Could Life exist on Mars?

[quantumfaith]

Agreed 100%....:thumbsup::wavey::thumbs: If Abiogenesis (from a materialistic perspective) is even POSSIBLE...than it stands to reason that lifeforms with completely different needs would/could have evolved. They have not. Why the necessity for water? Or oxygen? or even "relatively" stable temperatures? I do not personally believe there is physical life anywhere (or of any kind) other than on Earth...But we do not know for sure...Scripture is simply silent on the issue. I do not think anyone can use the Scriptures to be dogmatic about it either way. The creation account says nothing whatsoever ( and that means for or against) about the possibility of other life-forms.

However, I personally find it to be highly un-likely.

I have always been intrigued by the phrase in the creation narrative, "let the earth bring forth vegetation", it seems to imply that earth was created in such a way as "produce life", obviously under the command, direction and discretion of YHWH.

 

[Benjamin]

If life were discovered to have existed on Mars it would not affect my faith in any way, but it would surely give rise for me to revisit many thoughts about God’s creation and purposes and to look at it in a new perspective. Like revisiting:

The gap theory, (1) In the beginning God created the heaven and earth (BTW these bodies appear singular here) and the earth was (2) without form and void (denoting a time between or…) until the Spirit of God moved upon the face the waters. (Also “heaven” and “earth” would not necessarily be a singular or unique creation, so there multiple creations?)

In the beginning, so there were other beginnings? Other points that time began in other places? Do other planets even have a beginning with time or must time even exist there? What happens to time if those who are in time come upon a place that is not or of a different time?

God moved upon the face or the waters, so does God always form a beginning of life upon waters? Sometimes moves upon the waters to begin life but not necessarily? Could there be a planet with life consisting of only water or only land, and why not if God were going about designing different forms of life? Could they be liquid creatures that breath dirt? :laugh:

Do other worlds have light and darkness? Is it even necessary and does it have purpose? What happens to the relationship of light and dark, which is associated with time, good and evil, and Jesus being Light?

If there is other life does that open the door to that there may be intelligent life and if so what effect does good and evil have there, if any? Is there no divine judgment for the intelligent life there and is there no opportunity of grace? Did the One and Only Begotten die to pay for the evil there too? Did He die only here for there or there too?

What about all the Truths of God? That He is Love and Just? Does it fit His character that He would create other intelligent life with the ability to have sense and reason while foregoing His judgment against evil? Did God make another kind of promise of redemption before the foundation of other living worlds? Did He not breath into the those intelligent creatures a spirit of life and do they have no soul?

1. I really don’t think other life adds up to what we know of God, our One God!…

2. Can anyone even think of a practical reason why God would have other life elsewhere?

3. God is Truth, could God do these things (create other intelligent life) and be true to His Nature as we know it?

 

[quantumfaith]

If life were discovered to have existed on Mars it would not affect my faith in any way, but it would surely give rise for me to revisit many thoughts about God’s creation and purposes and to look at it in a new perspective. Like revisiting:

The gap theory, (1) In the beginning God created the heaven and earth (BTW these bodies appear singular here) and the earth was (2) without form and void (denoting a time between or…) until the Spirit of God moved upon the face the waters. (Also “heaven” and “earth” would not necessarily be a singular or unique creation, so there multiple creations?)

In the beginning, so there were other beginnings? Other points that time began in other places? Do other planets even have a beginning with time or must time even exist there? What happens to time if those who are in time come upon a place that is not or of a different time?

God moved upon the face or the waters, so does God always form a beginning of life upon waters? Sometimes moves upon the waters to begin life but not necessarily? Could there be a planet with life consisting of only water or only land, and why not if God were going about designing different forms of life? Could they be liquid creatures that breath dirt? :laugh:

Do other worlds have light and darkness? Is it even necessary and does it have purpose? What happens to the relationship of light and dark, which is associated with time, good and evil, and Jesus being Light?

If there is other life does that open the door to that there may be intelligent life and if so what effect does good and evil have there, if any? Is there no divine judgment for the intelligent life there and is there no opportunity of grace? Did the One and Only Begotten die to pay for the evil there too? Did He die only here for there or there too?

What about all the Truths of God? That He is Love and Just? Does it fit His character that He would create other intelligent life with the ability to have sense and reason while foregoing His judgment against evil? Did God make another kind of promise of redemption before the foundation of other living worlds? Did He not breath into the those intelligent creatures a spirit of life and do they have no soul?

1. I really don’t think other life adds up to what we know of God, our One God!…

2. Can anyone even think of a practical reason why God would have other life elsewhere?

3. God is Truth, could God do these things (create other intelligent life) and be true to His Nature as we know it?

Benjamin, I don't understand your statement regarding "In the beginnig". In my mind a simple reference to the creation and origin of the entire universe, I guess I don't understand why "discovery of other life" would call that into question for you.

If there exists other sentient, rational intelligent life in the universe, then yes of course they were creatures of God as well. As to their "disposition" we are told nothing.

 

[Cypress]

We and the universe we observe might be small enough to be invisible to the eye of some other life created by God. If an amoeba were self aware, he might well consider himself to be rather large. In other words absent direct revelation, I cant rule out life elsewhere.

 

[righteousdude2]

Life on Mars - How Absurd?

Look.....many will disagree with this, but, what difference would life on Mars make to what you believe?

It should be none!

Now, I am not going to allow the box many folks live in order to inhibit my thoughts on the following: God is infinite and without imagination or ability. With that said. There is no reason to believe that we are the soul proprietor of this massive, unlimited universe.

I'd love to add that if God saw in His infinite wisdom, to create earth, why should you, and I be foolish enough to limit Him from doing the same, in His image, elsewhere?

I believe, that if someone will show up next week from another rock zillions of light-years from here, my faith would not be shaken, because if He created all we see and the universe to boot, then life from elsewhere would also have to be in His image, and not so "Alien" to us.

So, if Courosity finds pay dirt, who cares....I don't. I know what I believe and hold faith in, and that is all that matters...

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Look.....many will disagree with this, but, what difference would life on Mars make to what you believe?

It should be none!

Now, I am not going to allow the box many folks live in order to inhibit my thoughts on the following: God is infinite and without imagination or ability. With that said. There is no reason to believe that we are the soul proprietor of this massive, unlimited universe.

I'd love to add that if God saw in His infinite wisdom, to create earth, why should you, and I be foolish enough to limit Him from doing the same, in His image, elsewhere?

I believe, that if someone will show up next week from another rock zillions of light-years from here, my faith would not be shaken, because if He created all we see and the universe to boot, then life from elsewhere would also have to be in His image, and not so "Alien" to us.

So, if Courosity finds pay dirt, who cares....I don't. I know what I believe and hold faith in, and that is all that matters...

Very nicely said, bro.

 

[Benjamin]

Benjamin, I don't understand your statement regarding "In the beginnig". In my mind a simple reference to the creation and origin of the entire universe, I guess I don't understand why "discovery of other life" would call that into question for you.

Say, it were possible (I don’t think other life is possible because I believe God is 100% Truth and has given us an account of the beginning of creation, besides that I believe He is all about Love and meaningless life is just that - meaningless. Further, that the Truth of Him and Him being Love can and must be known, but I'm getting off into another subject) but just say it possible that life once existed on Mars and now it has past, this life began long before us and for that matter ended before us. Another time of life.

Sooo, did God then create 2 (or even more) "beginnings" of creation where before us He moved upon the waters of Mars to create life? In another time? Or was it a time (gap) between the time he moved upon the waters of Mars and that of Earth? Surely, even if it could be interpreted the beginning of creation included multiples earths and heavens in different galaxies or universes, or something, our Earth and Mars are created in the same time period. But now we would have different times of when life existed and different beginnings within the same unit of creation. Hence, more than one beginning.

No, I think we have one foundation upon which the world (universe) and life was created and one beginning of time. Within that foundation of creation is the promise made of Jesus Christ in which are told of God’s purpose (How He so loved the world He created He gave His ONLY (singular) Begotten) and what about the bringing of Light He brought into the world in which He created. So what happens to this foundational promise made before creation if other life, especially intelligent life exists elsewhere, multiple beginnings, times and in different places? It simply doesn’t add up to what we are told of God, His purposes and account of creation; I don’t see how what we have been told could remain as truth (again, I believe God to be 100% Truth by Nature and a belief in truth as necessity ingredient of faith).

On a side note, I could except a gap of time between when the heavens and earth was created and that of when God moved over the waters and created life, but a gap between periods of time that He moved to create life? BTW, I don’t see any way a YEC could even begin to hold his view on creation and except another life on another planet at another time and continue to try to hold to their literalist view. They will not accept a gap between creation of the world and life but will except a gap between creation of life(s)??? I’m not YEC and see the possibility of a gap between the creation of the world and that of life, but except a gap of time between multiple creation(s) of life(s)?!? Very problematic people!!! Doesn’t add up in any way with any of the things I have mentioned about “the” beginning of divinely designed creation of life and God's foundational plan of which we are told in truth. I believe there to only be one beginning in creation and that includes a singular beginning of time.

 

[Arbo]

So, if Courosity finds pay dirt, who cares....I don't. I know what I believe and hold faith in, and that is all that matters...

:thumbs: The God of heaven and earth is the God of Mars as well.

 

[quantumfaith]

Look.....many will disagree with this, but, what difference would life on Mars make to what you believe?

It should be none!

Now, I am not going to allow the box many folks live in order to inhibit my thoughts on the following: God is infinite and without imagination or ability. With that said. There is no reason to believe that we are the soul proprietor of this massive, unlimited universe.

I'd love to add that if God saw in His infinite wisdom, to create earth, why should you, and I be foolish enough to limit Him from doing the same, in His image, elsewhere?

I believe, that if someone will show up next week from another rock zillions of light-years from here, my faith would not be shaken, because if He created all we see and the universe to boot, then life from elsewhere would also have to be in His image, and not so "Alien" to us.

So, if Courosity finds pay dirt, who cares....I don't. I know what I believe and hold faith in, and that is all that matters...

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[Benjamin]

I’m pretty confident there will be no life found on Mars or anywhere else for that matter because I see logic and truth coinciding together throughout God’s Word and I don’t see any logical reasoning whatsoever in other life existing adding up according to what we have been told of creation.

I've shown how I come to my conclusions and asked some questions and answered some questions with little to no response. I must admit I'm a bit surprised to hear some of my brothers here who think it depends on whether all the necessary ingredients were there. I once heard a pastor preach that he thought a lot of people were w-i-m-p-i-n-g out on holding to the Biblical account of creation because they feared science might prove their philosophy wrong..hmm....m-i-g-h-t be r-i-g-h-t....:smilewinkgrin:

So what “if” other life were to be found? Well then, there would have to be a way to explain it so that it made some kind of sense, and since God will not deal us with more than we could bare then I trust He will be letting me in on how some of these possibilities would work and these little green men which I would have to see my own eyes could exist so that I don’t go crazy.

 

[Yeshua1]

Benjamin, I don't understand your statement regarding "In the beginnig". In my mind a simple reference to the creation and origin of the entire universe, I guess I don't understand why "discovery of other life" would call that into question for you.

If there exists other sentient, rational intelligent life in the universe, then yes of course they were creatures of God as well. As to their "disposition" we are told nothing.

Think point is that unless God specially created life, there would be NONE to ever arise, as life cannot come into existence apart from a specific act of God!

And the Bible does seem to indicate that ONLY earth was chosen to him to have created life upon it, and mankind is His crwoning achievement. beings made in his own image!

 

[Sapper Woody]

There have been a lot of posts in this thread that don't add to the discussion at all, even though the authors of the posts think that they do. When the question is asked, "Could life exist on Mars?", the answer "Who cares?" does not help. Further in, the answer "Only if God wanted it there" or "Only if God created it" doesn't help either. I don't think anyone is debating that it could have evolved there.

Another answer that I am having a problem with is "It would be pointless for God to have put it there" or "It would be illogical. Pointless or illogical to us, maybe. But I personally do not presume to be able to read God's mind.

I don’t think other life is possible because I believe God is 100% Truth and has given us an account of the beginning of creation

What I am getting from this statement is that you say that if GOd had created it, he would have had to tell us about it, to tell 100% of the truth. Well, God didn't tell us about a lot of things, He just lumped them in as a group. Bacterium, for instance. They are just lumped in with the other animals. Just because God doesn't explicitly say that He created something, doesn't mean that He didn't. After all, for Him to tell the "whole" truth, wouldn't He have had to explain things better? Light, for example. He just said that He created it. He didn't say how it worked, or what it was. He just said that He created it.

Now, I have already stated that I don't think sentient life will be found elsewhere. It's possible, but I think improbable due to God having to supply a seperate salvation plan, etc, for this other "race". However, I see no reason that other organisms (especially microscopic) couldn't have been created by God and placed on other planets, even other systems.

The fact of the matter is, that scripture is silent on the matter. And we don't have enough scientific evidence one way or the other to know. So, it's definitely not out of the question.

BTW, "Curiosity" is not the first rover we've had on Mars. It's the third. And we haven't found any evidence of life yet. But that's just one planet, in one system, in one galaxy, in the whole universe.

 

[Amy.G]

I think there could be life on Mars or anywhere else in the universe for that matter. God is creator, architect, and artist of all creation and as such it would be make sense that His finger prints are everywhere. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Jim1999]

"exist" is the keyword. Yes, life, as we know it, can "exist", but it is contingent on earthly measures for its continuance.

All those who have ventured out into space, have had considerable readjustment when they returned to earth.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Benjamin]

There have been a lot of posts in this thread that don't add to the discussion at all, even though the authors of the posts think that they do. When the question is asked, "Could life exist on Mars?", the answer "Who cares?" does not help. Further in, the answer "Only if God wanted it there" or "Only if God created it" doesn't help either. I don't think anyone is debating that it could have evolved there.

Which is why I wonder then why would having all necessary ingredients would make any difference whatsoever? Like I said, if all the ingredients for cement were there I wouldn't give that one iota of credible reasoning toward that I could expect to find concrete structures there.

Another answer that I am having a problem with is "It would be pointless for God to have put it there" or "It would be illogical. Pointless or illogical to us, maybe. But I personally do not presume to be able to read God's mind.

I've made claims and asked as to how the point of other life could add up truthfully given what we told of the beginning of creation and that logical reasoning and belief in truth (faith) go hand in hand, for without reasoning for truth there is not reason to believe, have faith. (It is my belief God is Truth so love of truth can be known by reasoning) Probably shouldn't have brought that up because it gets into a whole other involed subject relating to logic.

But I personally do not presume to be able to read God's mind.

But, of course you (should) know that is a strawman argument.

Originally Posted by Benjamin:
I don’t think other life is possible because I believe God is 100% Truth and has given us an account of the beginning of creation

What I am getting from this statement is that you say that if GOd had created it, he would have had to tell us about it, to tell 100% of the truth.

I suppose if you took that statement by its self you might be able to form that perception. But, I have been saying that God did tells how and why He created life and that what He has told us IS “truth” and must remain so, for God IS 100% Truth. As I have pointed to I see many problems with keeping His account of creation as being truth as other life does not relate to what we have been told is His purpose in creating it.

Well, God didn't tell us about a lot of things, He just lumped them in as a group. Bacterium, for instance.

Yet, God spoke of not touching dead things, washing hands and being clean. There are many hints in the Word that God not only knew how diseases began but that He told us ways to avoid them. I see no hints of the sort that other life could exist, do you? Again, I’m not saying it couldn’t, in fact, I’ve even said if it were to exist I expect that there would be ways to go back after such a discovery and explain it; I’m saying I don’t even see the possibility according to what we have been told in the Biblical account of creation for it to add up, as a matter of fact I have pointing to ways that couldn’t add up. (These claims have been avoided for arguments made from silence, nothing more.) This theory of other life existing elsewhere is what has simply been pulled out of the air; other than a belief in the "truth" of science, I have a problem with that, don't you?

They are just lumped in with the other animals. Just because God doesn't explicitly say that He created something, doesn't mean that He didn't.

On the same grounds nor does it prove they do exist.

And the point I’ve been making is that I see no way to “lump” in other forms of life on other planets and it adding up to what God has told us in His foundational plans and purposes of creation within the account of the “beginning” of creation He has given us (those made in His image and likeness). I’m not sure why so many are even so bent on trying to lump other life in to His creation, although I could speculate that the pastor I mentioned was on to something. :smilewinkgrin: Maybe, too much Star Trek fantasy to boot is a contributing factor? :tongue3:

After all, for Him to tell the "whole" truth, wouldn't He have had to explain things better?

No, that would be a false dilemma. God telling us truth does equate to telling us everything, it would be silly to even suggest we could understand everything, again, I made no such suggestion, but my point is that what He has told us IS “truth” and must remain so. I’ve asked several questions as to how the things He has told us could remain truth and related it to what we are told of the foundation and purposes of God, along with His character and yet add up to other life existing?

Light, for example. He just said that He created it. He didn't say how it worked, or what it was. He just said that He created it.

Taking that example, God explains to us the He made light and uses that to tell us in a complex way it brought forth life as part of His foundational plan. In His account of creation, in the beginning,... I've already made some unanswered claims to support my point reagrding that.

Now, I have already stated that I don't think sentient life will be found elsewhere. It's possible, but I think improbable due to God having to supply a seperate salvation plan, etc, for this other "race". However, I see no reason that other organisms (especially microscopic) couldn't have been created by God and placed on other planets, even other systems.

I’m glad you at least add that these possible existing organisms would have been created by God, at least shows some guts. :laugh: I think many in the world are out to enforce their argument that life didn’t have to come from God in such a discovery. Like I’ve said such a discovery would not shake my faith and conviction whatsoever and I’m sure it would not shake yours either, or shouldn’t. But, what I’ve continued to claim is that I don’t see any logical reason for it to exist elsewhere and have asked for one, I’ve also claimed that any other existing life would need to add up to the account of the beginning of creation (a “truth” God has given us) and have pointed out many difficulties in that other life could do so.

The fact of the matter is, that scripture is silent on the matter. And we don't have enough scientific evidence one way or the other to know. So, it's definitely not out of the question.

No, the fact of the matter is that God told us His purposes in creation (in truth) and we don’t in any way need scientific evidence to confirm or not what He has told us.

You’ve sorta just made my point that many seem to be in fear that science may disprove the Biblical account as we have been told and believe about creation based on what science might discover. I’ve also addressed that in this thread.

BTW, "Curiosity" is not the first rover we've had on Mars. It's the third. And we haven't found any evidence of life yet. But that's just one planet, in one system, in one galaxy, in the whole universe.

Well, I imagine this intriguing quest will never end and never be answered this side of heaven but it doesn’t change my view that it doesn’t add up to the Biblical account of creation, nor does vast infinite space change my opinion and won’t until these guys show up to my face and say otherwise:

 

[Benjamin]

nor does vast infinite space change my opinion and won’t...

BTW, 0 + 0 = 0 even if you keep adding up to nothing forever, ain't that right Quantumfaith? :wavey: :laugh:

 

[quantumfaith]

BTW, 0 + 0 = 0 even if you keep adding up to nothing forever, ain't that right Quantumfaith? :wavey: :laugh:

It depends on what your definition of "is" is?

Crude as it is, I rather "esoterically" as a mathematician like the "Drake Equation"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake_equation

 

[humblethinker]

I strongly doubt that there will be any sentient alien life form. Obviously none of the speculation of life they may discover includes hope for finding sentient life. 'Animalistic' life forms would be beyond hope to me as well. I can only think that they may hope to find some kind of bacterial life forms or remains. (In no way do I consider myself more than an observer with no field expertise in the subject... except that I know that I am alive )

Either way, I am in awe that we are there! In the event that we do find bacterial-like life or remains of such I will be surprised and impressed with God even more (does that make sense?). He is awesome and the more of His being and works I get to experience and understand the more I love him.