Covenant Theology

[Van]

Given that this is a prophecy, The "ye" that Ezekiel is talking to are the Jews. If you think that there will be no "tribe" in the future, who is it that will inherit the land and why does it say that this division will be according to the twelve tribes of Israel?

1) The you refers to those chosen by God regardless of bloodline

2) Those chosen by God will inherit the land.

3) One view is that Christ is from the tribe of Judah, and so as co-heirs with Christ, Romans 8:17, we will be among them. But since there is no difference, we also might be among the other believers who were blood line members of other tribes. However, since there are no tribes, the most likely understanding is God will divide us up according to His perfect plan. Bottom line, whatever the promised blessings bestowed upon the world by the Messiah, we will receive them because we are "in Christ."

 

[Yeshua1]

Given that this is a prophecy, The "ye" that Ezekiel is talking to are the Jews. If you think that there will be no "tribe" in the future, who is it that will inherit the land and why does it say that this division will be according to the twelve tribes of Israel?

seems that jewish persons fit the bill!

 

[Van]

Denial of Scripture

seems that jewish persons fit the bill!

If there is no difference between Jew and Gentile, why would there be Jewish persons? It is a question of logic. What would be different if there is no difference.

 

[Yeshua1]

If there is no difference between Jew and Gentile, why would there be Jewish persons? It is a question of logic. What would be different if there is no difference.

No difference in regards to salvation, BOTh saved by same Yeshua, but difference in how God views Isreal nationally and gentile nations!

 

[timf]

1) The you refers to those chosen by God regardless of bloodline

This is an interesting assertion. Ezekiel was talking to the nation of Judah (which also had the remnant of the other tribes as they had fled Israel).

2) Those chosen by God will inherit the land.

God chose Israel. The land was divided among Israel. This verse speaks of a future division specifically according to the twelve tribes of Israel.

However, since there are no tribes,

You have stated this repeatedly as an emphatic assumption. However, I do not see how you can support this in view of the verse that says the division will be according to tribes.

The disciples will judge the twelve tribes.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

There will be nations left at the end of the tribulation one of which will be Judah.

Zechariah 14:14 And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.

Zechariah 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

The intended role for the tribes of Jacob will be fulfilled.

Isaiah 49:6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

The tribes of Israel will serve in Jerusalem;

Ezekiel 48:19 And they that serve the city shall serve it out of all the tribes of Israel.

 

[Yeshua1]

This is an interesting assertion. Ezekiel was talking to the nation of Judah (which also had the remnant of the other tribes as they had fled Israel).



God chose Israel. The land was divided among Israel. This verse speaks of a future division specifically according to the twelve tribes of Israel.



You have stated this repeatedly as an emphatic assumption. However, I do not see how you can support this in view of the verse that says the division will be according to tribes.

The disciples will judge the twelve tribes.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

There will be nations left at the end of the tribulation one of which will be Judah.

Zechariah 14:14 And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.

Zechariah 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

The intended role for the tribes of Jacob will be fulfilled.

Isaiah 49:6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

The tribes of Israel will serve in Jerusalem;

Ezekiel 48:19 And they that serve the city shall serve it out of all the tribes of Israel.

van must hold to the "lost tribes of isreal" theory!

 

[Van]

No difference in regards to salvation, BOTh saved by same Yeshua, but difference in how God views Isreal nationally and gentile nations!

Yet another example of claiming the Bible does not mean what it says. We are one in Christ. God is no respecter of persons, meaning he does not use the world's value system, all his children will receive the same blessings for we are one in Christ.

Question: Do these two Baptists reflect actual Baptist support for tribalism. Does no one else know that Christ torn down the wall separating Jews and Gentiles? This is amazing.

 

[Van]

This is an interesting assertion. Ezekiel was talking to the nation of Judah (which also had the remnant of the other tribes as they had fled Israel).

This section of the book refers to end times, and so envisioned the Messiah's return. Every born again believe is co-heir with Jesus.

God chose Israel. The land was divided among Israel. This verse speaks of a future division specifically according to the twelve tribes of Israel.

And Romans says we will be grafted into the branches of the natural tree.

You have stated this repeatedly as an emphatic assumption. However, I do not see how you can support this in view of the verse that says the division will be according to tribes.

We are one in Christ, one does not equal twelve.

The disciples will judge the twelve tribes.

Very true, however will they judge them individually or collectively.

There will be nations left at the end of the tribulation one of which will be Judah.

Zechariah 14:14 And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.

All born again believers are co-heirs with the Lion of Judah.

The intended role for the tribes of Jacob will be fulfilled.

Isaiah 49:6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

This verse supports my view that those who think tribally hold too small a view.

The tribes of Israel will serve in Jerusalem;

Ezekiel 48:19 And they that serve the city shall serve it out of all the tribes of Israel.

Again, this verse teaches that the workers, some from every tribe, will cultivate the farm land. So again, the idea is a collective, since we are one in Christ, Jews and Gentiles.

Bottom line, the New Covenant torn down the wall between Jews and Gentiles, and between various tribes, for we are all co-heirs with Christ, and are one in Christ, and in Christ there is no difference between Jew and Gentile. This truth has been a stumbling block for the Jews.

 

[thomas15]

Yet another example of claiming the Bible does not mean what it says. We are one in Christ. God is no respecter of persons, meaning he does not use the world's value system, all his children will receive the same blessings for we are one in Christ.

So then using your logic we can conclude that there is no difference between born again males and females and as such same sex marrage between believers is biblically acceptable?

 

[Van]

Not to put too fine a point on it but did you not just castigate some KJVO folks as misrepresenting the views of others? The world's value system says homosexual behavior is appropriate, but that is not what the Bible says. Many Christians accept the equality of men and women, vice Islam, but because of our physical differences, i.e. men cannot nurse babies, our roles in the home differ. And of course, today there is a debate concerning whether the Bible's teachings concerning the "place" of women was a cultural accommodation, rather than a timeless directive of God.

Tribalism infects many cultures, the we/them attitude that treats others differently than we treat those like ourselves. Christianity says all men, in Christ, are brothers. Adherence to such views helped end slavery. I have a dream today, that one day my children will walk hand in hand with children of different colors, and where folks, male and female are judged based on the content of their character rather than the color of skin or genetic legacy.