Death Penalty for Children?

[av1611jim]

Tough call for me.
I think what is the telling factor in this case is Diane's comment.
"I wanted to" was the kids reason for doing it.

If this is in fact the case, hang him high. In public. Maybe the other brats in this nation will think twice before they try their own brand of evil. This nation lets their thin-skinned emotions rule out over rational and Biblical thought way too much.

In His service;
Jim

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Perhaps it is my "thin skinned emotions" but I don't see any Biblical injunction that allows us to kill a child. How young do you go? If a six year old kills a four year old with a rock and says "cause I wanted to" do we execute him as well?

Perhaps imprison him under a death sentence until he is an adult, then review the case.

I guess it is all those many years of working with kids that is influencing my rationale.

 

[following-Him]

I am really saddened by the responses in this thread. What kind of impression are we giving to those who might visit this board? Where is the love of Jesus and His spirit of forgiveness? This young lad has committed a most dreadful crime, I understand that. The little girl cannot be brought back. To execute this youngster is societies' final rejection of him. We know little of him, or his upbringing yet we are so quick to condemn him. Is this what Jesus would have done? And what about his parents? and the victim's parents? Would the victim's parents really want the death penalty? Haven't both sets of parents suffered enough already? If I didn't know any different I would say I was participating in a secular rather than a Christian board. If our Lord Jesus died on the cross for our sins, then he died for ALL our sins. It seems to me that there are those here who are eager to take God's place in judging some people.

Sheila

 

[Ben W]

Unfortunatly Shelia we have lost alot of our compassion as Christians. So many horrible things happen in the world it becomes our response to react in the same manner.

A 12 year old should not be given the death penalty. If we apply the Old Testament to justify his death, we have to base it on the age of accountability which is 13.

He should be punished that is for sure, yet we should not be giving the death penalty to a child.

 

[dianetavegia]

The girl's parents are suffering terribly. They were questioned this past week (trial is set to begin) and said they are heart broken that the MOST this boy can receive is 4 years in a local juvenile facility. Most probably he'll serve 2 years. At 18, this will be removed from his record.

The boy was no longer in public school. He'd been permanently expelled and the parents were supposedly home schooling him but neighbors said he wandered around all day while parents worked.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Incarcerate him until he is 18, then review his case.

 

[following-Him]

Feelings still run high, and quite understandably, over the James Bulger case over here and the fact that his killers, aged about 10 and 11 at the time are now free with new identities.

I think that they, like this young lad should be put away for a very long time, but I can't agree with the death penalty.

Sheila

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by C4K:
Perhaps it is my "thin skinned emotions" but I don't see any Biblical injunction that allows us to kill a child. How young do you go? If a six year old kills a four year old with a rock and says "cause I wanted to" do we execute him as well?

Perhaps imprison him under a death sentence until he is an adult, then review the case.

I guess it is all those many years of working with kids that is influencing my rationale.

Yes , of course he should be executed. I think you have been in Europe too long...

Joseph Botwinick

 

[following-Him]

Joseph posted:

Yes , of course he should be executed. I think you have been in Europe too long...

Joseph, life isn't as black and white as you seem to think. What if it were a child of yours who committed such an horrendous crime?

This boy is only about 12 going on 13. Maybe with maturing he will come to better understand the seriousness of his actions and repent of what he has done.

Sheila

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by followinghim:
I am really saddened by the responses in this thread. What kind of impression are we giving to those who might visit this board? Where is the love of Jesus and His spirit of forgiveness? This young lad has committed a most dreadful crime, I understand that. The little girl cannot be brought back. To execute this youngster is societies' final rejection of him. We know little of him, or his upbringing yet we are so quick to condemn him. Is this what Jesus would have done? And what about his parents? and the victim's parents? Would the victim's parents really want the death penalty? Haven't both sets of parents suffered enough already? If I didn't know any different I would say I was participating in a secular rather than a Christian board. If our Lord Jesus died on the cross for our sins, then he died for ALL our sins. It seems to me that there are those here who are eager to take God's place in judging some people.

Sheila

Where is your compassion for the 8 year old girl? What about her family? Youu are more concerned about the murderer than you are about the victim. Yes, I am afraid people will get the wrong idea about Christians if they come here: that they are a bunch of weaklings who are soft on crime. You have blatantly used a bunch of amotional arguments to defame and flame those of us on the other side of an issue. Just because we have a different opinion than you doesn't make us heartless or without compassion. Don't go down that road. Again, let's see if you can rationally put together a logical response to this statement:

Why not? He committed murder. He deserves to die for his crime. The family deserves justice for that little girl they will never see again. The little girl deserves justice for all the days she will never spend here on earth. She deserves justice for the brutal way she was murdered. The murderers age makes them no less of a murderer.
Can you answer that question without defaming those of us on the other side of the issue? Stop your flaming and put forth a logical argument. If you want to go down the emotional argument route, I would say that you are the one without any compassion for the girl and her family. Nowhere in your response did their suffering even come into play as a factor in your decision.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by Ben W:
Unfortunatly Shelia we have lost alot of our compassion as Christians. So many horrible things happen in the world it becomes our response to react in the same manner.

A 12 year old should not be given the death penalty. If we apply the Old Testament to justify his death, we have to base it on the age of accountability which is 13.

He should be punished that is for sure, yet we should not be giving the death penalty to a child.

Is he a murderer or not? Please show me where in the Bible (OT or NT) is says that we should wait until 13 to hold someone responsible for murder. As I told Sheila, if you want to brand me as heartless for wanting justice for the girl and her family, then I can turn that same illogical, emotional argument back on you and label you as lacking compassion toward the girl and her family. They deserve justice more than the murderer deserves to live.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by followinghim:
Joseph posted: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Yes , of course he should be executed. I think you have been in Europe too long...

Joseph, life isn't as black and white as you seem to think. What if it were a child of yours who committed such an horrendous crime?

This boy is only about 12 going on 13. Maybe with maturing he will come to better understand the seriousness of his actions and repent of what he has done.

Sheila </font>[/QUOTE]I would grieve for him terribly, but I would not obstruct justice. I realize that nothing is black and white in Europe except for the idea that America is evil.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[following-Him]

Joseph,

To begin with, I am perfectly calm and not flaming at all, and I am sorry if my posts come across as such to you.

I have every sympathy for this young's girls parents and family. They too have been dealt a life sentence. This will never leave them for as long as they live.

No, I cannot justify the death penalty being carried out on a child. What do the girl's parents want? Do they want to see this boys parents lose a son through execution?
This little girl cannot be brought back. This evil deed has been done, but how as Christians can we be so hard hearted?

Joseph, what do you think Jesus would have us do in this situation?

Sheila

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by followinghim:
Joseph,

To begin with, I am perfectly calm and not flaming at all, and I am sorry if my posts come across as such to you.

I have every sympathy for this young's parents and family. They too have been dealt a life sentence. This will never leave them for as long as they live.

No, I cannot justify the death penalty being carried out on a child. What do the girl's parents want? Do they want to see this boys parents lose a son through execution?
This little girl cannot be brought back. This evil deed has been done, but how as Christians can we be so hard hearted?

Joseph, what do you think Jesus would have us do in this situation?

Sheila

I believe he would give the boy the death penalty after he shared the Word of God with him.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by followinghim:
Joseph,

I have every sympathy for this young's parents and family. They too have been dealt a life sentence. This will never leave them for as long as they live.
Sheila

Actually, the girl was given a DEATH SENTENCE. She was MURDERED.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

There is no lack of compassion for the eight year old here Joseph. There is a compassion which extends to both children involved.

There was no flaming on Sheila's part. It was an honest statement. How can you judge that she is more concerned for the killer than the child killed?

 

[following-Him]

Joseph,

Well, I disagree with you on this point, because Jesus came to save lives, not destroy them.

Also:

I realize that nothing is black and white in Europe except for the idea that America is evil.

I have never posted any view with regard to America or Americans to this effect, so I would be grateful if you would not include me in your broad generalisations.

Sheila

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

I found nowhere in her original statement where she was more concerned about the suffering of the victim and her family than she was about saving the life of a murderer who victimized them. That doesn't show much compassion to me. And her insinuation that those of us who believe the child should recieve the penalty for murder makes us without compassion was a flame based solely on emotion and was completely defammatory.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by followinghim:
Joseph,

To begin with, I am perfectly calm and not flaming at all, and I am sorry if my posts come across as such to you.

I have every sympathy for this young's parents and family. They too have been dealt a life sentence. This will never leave them for as long as they live.

No, I cannot justify the death penalty being carried out on a child. What do the girl's parents want? Do they want to see this boys parents lose a son through execution?
This little girl cannot be brought back. This evil deed has been done, but how as Christians can we be so hard hearted?

Joseph, what do you think Jesus would have us do in this situation?

Sheila

I believe he would give the boy the death penalty after he shared the Word of God with him.

Joseph Botwinick </font>[/QUOTE]I honestly cannot, in the furthest stretch of my imagination, imagine Jesus calling for this child to be executed.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by followinghim:
Joseph,

Well, I disagree with you on this point, because Jesus came to save lives, not destroy them.


Sheila

Shelia,

Do you believe Jesus is God?

Joseph Botwinick