I can to make sure that their concerns are vetted within the leading of the Holy Spirit as best I can.

Hey -- sorry if I "stepped on your toes." Music ministry today is a challenging job. It's almost like trying to practice Calvinism in a Southern Baptist church! :laugh: Many kudos if you can "pull it off."

I have a theory that a lot of new music is supposed to be like we imagine the angels' worship to be --- forever repeating "Holy, Holy, Holy." It's not that I don't want to worship like the angels but we have so much more to worship God for than what the angels do, right?

Every "hymn" that the saints in heaven and on earth sing has personal testimony in it (ex: Rev 5:9-10)! And variety. In fact, it is said of those in heaven numerous times that "only they could sing it!"

Anyway, that's my FWIW opinion.

skypair

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

Just so you know... one of the wisest things I ever heard was an old music pastor who told me "When you have music in your title or job description, there's a big target printed on your back." I'm used to it. :laugh:

For the record, I don't like mindless repetition either. Let's worship with all we have, including our intellect. But sometimes, a little repetition is needed (case in point, the psalms, some of which are very responsive). Variety IS god, I agree.

 

[Japheth]

I know a few strains of Reformed Baptist going through worship wars right now, but our strain is not one of them...

We sing solely from God's Word... The 150 Psalms of the Psalter that we are commanded to sing.......




We add nothing to His worship and we take away nothing from His worship...

It should does put an end to worship wars when we do only what he commands us.... Second Commandment, Nadab and Abihu, Worship in Spirit and TRUTH, etc...
Especially when we sing the pure word of God and not the fallible word of man..

 

[webdog]

I agree about the constant repeating of songs... A few Sundays ago we sang a song that repeated "blessed be the name" 32 times in 4 verses... oops, sorry that was the hymn "Blesed be the name" .... my bad :tonofbricks:

Don't I recall reading that there are angels that do just this in Heaven?

 

[skypair]

Don't I recall reading that there are angels that do just this in Heaven?

Yeah, webbie. But the point was that they have no experience like we do to sing about. You know "song of Moses," "song of Moses and of the Lamb," etc. They "inquire into" our salvation and we sing them a song about it.

skypair

 

[skypair]

I know a few strains of Reformed Baptist going through worship wars right now, but our strain is not one of them...

We sing solely from God's Word... The 150 Psalms of the Psalter that we are commanded to sing.......




We add nothing to His worship and we take away nothing from His worship...

It should does put an end to worship wars when we do only what he commands us.... Second Commandment, Nadab and Abihu, Worship in Spirit and TRUTH, etc...
Especially when we sing the pure word of God and not the fallible word of man..

Bravo, Japheth, and welcome to BB. :wavey: Hope we'll be hearing more from.

skypair