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Could Jesus Do Things the Father and Holy Spirit could not do?

V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
robycop3 said:
Jesus said, "My Father is greater than I."
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The Trinitarian view is Jesus was talking about Himself as a human, not as the co-equal God the Son. But, of course, God the Son takes direction from God the Father, who sent Him. (John 12:49)
 
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SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
Van said:
The Trinitarian view is Jesus was talking about Himself as a human, not as the co-equal God the Son. But, of course, God the Son takes direction from God the Father, who sent Him.
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Van, I say this again, your Christology is way off what the Bible actually says
 
Larry the Logger

Larry the Logger

Member
robycop3 said:
Yes, if Yahweh (The Father) so willed. However, He assigned that to Jesus.
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Well, if the Father had so willed to grab the scrolls and said, "Here, I'll do it. John, stop your belly aching. I'll declare Myself worthy. There, done, now step aside," He would have broken His covenant, broken His promises, rendered 1 Cor 15:1-4 utterly meaningless along with Lam 3:22-23, not to mention completely breaking His promise to the serpent, rendering the entire Word of His utterly useless, not to mention the time and trouble He took to get it written and preserved, but yes, God can do whatever He wants. He could vaporize us all, yet He doesn't and who would argue with Him, who would "turn Him in" if He decided this whole deliverance thing was boring? OR, maybe rethinking your quick answer might be in order?
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
Van said:
John 12:49 :)
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New King James Version John 5:17-23 But Jesus answered them, “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. Then Jesus answered and said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, but what He sees the Father do; for whatever He does, the Son also does in like manner. For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself does; and He will show Him greater works than these, that you may marvel. For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will. For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.
 
V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
SavedByGrace said:
New King James Version John 5:17-23 But Jesus answered them, “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. Then Jesus answered and said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, but what He sees the Father do; for whatever He does, the Son also does in like manner. For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself does; and He will show Him greater works than these, that you may marvel. For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will. For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.
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Thanks for accepting biblical Christology, once I explained it to you.
 
robycop3

robycop3

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Larry the Logger said:
Well, if the Father had so willed to grab the scrolls and said, "Here, I'll do it. John, stop your belly aching. I'll declare Myself worthy. There, done, now step aside," He would have broken His covenant, broken His promises, rendered 1 Cor 15:1-4 utterly meaningless along with Lam 3:22-23, not to mention completely breaking His promise to the serpent, rendering the entire Word of His utterly useless, not to mention the time and trouble He took to get it written and preserved, but yes, God can do whatever He wants. He could vaporize us all, yet He doesn't and who would argue with Him, who would "turn Him in" if He decided this whole deliverance thing was boring? OR, maybe rethinking your quick answer might be in order?
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The Father Yahweh did what He did, at His will. Who's to argue with Him?
 
V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
SavedByGrace said:
You still can't grasp it
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Only empty suits post "taint so" and "you do not know" malarkey.

Each Person of the Trinity shares the experiences of the other two Persons, thus co-equal in their understanding of Christ's experiences.
 
robycop3

robycop3

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
SavedByGrace said:
Look at verses 28 and 29 and you will see that the "unity" Jesus is speaking about is in power security and the source of all life. Which is only possible for someone Who is co-equal with the Father
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But His Father sent Him; He said He came to do HIS FATHER'S will. As the time drew near for His "passion, He prayed that His Father's will be done, not His own. And, of course, he prayed many times before that. The one being prayed to is always greater than he/she who prays.
 
37818

37818

Well-Known Member
All three Persons are the one and the same God, so as such are co-equal and co-eternal being the One God.

Suborndination? Subordination where it is, is in the language. If there is no subordination then the language is a lie.
 
37818

37818

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
The Father is uncreated,
the Son is uncreated,
the Holy Spirit is uncreated.

The Father is immeasurable,
the Son is immeasurable,
the Holy Spirit is immeasurable.

The Father is eternal,
the Son is eternal,
the Holy Spirit is eternal.
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They being the One and the same God, YHWH.
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
robycop3 said:
But His Father sent Him; He said He came to do HIS FATHER'S will. As the time drew near for His "passion, He prayed that His Father's will be done, not His own. And, of course, he prayed many times before that. The one being prayed to is always greater than he/she who prays.
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Jesus' being "sent" by the Father has nothing to do with His being an inferior Person to the Father at any time. Jesus made it very clear throughout His Ministry on earth, that He came to do everything in harmony with God the Father, and that they worked together in everything, which is exactly what Jesus says in John 5:17, "But Jesus answered them, “My Father is working until now, and I am working.”. To which the Jews responded, "This was why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill him, because not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God." (verse 18). Jesus' Authority on earth, was the same as the Father's Authority. He never acted on His own, because He and the Father are always ONE! . Much of what Jesus said and did was for the benefit of those around Him, like we read in John 11, "And Jesus lifted up His eyes and said, “Father, I thank You that You have heard Me. And I know that You always hear Me, but because of the people who are standing by I said this, that they may believe that You sent Me.” (41-42). There is not Scriptual teaching, that just because Jesus or the Holy Spirit, Who are "sent", means that they are "inferior" to the Father, or the Father is "superior" to them.
 
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