Constitution Party

[ballfan]

Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by ballfan:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:

Kerry would probably do less damage, because the GOP congress would stop him from implemetnig Bush's liberal Democrat agenda. I no longer practice "lesser evil" voting, but if I did I'd cast my vote for Kerry. But I won't.

So you would vote for someone who openly supports something as evil as partial birth abortion over someone who clearly doesn't support it. </font>[/QUOTE]Can't you read, or do you just make up things to suit your argument? I clearly said that I would not vote for Kerry. [/QB]</font>[/QUOTE]This falls into the catagory you called "but if I did". You would favor someone who openly supports partial birth abortion over someone who openly opposes it.

Your vote is really a "hate Bush" vote isn't it. Abortion has nothing to do with it as you've now made clear.

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Why do you distort my viewpoint? Can't you debate the truth, instead of making unfounded accusations?

You have accused me of advocating a vote for Kerry, which is clearly not the case.

You have judged my heart as to both hatred toward a man, and indifference toward the thousands of babies who are killed every day.

Both are unfair, and untrue.

Why are you treating methis way?

 

[LadyEagle]

Many Bushies are clouded by FEAR - FEAR that Kerry will win. (So much for faith in God having it all under control...)

 

[Hardsheller]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
Many Bushies are clouded by FEAR - FEAR that Kerry will win. (So much for faith in God having it all under control...)

Sorry LadyEagle,

Fear does not enter into the equation.

I got over FEAR during 8 years of Bill Clinton!

 

[LadyEagle]

 

[ballfan]

Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
Why do you distort my viewpoint? Can't you debate the truth, instead of making unfounded accusations?

You have accused me of advocating a vote for Kerry, which is clearly not the case.

You have judged my heart as to both hatred toward a man, and indifference toward the thousands of babies who are killed every day.

Both are unfair, and untrue.

Why are you treating methis way?

No, I've not accused you of advocating a vote for Kerry. Not once. You're the one that said "I no longer practice "lesser evil" voting, but if I did I'd cast my vote for Kerry." If it came right down to it you would pick Kerry over Bush even though Kerry openly supports something extremely evil. That tells me your opposition to Bush rests somewhere other than abortion because I feel your views on abortion are most likely more aligned with those of Bush than of Kerry. It wouldn't surprise me to find out your view on abortion and Bushes view are almost if not identical.

I know you like the CP candidate. He won't be able to do any more on abortion than Bush has. Whats more despite his rhetoric he also knows it.

Your opposition to Bush lies somewhere else.

I think what has happened might be you've bought into the liberal "hate Bush" stuff from the media.

 

[Gina B]

This thread is accomplishing nothing but hostility. I'll give it a few more posts and hopefully it will straighten up, but if it doesn't it will be closed the next time I visit. Please review the agreement at the top of the politics forum.
Gina

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Ballfan,

Bush doesn't even have abortion on his agenda. Check his official website. He has avoided the issue excepf for the few times it has been shoved in his face, and then his actions did not save a single baby.

Bush simply gives false hope, and saps the energy of the pro-life movement, while doing nothing to solve the problem.

4000 babies are being killed daily. Why are we so patient...could it be because we're safe?

I will not accuse you of not caring about abortion, as you have me. But I will say that a vote for Bush will prolong the problem rather than solve it. You intend otherwise, but I say intentions will not help.

 

[ballfan]

Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
Ballfan,

Bush doesn't even have abortion on his agenda. Check his official website. He has avoided the issue excepf for the few times it has been shoved in his face, and then his actions did not save a single baby.

Bush simply gives false hope, and saps the energy of the pro-life movement, while doing nothing to solve the problem.

4000 babies are being killed daily. Why are we so patient...could it be because we're safe?

I will not accuse you of not caring about abortion, as you have me. But I will say that a vote for Bush will prolong the problem rather than solve it. You intend otherwise, but I say intentions will not help.

Did you try a search on his site. Only 119 documents on abortion come up.

23 come up on Kerrys site.

50 on Peroutka's page.

http://www.nrlc.org/abortion/pba/pbafact8.html

http://www.layman.org/layman/the-layman/2003/no1-feb-2003/partial-birth-abortions.htm

http://www.nrlc.org/abortion/pba/PBAtrial032904.html

Intentions are great. Everybody has some. They won't help the CP candidate either. Neither could he stop abortion simply by edict if he did manage to get elected to office. But he knows saying it sounds good and a certain number of people will actually believe he can.

Bush though has actually made an attempt to begin to limit abortion. Not just talk but action.

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Anybody can link abortion articles. Look at his agenda. It outlines all of his plans. Abortion doesn't come up. He's done nothing of substance, has taken NO ACTION that has resulted in the outlawing of ONE SINGLE ABORTION in FOUR YEARS.

If you're satisfied with that, it's your priveledge. BUT DON'T QUESTION MY HEART FOR THE UNBORN BECAUSE I FIND IT UNACCEPTABLE! EVER.

 

[ballfan]

Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
Anybody can link abortion articles. Look at his agenda. It outlines all of his plans. Abortion doesn't come up. He's done nothing of substance, has taken NO ACTION that has resulted in the outlawing of ONE SINGLE ABORTION in FOUR YEARS.

If you're satisfied with that, it's your priveledge. BUT DON'T QUESTION MY HEART FOR THE UNBORN BECAUSE I FIND IT UNACCEPTABLE! EVER.

Bush asked for and then signed the ban on partial birth abortion. You act like he didn't. Can you not even recognize what he did and give him credit for doing it?

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

OK, here goes: Bush signed the PBA ban. Satisfied?

The PBA ban was immediately tied up in courts, and Bush instructed his administration not to aggressively fight it.

The PBA ban has not saved ONE baby. Even if it were law, it would simply instruct to kill the baby by a more brutal process, just not with its head delivered. Poor child.

The worst effect of the PBA ban is that it was a "low cost" measure, politically, that provided cover for fake "pro-life" politicians, who will use pro-life voted to get elected, and then DO NOTHING THAT WILL OUTLAW ABORTION for another entire term. One step closer to their big pension checks.

It has been going this way for 31 years, while the most innocent among us are murdered without protection. How long will we allow them to play the game?

 

[ballfan]

Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
OK, here goes: Bush signed the PBA ban. Satisfied?

The PBA ban was immediately tied up in courts, and Bush instructed his administration not to aggressively fight it.

The PBA ban has not saved ONE baby. Even if it were law, it would simply instruct to kill the baby by a more brutal process, just not with its head delivered. Poor child.

The worst effect of the PBA ban is that it was a "low cost" measure, politically, that provided cover for fake "pro-life" politicians, who will use pro-life voted to get elected, and then DO NOTHING THAT WILL OUTLAW ABORTION for another entire term. One step closer to their big pension checks.

It has been going this way for 31 years, while the most innocent among us are murdered without protection. How long will we allow them to play the game?

Do you think he was right in signing the partial birth abortion ban?

Bush can't tell judges what to do. Neither can the CP candidate. Its going to take a constitutional amendment. Something that can't be done under currenr circumstances. But elect enough Republicans and it might.

 

[dianetavegia]

PaJim, I would like to think that the PBA law HAS saved babies because the publicity educated some young women to what was going to be done to their innocent baby. Of course, only those women know what was planned in their hearts to do, but I'd like to think some hearts have been softened.

 

[JGrubbs]

As PJ pointed out the PBA ban would not have saved a single life, even if the courts didn't block it. The law was nothing more than a smoke screen to keep the pro-life voters happy. If the PBA ban is all Bush has to claim as fighting to end abortion in American, then I consider that a pretty weak claim.

I will conceed that as Diane has pointed out that some women may have had a change of heart after hearing about the methods they use to butcher the baby during a PBA, but it is a very small percentage of abortions performed, so while this small percentage has been changed, the current administration has done nothing to end the rest of the abortions being performed daily in America.

I find it simply amazing that now that all of the original reasons for invading Iraq have been shown false, the administration is "justifying" the invasion based on the fact that Saddam was killing people. If that is the only justification for launching a war, then I would expect the administration to launch a war on abortion here in the US, where we have butchered more babies that Saddam ever has.

 

[church mouse guy]

Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
CMG, try to get some rest, maybe your head will clear up. Ihope you get better.

You and NetPub should be the ones to go into obsecurity for supporting the likes of the Constitution Party. You know very well that your candidate has tried to undercut the war by saying without proof that it is illegal. Furthermore, your candidate has said "let them eat cake" to the hungry of the world.

Your reply to these issues and others as merely been a repeated personal attack on me. That is because the Constitution Party bosses do not stand and discuss issue but instead issue bullying insults to anyone who dares to question them and their Godly candidate. Voters should read these endless Constitution Party threads for themselves and see the cold-blooded, selfish nature of the Constitution Party political stands. And they should read how the Constitution Party bosses personally attack anyone who disagrees with them. You may be holy but your ideas are very unholy and your tactics are mere bullying. Your insults about your false concern for my well-being prove your bullying tactics for all to see. But then I am sure that you will say that you do everything in the name of Jesus and so you are justified.

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Originally posted by dianetavegia:
PaJim, I would like to think that the PBA law HAS saved babies because the publicity educated some young women to what was going to be done to their innocent baby. Of course, only those women know what was planned in their hearts to do, but I'd like to think some hearts have been softened.

I agree..but if you think about it, there is no conflict between what you have said and Bill Clinton's policy that abortion should be "safe, legal, and rare". I'm not saying that you agree with that...but I am saying that I hope your position goes far beyond what you stated, and what Mr. Bush has willfully failed to do.

 

[Pennsylvania Jim]

Originally posted by JGrubbs:
... If that is the only justification for launching a war, then I would expect the administration to launch a war on abortion here in the US, where we have butchered more babies that Saddam ever has.

Ever see an unborn baby drill an oil well or sign a construction contract?

 

[JGrubbs]

Originally posted by church mouse guy:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
CMG, try to get some rest, maybe your head will clear up. Ihope you get better.

You and NetPub should be the ones to go into obsecurity for supporting the likes of the Constitution Party. You know very well that your candidate has tried to undercut the war by saying without proof that it is illegal. Furthermore, your candidate has said "let them eat cake" to the hungry of the world.

Your reply to these issues and others as merely been a repeated personal attack on me. That is because the Constitution Party bosses do not stand and discuss issue but instead issue bullying insults to anyone who dares to question them and their Godly candidate. Voters should read these endless Constitution Party threads for themselves and see the cold-blooded, selfish nature of the Constitution Party political stands. And they should read how the Constitution Party bosses personally attack anyone who disagrees with them. You may be holy but your ideas are very unholy and your tactics are mere bullying. Your insults about your false concern for my well-being prove your bullying tactics for all to see. But then I am sure that you will say that you do everything in the name of Jesus and so you are justified. </font>[/QUOTE]The problem with your argument that my candidate "has tried to undercut the war" is that I agree with him and all of the other people who have said the same thing. There are even some GOP members of Congress who agree, and voted against the illegal invasion of Iraq.

You complain about the Constitution Party's policy of abiding by the US Constitution. It's not our fault you don't understand the US Constitution and would rather support socialism.

Can you name one of the Constitution Party "bosses" who have personally attacked anyone?

 

[Hardsheller]

Originally posted by ballfan:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Pennsylvania Jim:
OK, here goes: Bush signed the PBA ban. Satisfied?

The PBA ban was immediately tied up in courts, and Bush instructed his administration not to aggressively fight it.

The PBA ban has not saved ONE baby. Even if it were law, it would simply instruct to kill the baby by a more brutal process, just not with its head delivered. Poor child.

The worst effect of the PBA ban is that it was a "low cost" measure, politically, that provided cover for fake "pro-life" politicians, who will use pro-life voted to get elected, and then DO NOTHING THAT WILL OUTLAW ABORTION for another entire term. One step closer to their big pension checks.

It has been going this way for 31 years, while the most innocent among us are murdered without protection. How long will we allow them to play the game?

Do you think he was right in signing the partial birth abortion ban?

Bush can't tell judges what to do. Neither can the CP candidate. Its going to take a constitutional amendment. Something that can't be done under currenr circumstances. But elect enough Republicans and it might. </font>[/QUOTE]But Ballfan,

That's not what the CP'ers want. They want a benevolent "Hitler". A dictator who will make all the "right" choices that agree with their political positions. To heck with American Ideals and Political Debate and Democracy - "This is what we want and we're gonna have it."

This kind of mindset is in my opinion much more dangerous than the Democratic Mindset or the Republican Mindset.

And think for a minute. Who did M. Peroutka choose for a running mate? An Independent Baptist Preacher! Would you want an Independent Baptist Preacher a heartbeat away from the Presidency?

Keep in mind the average Independent Baptist Preacher's Mindset.

1. The Preacher is the Boss
2. The Preacher is in Charge of the Money
3. The Preacher Tells the Congregation what to do.
4. There are no Committees under the Preacher that have authority to do anything without his approval.
5. The Preacher has veto power of everything a churchmember does.

You think the Presidents we've had in the past have abused their executive power. You would long for the days of Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon if an Independent Baptist Preacher with the Average Independent Baptist Preacher's Mindset inherited the Presidency.