Confession for Baptist’s and Protestants in general

[David Lamb]

Read closely.

“For this reason, I am reminding you to fan into flames the gift of God that is within you through the laying on of my hands.”

It is through the laying of hands that gift of God is given.

This is the difference between our theologies here.

My Church has the power of binding and loosing on earth and heaven will equally hold bound. Not just regarding sin, but also the bestowal of the Apostolic gifts of God.

Paul warns Timothy “Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others.”

This is a real transfer of authority, not be taken lightly, only properly approved men are to be ordained.

" I am reminding you to fan into flames the gift of God" The sign of laying on of hands happens in protestant church ordinations, too.
Yes, properly approved men, approved by God.

 

[Cathode]

Pure heresy.

You are throughly deceived

Peace to you

No, you don’t understand the scriptures or how Authority is handed down.

“ He who listens to you, listens to me “

If you listen to an Apostle you aren’t listening to just a man, you are listening to Christ.

The Apostles spoke in the Person of Christ, Persona Christi.

Jesus breathed on them saying receive The Holy Spirit “ Whose sins you forgive are forgiven them, whose sins you retain are retained “

Jesus gives His power to forgive sin, in Persona Christi

The Apostolic successors received this same power from the Apostles through the laying of hands. They preach and forgive sin in the Person of Christ.

It’s all Scriptural and right under your nose.

 

[Cathode]

" I am reminding you to fan into flames the gift of God" The sign of laying on of hands happens in protestant church ordinations, too.
Yes, properly approved men, approved by God.

As Clement points out.

“And thus preaching through countries and cities, they appointed the first-fruits [of their labours], having first proved them by the Spirit, to be bishops and deacons of those who should afterwards believe. Nor was this any new thing, since indeed many ages before it was written concerning bishops and deacons. For thus saith the Scripture a certain place, ‘I will appoint their bishops s in righteousness, and their deacons in faith.’… Our apostles also knew, through our Lord Jesus Christ, and there would be strife on account of the office of the episcopate. For this reason, therefore, inasmuch as they had obtained a perfect fore-knowledge of this, they appointed those [ministers] already mentioned, and afterwards gave instructions, that when these should fall asleep, other approved men should succeed them in their ministry…For our sin will not be small, if we eject from the episcopate those who have blamelessly and holily fulfilled its duties.” Pope Clement, Epistle to Corinthians, 42, 44 (A.D. 98).

So the Apostles discerned and proved them by the Spirit.

In fact Clement was approved under Peter Himself. Peter ordained Clement.

In this we see the lineage of the Apostolically approved men and the subsequently ordained after them.

This not what is happening in Protestantism, they broke from the Apostolic lineage of approved and appointed men.

 

[Cathode]

“And thus preaching through countries and cities, they appointed the first-fruits [of their labours], having first proved them by the Spirit, to be bishops and deacons of those who should afterwards believe. Nor was this any new thing, since indeed many ages before it was written concerning bishops and deacons. For thus saith the Scripture a certain place, ‘I will appoint their bishops s in righteousness, and their deacons in faith.’… Our apostles also knew, through our Lord Jesus Christ, and there would be strife on account of the office of the episcopate. For this reason, therefore, inasmuch as they had obtained a perfect fore-knowledge of this, they appointed those [ministers] already mentioned, and afterwards gave instructions, that when these should fall asleep, other approved men should succeed them in their ministry…For our sin will not be small, if we eject from the episcopate those who have blamelessly and holily fulfilled its duties.” Pope Clement, Epistle to Corinthians, 42, 44 (A.D. 98).

How does Clement know all this? Well he knew, and learnt and lived and worked with the Apostles personally. Peter and Paul. That’s how he knows.

Clement was a successor of the Apostles himself.

 

[Cathode]

All sin is serious.

The RCC does not “save souls”. You deceive people into believe a false way to salvation…. That they must go through a priest that get forgiveness and perform works the priest gives them.

Peace to you

All sin is serious, but mortal sin cuts us off from saving Grace.

The priest has the Apostolic gift to forgive and retain sin not for himself but to carry out Christ’s ministry for the forgiveness of sin for the sake of the Church.

Jesus established this Apostolic ministry.

So when you go to the priest, you go to Christ.

 

[Charlie24]

Your mind is made up it seems.

I only present the scripture and the ancient fathers understanding of it. You decided they are all stupid and apostate and only you know Scriptures meaning.

Rather than look objectively you judge emotively, not seeing these Fathers are using scripture all the time, but not with your alien interpretations.


Ignorance of the Christian Fathers is ignorance of context and history.

Although the Fathers weren’t Scripture they were Apostolic appointments and even coworkers mentioned in Scripture. You can learn from them a great deal.
Clement personally knew Peter and Paul, and you lump him in as an apostate.

Not good, not sound.

In Clement you have a first century, scripturally named person who knew and worked with Peter and Paul personally and was bishop of Rome after them.

He is not apostate, consider first of all that you might be apostate, before accusing him of being apostate.


Yes they are, the Fathers have given you the Scriptural connection, and you don’t want to accept it.

I believe those fathers existed, what I don't believe is what the RCC said they said.

 

[Cathode]

I believe those fathers existed, what I don't believe is what the RCC said they said.

So now they aren’t a bunch of Apostates?

All of the Fathers are Catholic history, not Protestant or Baptist history which was human founded traditions that are alien to the Fathers and Early Christians, and to each other.

 

[Charlie24]

So now they aren’t a bunch of Apostates?

All of the Fathers are Catholic history, not Protestant or Baptist history which was human founded traditions that are alien to the Fathers and Early Christians, and to each other.

They were made into apostates by who?

 

[Charlie24]

They were made into apostates by who?

We can't believe the history from the RCC, most of it is contrary to Scripture.

If we can't believe most of it, then we can't believe any of it!

 

[Cathode]

Cathode only has commentary from a bunch of apostates to prove his apostolic succession.

They were made into apostates by who?

By you apparently.

Is Clement an apostate?

Clement ordained by Peter himself, co-labourer of Paul mentioned in Scripture, martyred by drowning under Trajan. Apostate ?

Clement lived and learned and worked with Peter and Paul and personally knew them.

Look at what he says about Apostolic succession, he outlines Apostolic succession perfectly for you.

 

[Cathode]

We can't believe the history from the RCC, most of it is contrary to Scripture.

If we can't believe most of it, then we can't believe any of it!

It’s not that you can’t believe the history, it’s that you won’t believe it. Being convinced by the truth would be a betrayal of the errors you have been taught.

And No, Catholicism is contrary to your misunderstandings and misinterpretations of scripture, by human traditions, privately interpreting error, till the Fathers are aliens to them.

Catholicism is biblical Christianity, all the scriptures were preserved from the Apostles by the Catholic Church who determined the Canon of the Bible in the first place, and preserved all the writings of the Fathers and martyrs as well.

 

[Charlie24]

By you apparently.

Is Clement an apostate?

Clement ordained by Peter himself, co-labourer of Paul mentioned in Scripture, martyred by drowning under Trajan. Apostate ?

Clement lived and learned and worked with Peter and Paul and personally knew them.

Look at what he says about Apostolic succession, he outlines Apostolic succession perfectly for you.

No, I certainly don't believe he was an apostate!

I believe the apostates to be the ones who rearranged his words, as they did in many cases.

History can be whatever the Catholics say it is, considering the inspired Word of God left off in the 1st century.

Such things as Mary being taken into heaven without dying.

And all of a sudden Mary is our intercessor to Christ, to help Him listen to us.

 

[Cathode]

No, I certainly don't believe he was an apostate!

I believe the apostates to be the ones who rearranged his words, as they did in many cases.

History can be whatever the Catholics say it is, considering the inspired Word of God left off in the 1st century.

What you are encountering is authentic Early Christian belief and interpretation of Scripture for the first time, and it doesn’t square with the new human founded interpretations and doctrines you have been taught.

It is not in our interests to rearrange anything of our Catholic history, these are precious artefacts long preserved before Protestantism existed.
It is however very much in the interests of those who have no history before Luther to ignore the history, condemn the Fathers and reinterpret them to justify their unbelief.

 

[JesusFan]

A Baptist pastor attending a Catholic exorcism was asked if he needed confession among others. One guy said he wanted to go to confession and did, but the Baptist said he confessed directly to God. The others thought the guys response a little strange. The Baptist had asked the priest if he could attend a Catholic Exorcism to see how it was done.

Once the Exorcism began, the demon manifested and locked onto the Baptist and said that since the His baptism at the age of 12, he had committed over 600 mortal sins that he had not confessed and began to name them off in quick succession.

Where Confession is very necessary is before Exorcisms and this is because demons see the mortal sins of those present and name them. They can also harm those not in a state of Grace.

One of the disturbing things about the Protestant rebellion, is the loss of the ministry of reconciliation, where Protestants do not have this Apostolic sacrament available to them anymore if they commit mortal sins. So they accumulate these sins on their souls.

Their change of theology does not even teach about mortal sin, it’s a doctrine their forefathers rejected, so it is completely alien to them. The new doctrine of OSAS definitely doesn’t inform people about mortal sin or the necessity of Confession, in this theology they count themselves saved already.

In street ministry we have seen the same, possessed people naming the sins of others and making their claim on them.
The demons can not see sin on those who have gone to confession and are in a state of Grace. People in a state of Grace are a pain for them to be near.

“In addition to these there is also a seventh, albeit hard and laborious: the remission of sins through penance…when he does not shrink from declaring his sin to a priest of the Lord.” Origen, Homilies on Leviticus, 2:4 (A.D. 248).

“Moreover, how much are they both greater in faith and better in their fear, who, although bound by no crime of sacrifice to idols or of certificate, yet, since they have even thought of such things, with grief and simplicity confess this very thing to God’s priests, and make the conscientious avowal, put off from them the load of their minds, and seek out the salutary medicine even for slight and moderate wounds, knowing that it is written, ‘God is not mocked.’ God cannot be mocked, nor deceived, nor deluded by any deceptive cunning. Yea, he sins the more, who, thinking that God is like man, believes that he evades the penalty of his crime if he has not openly admitted his crime…I entreat you, beloved brethren, that each one should confess his own sin, while he who has sinned is still in this world, while his confession may be received, while the satisfaction and remission made by the priests are pleasing to the Lord?” Cyprian, To the Lapsed, 28-29 (A.D. 251).

“It is necessary to confess our sins to those whom the dispensation of God’s mysteries is entrusted.” Basil, Rule Briefly Treated, 288 (A.D. 374).

“These are capital sins, brethren, these are mortal.” Pacian of Barcelona, Penance, 4 (A.D. 385).

There are NO such things as mortal sins in the bible, as all sins against God would be major and mortal, but thanks be to God we have full forgiveness right now being washed in the blood of the Lord Jesus

 

[JesusFan]

For mortal sins, either perfect contrition is needed or Absolution from an Apostolic Successor.

If you have perfect contrition directly to God you will be forgiven and restored to a state of Grace. But you will not know it for sure, and thats only if you have perfect contrition.

However with Apostolic absolution, your contrition does not need to be perfect and you may only have a fear of Hell for instance. But you will know for sure because it has been declared by the priest who forgives sin in the Person of Christ.
The power of forgiving or retaining sin is God breathed on the Apostles as God breathed life into Adam, the Apostolic ministry restores life to those who have fallen into grievous sin.

That is why confession is the sure way to restore people back to a state of Grace.

“All mortal sins are to be submitted to the keys of the Church and all can be forgiven; but recourse to these keys is the only, the necessary, and the certain way to forgiveness. Unless those who are guilty of grievous sin have recourse to the power of the keys, they cannot hope for eternal salvation. Open your lips, them, and confess your sins to the priest. Confession alone is the true gate to Heaven.” Augustine, Christian Combat (A.D. 397).

“Just as in the Old Testament the priest makes the leper clean or unclean, so in the New Testament the bishop and presbyter binds or looses not those who are innocent or guilty, but by reason of their office, when they have heard various kinds of sins, they know who is to be bound and who loosed.” Jerome, Commentary on Matthew, 3:16,19 (A.D. 398).

This highlight the bogus false gospel of Rome, as NONE have perfect anything even after saved as judged by God moral perfection, and we go to Jesus ALONE to have sins cleaned, not to any mere man

 

[Cathode]

There are NO such things as mortal sins in the bible, as all sins against God would be major and mortal, but thanks be to God we have full forgiveness right now being washed in the blood of the Lord Jesus

Yes there are, and ignorance doesn’t help.

 

[JesusFan]

Yes there are, and ignorance doesn’t help.

The blood of Jesus fully cleanses us from all sins, correct?

 

[Cathode]

This highlight the bogus false gospel of Rome, as NONE have perfect anything even after saved as judged by God moral perfection, and we go to Jesus ALONE to have sins cleaned, not to any mere man

Unscriptural, confessing your sin to others is explicit. The Early Church practiced public confession before the Elders.

“ Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power and is effective “

 

[Cathode]

The blood of Jesus fully cleanses us from all sins, correct?

Sure, if you confess your sins.

 

[JesusFan]

Sure, if you confess your sins.

Confession is to be made to God alone, as Jesus alone is the great High Priest